Front Crank Seal Help .... and show and tell of what the dealer did

[CUMMINSDIESELPWR]

the sleeve i didnt use a 2x4. and i dont suggest using a 2x4. the sleeve will best go on one way and basically gently tap it in a

circle to seat it.  using a 2x4 will get it off center and ruin it etc etc. it took me about 25-30 minutes of gently tapping it on the crank all the way till its flush on the front. then install front seal onto cover and install cover.

iirc the speedy sleeve will have a beveled side and that side goes on first then gently tap it in

circles to seat. if it doesnt go on just a tad at first by hand, flip it over and try to push it on by hand, it should start itself slightly on its own.

 

oh and locktite on the speedy sleeve, never heard it. its a interference fit (sleeve fits tight on its own) and i have over 3-4000 miles on my rebuild no issues. Also the damper will keep it from walking forward. I highly doubt the steel on steel friction fit will come loose due to the slight friction of the seal.

 

zoom in on the crank and you will see the thickness of the speedy sleeve. it was about 1/8" thick. the shop installed a speedy sleeve that was paper thin and i removed it and installed the

cummins thicker speedy sleeve with matching seal. i also recommend test fitting the seal onto the speedy sleeve before hand to ensure it all is properly fitting then install everything. "measure twice cut once thing"

Edited April 6, 2016 by CUMMINSDIESELPWR

[Mopar1973Man]

It would help a bunch to make sure there is no debris or high spots in the crank. Like your little dings in the tip I would take a machine file and knock them down a bit. Take some emery cloth and "lightly" sand the crank where the sleeve is going. This just makes sure there is no residue or damaged metal to hang up your installation. 

[CUMMINSDIESELPWR]

found this and it might help you, they make a sleeve install tool! i installed with hammer as my crank was sitting on the workbench.

 

 

Edited April 6, 2016 by CUMMINSDIESELPWR

[Wild and Free]

Most speedy sleeves come with the install tool which basically consists of a stainless steel cup that is what you pound on.

[CUMMINSDIESELPWR]

4 hours ago, Wild and Free said:

Most speedy sleeves come with the install tool which basically consists of a stainless steel cup that is what you pound on.

mine didnt, thus why i tapped gently to seat it without ruining it. went well actually, but i do recommend the tool if possible.

[bms231]

I love all you guys.  Seriously.  Sooooooooooo helpful! 

 

I am going to the dealer today.  Of course they stopped talking to me.  I will keep you posted if I get my money back or go file in small claims. 

 

I will also keep you posted on the build.  Still waiting for parts in the mail.

[JAG1]

Be careful out there when getting engine service. Thinking back since I started driving at 16 (in 1967) there has only been about 1 or 2 shops that really did an honest job on engine work. The rest of them did not care a dam and some were like crooks I'm sorry to say.

 

  All the shops were recommended too

[Mopar1973Man]

On reason I do my own work on my vehicles. I know JAG1 will NOT recommend me to work on anything. I'm too slow, dropping bolts in the intercooler, drinking beer on the job.

[JAG1]

 Now Mike you'll loose business that way... You know that's not true.... that was me with the beer and dropping bolts in an odd place. I remember you having a real tissey fit over not being able to find that bolt till you looked in there. LOL.

[Mopar1973Man]

I love getting you wound up first thing in the morning... 

[Wild and Free]

This is a perfect example of why paying with a CC in certain instances would have gotten your money back on a contested service as you have all the evidence against the dealer on a screw up and then some.

[Mopar1973Man]

Better yet. Do it yourself save on the labor charges and have the satisfaction of knowing it was done right.

[TFaoro]

16 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Better yet. Do it yourself save on the labor charges and have the satisfaction of knowing it was done right.

YUP! Come to this site, and ask for help. I can't think of anything someone you couldn't get help with. Everyone here has a wealth of knowledge and are willing to share it with those who ask.

[Hawkez]

31 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Better yet. Do it yourself save on the labor charges and have the satisfaction of knowing it was done right.

If everyone did it themselves wouldn't that put you out of a job?

 

I'd much rather do my own work as well, but I don't have the skills that most on this site posses.  But I always look forward to doing something new.  I have met many people over the years that can't wrap their heads around doing mechanical work, yet they are some of the smartest people I know.  Rather than throwing all vehicle mechanics in the same group, it would be better to do some research and understand who is honest and experienced vs those that aren't.  Their are some on this site that make their money fixing other people's cars.  I'm sure even as good as they are, they have made mistakes and misdiagnosed problems.  I think how these issues are resolved is where good vs bad really shines.

[Wild and Free]

As far as installing the speedy sleeve and fixing the gouges on the crank use a fine file to take the heavy burs off then use a 220 grit emery cloth to smooth it up best you can and then use an aviation gasket sealer or form a gasket as it stays pliable and fills in the imperfections in the crank to help it seal. I put a light coating on the crank and a bit inside the sleeve and install the sleeve and then clean it up really well to make sure there is no excess sealer that will get on the seal.

