Replaced Stock Injectors With RV275 Injectors

[Ben]

8 hours ago, Tractorman said:

 

I do have a stock clutch.  I just replaced the original clutch with another stock clutch 7,000 miles ago at 297,000 on the odometer - the last 50,000 miles with the Smarty installed.  I never had any issues with the clutch.  The clutch disc, pressure plate, and flywheel were still in good condition when I replaced them.

 

I just recently installed the RV275 injectors and I will continue to use the lower Smarty settings.  Like you, I roll into the throttle until boost reaches about 10 psi, then I'm good to go. 

 

I rarely drive over 2100 rpms and I like the high torque delivered at the lower rpm's.  Eventually, I will figure out a tune the stock clutch will handle and still give me good performance and good fuel economy.

 

I do appreciate your comments.

 

- John

 

Im liking this a lot.  Keep up the good work and results. 

 

 

[Tractorman]

On ‎1‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 7:35 PM, pepsi71ocean said:

@Tractorman, I just realized I didn't answer your question about timing. I would move timing to 3 if you keep the SW low, you would most likely get more spool up with that. 

 

You may even benefit from SW5 TM5 Timing on 3 and a Duration on 3. I'm courios about your spool changes when you do that.

 

I am back home from the round trip to Baker City and back to Scotts Mills (near Salem).   The truck weighed in at 8,100 lbs.  I set the Smarty to the fuel economy program SW1 TM-6, T-default, D-default at the beginning of the trip.   The tank was filled with B5 fuel and the first fuel stop was in John Day.  The route used was Hwy 22 over Santiam Pass, through Sisters, then Hwy 26 through Prineville, John Day and onto Baker City.  I spent three days driving around Baker City.  Most of the 85 miles of highway between John Day and Baker City was snow packed.  Also, three other passes west of John Day were snow packed.

The first fuel stop was John Day
(336 miles, 15.3 gallons netting 21.96 mpg with B5 fuel).  I filled the tank with B20 fuel.

 The next fuel stop was John Day again (John Day to Baker City and back to John Day)
 (252 miles, 12.9 gallons, netting 19.53 mpg with B20 fuel). 

I filled the tank again with B20 fuel and I changed the Smarty settings to SW3 TM-6, T-3, D-2.  

The last fuel stop was at home.
(301 miles, 13.2 gallons, netting 22.80 mpg  with B20 fuel).

There were several variables involved with this trip (two different Smarty settings, B20 and B5 fuel, snow packed roads, new RV275 injectors, 3,000 feet elevation change to and from, etc.), so I cannot say specifically what played into the miles per gallon recorded. 

Overall, I was pleased with the performance and fuel economy.  Total:  889 miles, 41.4 gallons, averaging 21.47 mpg.  The power was very good with both Smarty settings.  The first setting (SW1 TM-6, T-default, D-default) had some timing rattle and throttle at low rpm’s surged a little.   The second setting (SW3 TM-6, T-3, D-2) had less timing rattle and smoother throttle response at low rpm’s.  It was easy to control smoke accelerating from low rpm’s, even at higher elevations with both Smarty settings.  I attribute this to the new injectors.

@pepsi71ocean, my original Smarty setting before I started my trip was SW3 TM-6, T-2, D-2.  So, at John Day on my return trip I used that setting but bumped the timing from 2 to 3 as you recommended.  I couldn't say that the turbo spooled differently, but the performance was good and still pulls hard down low and the timing rattle was not annoying.  I think I will drive with this setting for awhile and then try the SW5 settings that you recommended.  Thanks for your input.

Also, the 245/75R16 tires performed well in the snow.

Had to slip in a picture of the truck on at the property where we will be building near Baker City.

-        John

Edited January 13, 2019 by Tractorman
Add a picture

[pepsi71ocean]

keep me posed on your results. Thanks @Tractorman

[pepsi71ocean]

@Tractorman I thought I should mention that SW#1 is the fuel saver program. So you will have a good timing rattle due to the aggressive timing.  That's why they say you should start with SW#3. 

 

I didn't think of it till today when I was looking back over my notes here. I thought I should mention that heavy tiring shouldn't be done, although I don't know what the definition of aggressive timing is on SW#1 since Nick didn't do a chat for it #i think#.

[Tractorman]

48 minutes ago, pepsi71ocean said:

 I thought I should mention that SW#1 is the fuel saver program. So you will have a good timing rattle due to the aggressive timing.  That's why they say you should start with SW#3. 

 

I did know that SW1 is the fuel saver program and I did know that it has aggressive timing, but like you say - how much is unknown.  I used SW1 just for a reference point and since my truck was empty, I knew couldn't hurt anything.  I thought it was interesting that the SW3 performed just as well as the SW1 as far as fuel economy taking into consideration the elevation differences and that I was doing a lot of mountain driving. 

