Trouble Starting Engine - HELP

[RAD]

MM suggested I post up after speaking with him on the telephone yesterday afternoon.

this all started after some cold weather here. leaving work one day and just died on me a few times, hard to start and then finally nothing.

 

here goes

working on a 1999 2500 5.9 l . it is hi-line w/auto transmission. key fobs never worked for me.

trouble is it is very very hard to start. finally got it to run yesterday, let it run for about 5 minutes and turned it off. it didn’t want to start again.

then when turning the key to start and run position, no lift pump noise.

i waited 30 minutes and cycled the key again and heard the lift pump running. 

wait to start light come on immediately for about 2 seconds then goes off. grid heater are not hooked up at this time

 

before I have let it run till it warmed and shifted the gears and/or gave it some fuel and just dies.

 

batteries are at full charge, 13.9v from alternator. I did have the alt. checked. checked out fine. mm suggested to take it out and have it checked again for bad diodes

new rebuilt starter

refreshed/rebuilt ecm

new tpps

IP been in it just at two years (blue chip diesel - stock)

lift pump in it just at 2.5 years (airtex)

have not replaced sealing washers at back of the head. going to do that later today as long as Michael doesn’t dump water on me.

 

going to get a better fuel pressure gauge today and check that, again. was checking it with a HF pressure testing kit.

 

all cable ends have been replaced, new military style battery clamps.     have not combined grounds to block, yet.

Edited October 10, 2018 by RAD

[dripley]

Any trouble codes?

[Mopar1973Man]

24 minutes ago, RAD said:

have not replaced sealing washers at back of the head

 

Trick. When you get the banjo bolt out and set up with the first washer. Now insert the banjo bolt back into the banjo fitting. Now push the fuel return line towards the firewall this will trap the bolt from falling out now you can install the second sealing washer. Now you can screw it back into the head.

[RAD]

1 hour ago, dripley said:

Any trouble codes?

no trouble codes at all

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

......Now push the fuel return line towards the firewall this will trap the bolt from .....

[dripley]

Bare with me, no ill intent meant. Did check with a scanner?

 

At key on you should get just a a second or so of lift pump run. If you bump the starter, no engine start, it should run for 20seconds or so. 

 

Where did the rebuilt ECM come from and how long has it been on the truck?

 

What kind of fuel pressure are seeing with gauge you have? Airtex is not one of better pumps.

 

Micheal is bringing me water like or not. Working just west of Columbia SC and it is headed right at us.

 

I should add that the lift pump running as I stated above will only be that way if it is if it is connected thru the ECM. If it is just wired to keyed hot it will run all the time the key is. Not a good thing if you have wreck. The pump will just keep running till you turn it off. The ECM will do that automatically if it is in control. 

Edited October 10, 2018 by dripley

[RAD]

On 10/10/2018 at 3:02 PM, dripley said:

I did check it with a obd2 scanner, with enhanced search. (PCM??) Wish I had one of those smarty things. Don’t know if it would show more???

 

The bump starter worked, but once I turned it off, no lift pump noise.

 

going to check fuel pressure later on with a better with a fuel pressure tester. Will post up what I see.

ECM was done back in March or April of this year.  I will find my receipt. it was auto computer specialist in south Florida/ ft Lauderdale area. 

Edited January 26, 2019 by JAG1

[dripley]

40 minutes ago, RAD said:

 

The bump starter worked, but once I turned it off, no lift pump noise.

 

going to check fuel pressure later on with a better with a fuel pressure tester. Will post up what I see.

 

evm was done back in March or April of this year.  I will find my receipt. it was auto computer specialist in south Florida/ ft Lauderdale area. 

OBD II is fine for checking. You dont have to have smarty for that purpose.

 

Did you install the airtex and know how it is wired? 

 

I would check the FP sooner rather than later that could a large part of your problem. Then again maybe not, you wont know until you check. If it is shot you are just shortening the life of that high dollar VP. I have one myself.

 

ACS does seem to have a decent rep on ECM's.

[RAD]

I installed the airtex, wire/plugged into wiring harness. Want to get a FASS DDRP. That should work.

 

I changed the sealing washer(relatively easy).

 

Got good overnight charge on it,  It cranked on up with just a little hiccup. Ran for a bit went through the gears, was backing it up about 20’ and died again. No LP sound. Let it sit, checked PDC relays, seemed kind of warm. Swapped out fuel relay with another and turned key on, LP sound.swapped them back to original, LP sound. Wouldn’t crank again. Batteries were down to 12.6. 