CR brand crank seal speedy sleave kits are the ones I have always used that always come with the sleeve install tool.

I saw a post earlier referencing a depth for the seal, this is due to a couple of things, some seals come with a dust or dirt sleeve that go on in between the seal and damper plus the damper has a slight lip on it too, just make sure it is at least flush with the front cover after install and you should be good.

[bms231]

7 hours ago, Wild and Free said:

 

This is a perfect example of why paying with a CC in certain instances would have gotten your money back on a contested service as you have all the evidence against the dealer on a screw up and then some.

 

 

First question... where the hell does a barring tool go on an automatic?  i thought it went in the front of the crank, but apparently not.  Am I supposed to remove something on the transmission?

 

 

For the CC stuff....

 

I definitely did that, but going through the CC company they contact the Dealer and the dealer goes "nope we did what we were supposed to" and the CC company denies the claim.

 

 

Update on what the service manager said....

 

I went down there today and instantly the service manager goes "nope wont cover ur radiator" and "we will get back to you tomorrow."  He was talking about how he knew Jared (the tech) for 20 years and this just isn't something he would do. 

 

GET THIS CRAP TOO.... I get a near 50% discount on parts at one dodge dealer.  I bought my parts there and brought my truck to this particular dealership.  The service tech said it wouldn't affect my warranty using OEM parts from another dealer.  The service manager said... nope sorry that is wrong.  It is our policy if the seal fails day 1 and you don't buy the parts from us you are SOL on labor.  BULL!  Looks like we go to court.

btw... i was going to use some of this between the crank and speedi sleeve, but from everything i am reading i am going to put it on dry.

 

thanks for being so patient with me. when you dont know, this stuff is scary.

 

[Wild and Free]

What do you need a barring tool for doing a front crank seal but anyhow if you have one the opening is on the passenger side on the front side of the rear engine cover, there is a small cover over the hole.

 

Absolutely DO NOT PUT THE SLEEVE ON DRY IF THERE ARE ANY NICKS ON THE CRANK IT WILL CAUSE A PLACE FOR OIL TO SEEP THROUGH YOU NEED SOMETHING TO FILL THE IMPERFECTIONS..

 

That Loctite product is a retaining compound you need more of a sealant that will stay flexible like I originally posted.

 

You have pictoral proof of the crappy workmanship the CC company should have not even thought twice about denying this claim, get a second opinion or talk to a cc manager.

[bms231]

3 hours ago, Wild and Free said:

What do you need a barring tool for doing a front crank seal but anyhow if you have one the opening is on the passenger side on the front side of the rear engine cover, there is a small cover over the hole.

 

Absolutely DO NOT PUT THE SLEEVE ON DRY IF THERE ARE ANY NICKS ON THE CRANK IT WILL CAUSE A PLACE FOR OIL TO SEEP THROUGH YOU NEED SOMETHING TO FILL THE IMPERFECTIONS..

 

That Loctite product is a retaining compound you need more of a sealant that will stay flexible like I originally posted.

 

You have pictoral proof of the crappy workmanship the CC company should have not even thought twice about denying this claim, get a second opinion or talk to a cc manager.

 

 

Was going to use it to stop the crank from turning when i tightened on the flywheel.  It was a PITA to remove the bolts.  Must have turned over the engine a few times.

 

I got some loctite 620 which is a liquid and fills gaps up to .015 vs .007 of the stuff i posted. 

 

 

QUESTION........

 

my speedy sleeve has no angled bevel on the outside of one side like there is on the video.  it actually has an angled bevel on the INSIDE of one side.  this goes on first correct?  i assume to assist it sliding onto the crank.  otherwise it would leave a gap at the front of the crank if it went on facing away from the gear cover. 

 

 

 

That bevel is on the INSIDE of the sleeve and only on one side.

 

I assume this is how you use the tool to pound on the sleeve

 

how the heck do u use this tool to seat the seal to the right dept from the rear of the timing cover w/o removing the plastic guide?  i dont want to screw up the seal.  i mean are you supposed to use this thing to drive the seal into the cover?  it won't really fit through the front and either way you have to remove the plastic guide which i was told never to do.

 

 

 

Edited April 7, 2016 by bms231

[Mopar1973Man]

Use the tool to install the seal into the gear case cover while its off the gear case. Now place the plastic guide back in the seal. Now slide the plastic guide and the gear case cover back on at the same time. Once in place now pull the plastic guide back out.

 

Speedy sleeve is installed before putting the case cover back on.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[Wild and Free]

Mike answered part of your question, I usually lay the cover on a board in the spot the seal goes so it doesn't flex when pounding the seal in and you got it correct on the way the sleeve goes on. Sorry brain fart on my end about keeping the engine from turning while tightening or loosening the damper bolts.