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Hey, dont mean to start a new topic, but I have a question in regards to how much oil is in my 6 speed currently without draining it all. 

Like how much oil can you put in from the fill hole on level ground? What about bolt at top of the pto?

 

Only asking because I had a shop( which does good work usually)  drain and fill it. I would've done it myself but time is something I dont have a lot of.

I bought the oil, 6 quarts redline, and when I got truck back, I had 2 quarts of oil still left. Was told it may have had left over oil still in? Sounded odd, but they said they would check it. Brought It back, and a mechanic i havent met there came in and got me to show me it was filled to top of fill hole. He was a ****** about it too, so I questioned him on how much oil these transmissions take and he said " I just fill it to the oil comes out the top, I dont know." Wow ok, so i informed him on how much they take from factory spec, because apparently I have a moron working on my truck, then asked him to over fill it, which he knew they sometimes do it on these trucks. (Again, i trust the head mechanic and they usually do a great job, but this guy was something else.)

Anyway, i have a quart and a quarter still left over, and my truck isnt shifting into 4th and 5th smoothly at all. It's colder here now, which usually makes 3rd harder to shift into, but never had this kinda trouble with those gears. I do shift pretty slow, so it's not how fast i shift either. I feel like he didnt add enough oil, so I was gonna take the shifter off and add it through the top, I just want to make sure I dont put too much in there, especially if there was a quart still left in the truck when they drained it.

 

Plan on putting in 6 quarts.  Is there a way to check how much is in there currently?

 

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I usually fill mine to the hole then park on a side hill in the yard and put an quart or more. 1 full quart and whatever is left from filling to the hole. I dont believe there is any where for oil to remain in the tranny when its drained. Its not like an engine block. Just my thoughts anyway.

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Take shifter off on level ground and put rest of oil in. I have 8+ qt in mine for years now, I do have a fast cooler on one side and filter on the other, still I'm 1.5 qt over stock. My oil level is at pto top 2 side bolts not the very top middle. 

 

That's why I would never let anyone to touch my truck,  bunch of monkeys these days.

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1 hour ago, Dieselfuture said:

Take shifter off on level ground and put rest of oil in. I have 8+ qt in mine for years now, I do have a fast cooler on one side and filter on the other, still I'm 1.5 qt over stock. My oil level is at pto top 2 side bolts not the very top middle. 

 

That's why I would never let anyone to touch my truck,  bunch of monkeys these days.

I cant knock putting it in from the top, but it takes me a minute to move the truck to side hill and 4 more minutes to squeeze the extra in, replace the plug and move the truck back, done. I dont mind going the top route especially when all the parts around the shifter need a major cleaning.

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50 minutes ago, dripley said:

I cant knock putting it in from the top, but it takes me a minute to move the truck to side hill and 4 more minutes to squeeze the extra in, replace the plug and move the truck back, done. I dont mind going the top route especially when all the parts around the shifter need a major cleaning.

I just wanted more in mine :whistle2: couldn't do it on the side like you did, I tried but 6 qt is about all you're getting in

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Ya I agree with you @dripleyabout a full quart bquart left in the truck unless they didnt drain it all. I wish I would have just done it myself, and I will next time. That guy ticked me off with his attitude and not knowing his facts either. He wont care if his lack of know how ruined my transmission, but whatever. I think I'll just go in from the top, and add the extra quart. I know it was at least overflowing out of the fill hole because I had to take it in for a third time because the plug was loose and it was leaking from the PTO cover lol. 

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@Alexio Auditore You should have asked him to super size that fluid change.  He might have understood that then asked if you wanted fries with it.   I've worked in shops where they would hire a guys because they had some tools and were breathing, he would be gone in a month because of poor production and to many screw ups.

  

You should talk to the owner/management about this guy. His work ethics don't sound like they are the best.  He can cause thousands of dollars in property damage along with serious personal injury and even death. 