Both batteries are relatively new.

 

???????

 

keep an eye on the weather!!

Sun came out here in LA!!

[Marcus2000monster]

Have you checked battery cranking amps? Found out what FP is? Change fuel filter? 

[dave110]

I agree with @Marcus2000monsteron FP and filter. Don't know if Airtex has its own return to tank or not? If you're heating up an blowing relays that pump is working hard. Pushing up against a plugged filter would do that. So it trickles a bit of fuel through the filter until the truck starts and runs then pops the relay. The VP44's little internal pump can't suck enough through the plugged filter  and the truck shuts off. It's gotta be fuel related. Nothing else kills a diesel. And I'm thinking mechanical fuel related because if it were electrical, ie ECM, PSG, CKP senor etc. you should have a code or 3. It's easy to look at the filter. And get a FP gauge on there ASAP. My $.02

[RAD]

No on the cranking amps, will read up on that in just a bit.

No fuel pressure yet, going to get one Thursday.

Filter was changed the day after all this happened back in February. Was clean from when it was changed previously. 

Will do dave110. Will post up what I find Thursday evening.

[dripley]

1 hour ago, RAD said:

I installed the airtex, wire/plugged into wiring harness. Want to get a FASS DDRP. That should work.

 

I changed the sealing washer(relatively easy).

 

Got good overnight charge on it,  It cranked on up with just a little hiccup. Ran for a bit went through the gears, was backing it up about 20’ and died again. No LP sound. Let it sit, checked PDC relays, seemed kind of warm. Swapped out fuel relay with another and turned key on, LP sound.swapped them back to original, LP sound. Wouldn’t crank again. Batteries were down to 12.6. 

Both batteries are relatively new.

 

???????

 

keep an eye on the weather!!

Sun came out here in LA!!

I did not know an airtex came ready to plug into the stock pig tail. Or did you make something to do that with? Is set up thru a relay or is the pig tail the power source for the pump? The reason I ask is that getting that 12v off of the ECM is best for the life of the ECM. The full AD and FASS system use a relay and the ECM pig tail just provides a trigger for the relay and you get 12v power from elsewhere, battery, alternator or have you. The ddrp is a step but a full Fass or AD or mechanical pump would be the best. That part is up to you. 

 

FYI on the fuel relay, it is for the vp and not the lift pump. That is another draw back to the stock pigtail for the lift pump. No fuse, nothing to protect the ECM.

 

12.6 volts in batteries should start the engine just fine. 

 

Sun came out here about 2pm and made it freaking miserable. Storms seems to be tracking North for now and not as much North East. Might get spared a little.

 

I would have to agree that this does sound fuel related.

[RAD]

I do not remember making anything up to plug the airtex into.   Just bolted it to the bracket and plugged it in. Will check installation instructions.

 

charging it now, will hook the fp guage up Thursday, and start it and check things out.

[dave110]

33 minutes ago, dripley said:

 

FYI on the fuel relay, it is for the vp and not the lift pump. That is another draw back to the stock pigtail for the lift pump. No fuse, nothing to protect the ECM.

 

Agreed. I was thinking lift pump relay.

33 minutes ago, dripley said:

 The reason I ask is that getting that 12v off of the ECM is best for the life of the ECM.

I believe you meant NOT best for the ECM

 

Edited October 11, 2018 by dave110

[dripley]

Do you have a lift pump relay?

[RAD]

This is the one I have.

[dripley]

Now I see. It just plugs into the ECM pig tail. That means it is getting its 12v thru the ECM. it is been shown over the years that puts undue stress on the ECM. The full AD and FASS systems use a relay and an indepedant 12v supply to take the load off of the ECM. The stock pig tail is used only for trigger to engage the relay. Much better for the ECM. 

 If the pump is failing it would putting more stress on the ECM. All the more reason the find out what your fue pressure is.

[dave110]

So you don't have a lift pump relay. That's one of those that plugs into the factory plug directly. Well, that kills my theory. Yeah, still find out the FP though. I see you have a 99. There's 2 brass plugs on top of the filter housing. You can put an 1/8" NPT liquid filled hydraulic gauge in the on giong to the VP and it will show you accurate pressure if you don't have $$ for a gauge setup right now. I ran like that for a while. Dripley and I were typing at the same time. He's faster.

Edited October 11, 2018 by dave110

[Marcus2000monster]

His may have been asked but did you scan the truck with a good quality scanner?

[dripley]

36 minutes ago, dave110 said:

I believe you meant NOT best for the ECM

 

You are correct. Sometimes i type to fast.