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04Mach1

Started another inframe today

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This engine has cylinders 1,2, and 5 showing scoring in the liners and piston skirts from what I can tell from the limited inspection done with the oil pan off. Customers complaint was it uses a gallon of oil every 400 miles and a lot of blow-by. This engine has 1.4 million miles on it.

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Edited by 04Mach1
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2 hours ago, Dieselfuture said:

So a complete rebuild, head and all ?

New cylinder packs, new rod and main bearings, new head, and all new gaskets. Going to have injectors tested so maybe a six pack of new injectors also. Im sure I'll find more once I start disassembly of the over head today. All parts will be genuine Cummins because a 2 year unlimited mileage warranty comes with the parts.

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Well got the engine disassembled. All I have left is to pull the liners. Found out the source of blow-by was all the top piston rings on every cylinder were broken in multiple pieces caused by dirt ingestion. Rod bearings had some scratches from the dirt but so far the crank is measuring out within spec and there are no scratches in the rod journals of the crank. I'll get the liners pulled on Monday and clean the block with a solvent gun then as I'm rolling in the new main bearings I'll inspect the main journals on the crank. I'm hoping the crank has no damage otherwise the engine build becomes an out of frame build if the crank needs replaced. 

 

Its got that lovely internal engine soot cake that's typical of an EGR Cummins. I'll be scrubbing soot stain out of my hands and wrists for a couple of weeks at least. Not even nitrile gloves keep this soot loaded oil off the skin. It's always had Delo 400 and the oil that was in the engine had about 2,000 miles on it according to the customer.

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13 minutes ago, Killer223 said:

in it for more pics!!! take a lot we love em.

 

:lol:... Will definitely post up some more pics especially going back together. Problem is I'm running out of room to upload any more pics on here. 

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Just now, 04Mach1 said:

 

:lol:... Will definitely post up some more pics especially going back together. Problem is I'm running out of room to upload any more pics on here. 

get an imgur account.

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26 minutes ago, Killer223 said:

get an imgur account.

 

Done. Thanks I didn't think of that.

 

Anyway here are some more. This one is after a pulled both cam gears.

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This one is right before I pulled the injector cam and valve cam. No electronic injectors in the CM871 ISX.

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I haven't taken too many coming apart but I be sure to post a lot of it going back together.

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Dang! That is one monster of a complicated engine. I could do an inframe on a small cam/big cam 400 (855) in 20 hours. Plus I could lift the heads off by hand. Three recon heads were about $600, I bet a recon head for that is $3k. I bet that thing will take 40-60 hours. 

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3 hours ago, NIsaacs said:

 I bet that thing will take 40-60 hours. 

I would assume every bit of that.

 

with 1.4 mil. On the clock, It will be interesting if the truck is a good candidate for an inframe, or maybe an out of frame rebuild. 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, NIsaacs said:

Dang! That is one monster of a complicated engine. I could do an inframe on a small cam/big cam 400 (855) in 20 hours. Plus I could lift the heads off by hand. Three recon heads were about $600, I bet a recon head for that is $3k. I bet that thing will take 40-60 hours. 

I'm into this 2004 ISX for 12 hours so far. I quoted SRT of 45 hours. Parts alone for this inframe are at $16,000. The ISX isn't too bad for complexity, the worst engines now for complexity are the Daimler - Benz built Detroit Diesel DD engines or the International Crappforce (Maxxforce) 13 engines. 

@NIsaacsSince you mentioned the 855... Have you ever had slobbering issues on a 855. I've been battling one for about a year thats slobbering fuel from 5 and 6 only. I've rebuilt those 2 cylinders with new pistons, rings, head, and injectors. I've checked the timing over and over and over again, timing is good. We've even had Cummins work on it a few times and the slobbering continues. Engine runs good but it's annoying seeing oily crap dripping out of the downpipe where it connects to the flex pipe.

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45 hours sounds like a good turnaround time, good for you! I haven't built a 855 in 30 years, all my time on them was in the 70's and 80's. Since you have done everything, the only thing that comes to mind is a flat cam. I can't remember if you can get the timing right with one flat or not.