 

Also,  I just realized today that I need to adjust my fuel economy recordings that I reported in the earlier post.  I had set the Smarty to stock briefly before my trip so I could see the difference between my old stock injectors and the new RV275's.  I forgot to reset the Smarty to adjust for the 245 tires again. 

 

I wrote in a previous post  that I traveled 889 miles, used 41.4 gallons and netted 21.47 mpg.  Not true... darn!, I adjusted the miles driven (reduced by 3.5%), so I really traveled 858 miles, used 41.4 gallons netting 20.72 mpg.  Still a good number.

 

I will edit my previous post to reflect the correction.  Well, I guess I can't edit the previous post.  Hopefully, people will read far enough down to see the correction.

 

Again, thanks for your input.

 

- John

Edited January 13, 2019 by Tractorman
To report that I can't edit a previous post.

[Dmaney]

Excellent article @pepsi71ocean, I don't think I have seen someone put that much effort into smarty tuning in a long time. I have the old original smarty without the revo software. Never could get my computer to play nice back in the day to get it downloaded. Ran it in my 99 with RV275's and a auto for years. Never had any issues, although always thought it would be nice to have the revo. 

Still have it just not in current truck.

 

Keep up the good work!

 

[pepsi71ocean]

6 hours ago, Tractorman said:

 

I did know that SW1 is the fuel saver program and I did know that it has aggressive timing, but like you say - how much is unknown.  I used SW1 just for a reference point and since my truck was empty, I knew couldn't hurt anything.  I thought it was interesting that the SW3 performed just as well as the SW1 as far as fuel economy taking into consideration the elevation differences and that I was doing a lot of mountain driving. 

 

Also,  I just realized today that I need to adjust my fuel economy recordings that I reported in the earlier post.  I had set the Smarty to stock briefly before my trip so I could see the difference between my old stock injectors and the new RV275's.  I forgot to reset the Smarty to adjust for the 245 tires again. 

 

I wrote in a previous post  that I traveled 889 miles, used 41.4 gallons and netted 21.47 mpg.  Not true... darn!, I adjusted the miles driven (reduced by 3.5%), so I really traveled 858 miles, used 41.4 gallons netting 20.72 mpg.  Still a good number.

 

I will edit my previous post to reflect the correction.  Well, I guess I can't edit the previous post.  Hopefully, people will read far enough down to see the correction.

 

Again, thanks for your input.

 

- John

 

I do believe that the cause for this is because the throttle doesn't move in acceleration on SW3, however with the timing on 3 your getting the timing with just more fuel and boost fooling. I never noticed a smoke issue on SW3.  Once you reach SW5 then the throttle starts moving faster on the APPS sensor.

You do bring up a good point that your empty.   When I publish my smarty Article I'll most likely link to this thread here.

41 minutes ago, Dmaney said:

Excellent article @pepsi71ocean, I don't think I have seen someone put that much effort into smarty tuning in a long time. I have the old original smarty without the revo software. Never could get my computer to play nice back in the day to get it downloaded. Ran it in my 99 with RV275's and a auto for years. Never had any issues, although always thought it would be nice to have the revo. 

Still have it just not in current truck.

 

Keep up the good work!

 

 

Thanks for you input @Dmaney. I hope you get your smarty to update. it took me a few tries to understand how it works too when copying to my smarty, but I just needed one of the USB cords that go into my stereo I bought from Best Buy.

[pepsi71ocean]

@Mopar1973Man I think its about time to publish my smarty article.

 

[Tractorman]

We're waiting...

[Mopar1973Man]

On 1/14/2019 at 11:06 AM, Tractorman said:

We're waiting...

 

@pepsi71ocean need to drop a link here...

[pepsi71ocean]

@Mopar1973Man, and @Tractorman here is the long awaited article

 

 

[Marcus2000monster]

On 12/12/2018 at 4:00 PM, Tractorman said:

I bought 6 new Bosch RV275 injectors one year ago (the price was right - $425 for the set) and finally installed them last Friday.  The original injectors operated for 303,000 miles and had never been removed.  They were still performing well – as in smooth idle, good power, and good fuel economy.  I didn’t want to push a good thing too far.  The job went smoothly with the help of this site.  All of the old injector tips were clean considering the miles and years on them. 

 

I did notice however, that there is a black coating of something  kind of oily / powdery (not sure what it is) in the intake area just below the grid heaters.   It is not present in the air horn and the hose from the intercooler – they are very clean.   I wonder if worn valve guides combined with lots of exhaust brake usage could be the cause.  Maybe someone who has had experience with this can shed some light.  The marks are from me using a scraper.

 

I am having a problem with a very small leak with #1 injector line at the injector.   When I removed the injector lines, I did it in groups of three, but I left all of the blue clamping points tight.  When I put everything back together, the connection at the #1 injector showed signs of leaking (wetness on the head around the fitting) on a 5 mile test run.