 

 

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Dieselfuture said:

I just wanted more in mine :whistle2: couldn't do it on the side like you did, I tried but 6 qt is about all you're getting in

the drainage ditch in front of my house leans it over enough for 2 full quarts above the filler hole and maybe more. Never tried to go any more. When I park on it there the passenger wheels are 2.5 feet below the drivers wheels. Leaned over pretty good.

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8 minutes ago, dripley said:

the drainage ditch in front of my house leans it over enough for 2 full quarts above the filler hole and maybe more. Never tried to go any more. When I park on it there the passenger wheels are 2.5 feet below the drivers wheels. Leaned over pretty good.

Guess my nuts are smaller than yours

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1 hour ago, Dieselfuture said:

Guess my nuts are smaller than yours

The truck doesn't bother, now the the lawn mower is bit different.

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My NV5600 takes one gallon. I never overfill. I change every 36k miles with 15/40 engine oil. I tried 50w synthetic manual transmission oil one time, it didn't like it until it warmed up a little. Maybe it is too slippery too, IDK.  I assume the Redline you used is a synthetic, what weight?

 

I would say your shop did the change just fine. There are overfill stories all over the internet, however, any manual transmission manufacture will tell you to "not overfill".

 

I drain out of the bottom PTO cover bolt and fill till the oil runs out of the fill plug. Every other change I will pull the cover and clean the magnet and sop up the small amount that is in the bottom.

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43 minutes ago, NIsaacs said:

There are overfill stories all over the internet, however, any manual transmission manufacture will tell you to "not overfill".

There is a transmission shop in town they been around for 40 years. When I bought my truck I took it to them because it made rattle noise when idling and worm. Right away he said you have after market clutch, and it's normal. Then he said make sure to drive in the ditch and put another qt in because nv5600 has a bearing up higher someplace and they fixed a few of them for that reason. 

I guess to each their own, I chose to run extra. 

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I over fill as well and beleive the 6th gear bearing is the one that is suppose benefit from it. I started doing yhis after loosing 4th in the oe trans. I can owner neglect on this one and not keeping track of the fluid level. The current one has about 288k on it and still works pretty well. 

 

IIRC the owners states you dont have to change the fluid, just keep it topped off. Not sure I agree with that though.

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The problem I see with NV5600 transmission... Even one keeps leaning on the thinner fluids (what spec suggests) by under load and temperature the fluid is thinner and fluid isn't thick enough to cling to bearings in the heat. Why they have bearing failures and need to over fill. 

 

Just remember PennzOil Syncromesh is too thin to make the GL-4 rating. Other than that its build on GL-4 technology just the oil is just too thin to be labelled as such. Just like Dodge Dealers filling with ATF now. Shift quality is super good but the protection of bearings and such suck because the lube is too thin.

 

Edited by Mopar1973Man

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3 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

The problem I see with NV5600 transmission... Even one keeps leaning on the thinner fluids (what spec suggests) by under load and temperature the fluid is thinner and fluid isn't thick enough to cling to bearings in the heat. Why they have bearing failures and need to over fill. 

 

Just remember PennzOil Syncromesh is too thin to make the GL-4 rating. Other than that its build on GL-4 technology just the oil is just too thin to be labelled as such. Just like Dodge Dealers filling with ATF now. Shift quality is super good but the protection of bearings and such suck because the lube is too thin.

 

What do you feel is a good long term solution?

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21 hours ago, portlandareae28 said:

What do you feel is a good long term solution?

 

That's the problem I would say for longevity sake to go towards a thicker lube so it clings to the bearings and gears more. Most 6 speed owners will whine about shift performance. Like using a thin oil in the engine will reduce engine drag and make starting easy  but will not protect well in high temperatures. Thin oils will be flung from parts much easier. Being there is no oil pump in NV5600 its all about splash feeding and cling of the oil to protect.