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Well I still forgot to get piston pictures. I did take some of the liners and counter bores before block and deck cleaning. I got the block clean already just waiting on Cummins for the kit so I can roll in the new main bearings, check the counter bores by temporarily seating the new liners, and assemble the engine.

 

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Some more pics. Still looking for the source of dirt ingestion that caused the broken rings. Still waiting on parts. Been still keeping busy while the inframe sits. Did a 6 pack injector replace on a Detroit Series 60, EGR cooler on a Detroit DD15, and a EGR / DPF delete on a Ford 6.7.

 

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Well I've got some of the ISX parts in but Cummins is telling us that main bearings, rod bearings, and pistons are backordered with no ETA of availability...

 

Now the fun begins. A regular customer of mine thought the turbo went out on his 6NZ Cat C15 yesterday because he started getting a ton of white / gray smoke out of the stacks of his 2002 KW W900L. I inspected the engine and found fuel in the coolant and coolant in the oil. Turbo is still good. I pulled all 6 injectors and found the injector cups leaking on cylinder 1 a little and cylinder 4 leaking horribly. On the suggestion of a mechanic friend that is very experienced with Cat engines and owns a shop in Gallup I replaced the injectors cups on all 6 cylinders. Pressured up the cooling system and still have a ferocious leak on cylinder 4. Well I believe it's most likely be a cracked head now. I let my customer know we are at the least looking at a head but the engine has never been apart further than the valve covers and has nearly 1.3 million miles so maybe an inframe. So I'll pull the head on the Cat tomorrow and will most likely have a Cat inframe going at the same time as the Cummins. Good money but stressful.

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7 hours ago, 04Mach1 said:

Good money but stressful

That's just it, where does a guy draw a line. I guess things need to be done so we don't, we just keep plugging away. Part of life heh

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I started tearing the Cat down today but had a pusher RV with an ISL that was running hot pulling hills. I ended up pulling the radiator and CAC and power washed the exterior of the cores that was packed full of dirt inhibiting air flow through the cores.

 

Anyway I talked to the customer and he is pretty much decided he wants to do an inframe since it's got about 1.3 million on the clock. I'll most likely be using a CAT platinum kit which consists of:

 

Pistons
Piston Rings
Wrist Pins
Cylinder Liners
Connecting Rods (reman)
Main Bearings
Rod Bearings 

Reman Oil Pump

Oil Cooler

Reman Water Pump
Reman Injectors
Reman cylinder head

Liner seals 
Head gasket set
Oil pan gasket
Fuel injection gasket kits
Exhaust manifold sleeves
Oil pan isolator assemblies
Exhaust manifold high temperature studs
Thermostats
Valve cover gear seat
Advanced efficiency oil filters
Advanced efficiency fuel filter
Lock nuts (3/8-16-THD)

 

Total out the door will be around $23,000 out the door to inframe the 6NZ Cat C15.

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The owner should be able to soak up that cost within a year, depending on how the truck is worked and the shape the rest of truck is in

Does that price include turbo or radiator or anything else that may need replaced while your at it

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1 hour ago, 01cummins4ever said:

The owner should be able to soak up that cost within a year, depending on how the truck is worked and the shape the rest of truck is in

Does that price include turbo or radiator or anything else that may need replaced while your at it

That price should have the Cat purring good again. Turbo was replaced about a year ago and is still in great shape. The radiator seems ok too. I will have to re-hose the truck though because the fuel that got into the cooling system made all the hoses spongy.

 

Truck is still in decent shape. It could use a new drivers seat but otherwise no real issues other than the engine. It's a 2002 KW W900L that hauls propane in Texas, New Mexico, Colorado, Utah, and Arizona.

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More pics... Took me darn near 6 hours to get the 26 head bolts out due to rust and corrosion. Not even my 1" IR impact was breaking them loose. It took a torque multiplier and a lot of patience to get them out without breaking them off in the block.

 

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