So, I loosened the #1 injector line at the injector and loosened the blue clamp nearest the injector and then tightened the injector line followed by tightening the blue clamp.  No evidence of a leak on a 5 mile test run.  However, after a 50 mile trip the head is slightly damp around the  injector connection.  I will try again, but this time I think I will loosen the clamps and the mounts and repeat the procedure to get the leak stopped.  If anyone has any tips, please speak up.

I like the performance of the RV275’s.  I immediately dialed the Smarty tune back a setting. 

OEM injectors:                  SW5 – Torque Management 5,  Timing 1, Duration 5

RV275 injectors :                SW3 – Torque Management 4, Timing 2, Duration 2. 

Smarty Settings:

Torque Management (1-6)  Each higher number incrementally reduces torque management at low engine rpm’s.  Example: TM-6 equal zero torque management and allows for high torque at low rpm’s.

Timing (1-4):  Each higher number incrementally advances ignition timing .  (#1 is stock, #2 is stock with after market injectors)            

Fuel Duration (1-5):  Each higher number incrementally increases fuel duration.  (#1 is stock)

The RV275 injectors definitely deliver more fuel.  So far, the tune I am using with these injectors is performing well, lots of torque on the low end easy to drive without smoke.   I am setting the tune as to how I drive with a manual 6 speed transmission and operating engine rpm’s between the 1500 to 2000 rpm range for almost all driving conditions.   

I will post more information as I get some miles on the new injectors and let you know which tune I end up with.

- John

How do you like those rv275s now? Better mpg?

[Tractorman]

2 hours ago, Marcus2000monster said:

How do you like those rv275s now? Better mpg?

 

They are a definite improvement.  I do have to keep in mind that I am comparing the OEM injectors with 305,000 miles on them to new Bosch RV275 injectors.  Just having new injectors will improve performance. 

 

I had to dial the fuel back considerably on the Smarty S03 and I advanced the timing a step, but the engine now pulls very strong starting from 1300 rpm's and up - great for a manual transmission.  Smoke is  much easier to control. 

 

I netted 20.7 mpg on an 800 mile round trip to Baker City and back, which I think is good for winter time driving.

 

- John

[Mopar1973Man]

17 minutes ago, Tractorman said:

I had to dial the fuel back considerably on the Smarty S03 and I advanced the timing a step, but the engine now pulls very strong starting from 1300 rpm's and up - great for a manual transmission.  Smoke is  much easier to control.

 

That a small problem of the Smarty S-03 it wasn't designed for larger injectors really. No real way to cut fuel below stock levels to control smoke other to dial back the total fuel. Even the Edge Comp and Edge Juice have this problem.

[pepsi71ocean]

2 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

That a small problem of the Smarty S-03 it wasn't designed for larger injectors really. No real way to cut fuel below stock levels to control smoke other to dial back the total fuel. Even the Edge Comp and Edge Juice have this problem.

 

Yes and no, I believe this is where the revo and the SW# settings work together. 

[Dieselfuture]

4 hours ago, Tractorman said:

I netted 20.7 mpg on an 800 mile round trip to Baker City and back, which I think is good for winter time driving.

That's really good, how fast were you going. I seem to lose my mpg if I go pass 70, 65 seems to be a good place for my tuck. It sucks going places following someone you know, cause they always in a hurry to go 75-80 and then I get like 15 . Driving 60-65 is where I can get over 20.

[Mopar1973Man]

1 hour ago, Dieselfuture said:

Driving 60-65 is where I can get over 20.

 

Yea. That's about right. If you can drop down to 55 MPH it gets you back up in the low to mid 20's if set up right. I'm hoping that these fresh injectors get me there. 

[Tractorman]

1 hour ago, Dieselfuture said:

That's really good, how fast were you going

 

My speed varied a lot.  Maximum was 65 mph, but mostly 60 mph where there was no snow pack on the road.  About 250 miles of driving was on snow pack - 30 to 50 mph.

 

Overall, I am very happy with the RV275's performance.

 

- John

[Mopar1973Man]

Not a bad starter injector to upgrade too. Sad to say some of getting that terrible infection that you can't cure with stock power. You get addicted to the power and like a junkie gotta have more. 

 

• Stock to RV275
• Rv275 to Vulcan +50 HP
• Vulcan +50 HP to DAP +75 HP
• DAP +75 HP to DAP +150 HP

I'm a very sick man... 

• Stock ECM to Edge Comp +120 HP
• Edge Comp to Quadzilla Adrenaline +180 HP

I'm seriously infected... Help! I'm not sure if there is a cure for this...

 

[Tractorman]

9 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

You get addicted to the power and like a junkie gotta have more. 

 

• Stock to RV275
• Rv275 to Vulcan +50 HP
• Vulcan +50 HP to DAP +75 HP
• DAP +75 HP to DAP +150 HP

I'm a very sick man... 

 

It took me to 250,000 miles to get a Smarty S03, then 303,000 miles to upgrade from stock injectors. So maybe I am headed that way, but at the rate I am going I should die before I am "sick".

 

- John