 

Like myself I ditch the whole spec thing and started looking for other solutions for lube oils in both NV4500 and NV5600. I dropped the 75w-85 for straight 50 SAE fluid which is actually straight 90 gear lube. So the factory fluid for the NV4500 is like a 10w-40 engine oil. NV5600 like Pennzoil syncromesh doesn't list a viscosity but it's classified as to thin to make the GL-4 spec. The 75w-85 makes the GL-4 spec. That means the PennzOil is thinner than what is listed. I can say that as long as the lube oil meet a GL-4 spec it should work. GL-4 spec is for all transmissions with syncros (yellow metal or synthetic).

 

Just remember that these gear boxes under serious loads can surpass the 200 to 220*F of fluid temps and with a thin oil getting thinner I can see where the 6 speed failures come from. Remember there is no oil pump just splash feed oiling.

Table_5_viscosity_comparison_chart.jpg

 

Just always remember that Dodge is willing to drain and fill both NV4500 and NV5600 with ATF+4 now. I know that is super thin and does not meet the GL-4 spec at all. 

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It's a NV5600 so GL-4 isn't relevant... let's not create problems or confusion where it doesn't need to be. 

 

The NV5600 has never spec'd Gl-4, it specs syncromesh. Trying to make Syncromesh match GL-4 specs would be like using a Powerstroke FSM to rebuild a 5.9, it's simply the wrong application. That's why it doesn't have a GL-4 rating, it's NOT supposed to. 

 

 

FWIW Syncromesh isn't that thin, similar to a 75w-85. 

Edited by AH64ID
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I've stuck with the red line for a while. Had the truck 7 years, it's worked fine for shifting before. I understand the shifting becomes more difficult in the cold, that hasnt changed. I'm just wanting to make sure my oil level is ok, because it seems different than it should. It is having a hard time going to 4th, and when I down shift to 2nd, it is now a bear to get into gear. I just want to know how many quarts are at the plug and the top pto bolt on level ground. I may just dump the 6 quarts I originally bought all into it, because I find it hard to believe it had a full quart in it unless the mechanic just did a more crappy job than I thought and didnt drain it all out.

260k miles thus far on the transmission, no failures yet. I'd only do the specific red line, amzoil, or the penz. That it calls for.

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1 minute ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Dig deeper my friend you'll find that it is close to GL-4 but not making the grade because it just too thin.

 

Close only works in horseshoes and hand grenades... It's not uncommon for fluid specs to be close, but not the same.. hence different specs. GL-4 fluids don't meet syncromesh, and syncromesh doesn't meet GL-4, it's not rocket science.. only different specs. The same company makes both transmissions, as well as many others, and they are the ones that call for different specs... is that just for fun? 

 

Not to mention that the GL-4 specification does not have a designated weight associated with it. There are many different weight GL-4's, kinda like CK oil. The weight is published with the oil/lube because the designation of GL-4 does not denote the weight, unlike syncromesh. 

 

This another one of those solutions to a problem that doesn't exist. 

 

Syncromesh is not a thin fluid, certainly not thin enough to cause a bunch of concern . This is not a case of the vehicle manufacturer ignoring the transmission manufacturers specifications, unlike the G56. 

 

The dealership putting ATF in the NV's is also not a valid argument, warranty is LONG gone and published fluid specs are still GL-4 and Syncromesh. Besides who takes a 14+ year old vehicle to the dealership anyhow :doh:

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1 hour ago, Alexio Auditore said:

I may just dump the 6 quarts I originally bought all into it,

You'll be just fine, if you take shifter off with fluid to bottom of fill hole, you can barely see it from the top. If you dump one more quart in you may be raising level by 1/8 to 1/4" it's a big tranny one qt over is fine in many opinions, but we all know opinions are like belly buttons everybody has one.  Unless it's a tranny of course. 

1 hour ago, Alexio Auditore said:

unless the mechanic just did a more crappy job than I thought and didnt drain it all out.

Unless he didn't change it at all, how do you know

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2 hours ago, Dieselfuture said:

Unless he didn't change it at all, how do you know

When he took the plug out to show me he put enough fluid, it was clean. 

That's why I was kinda curious how much oil would go in these transmissions from the fill plug on level ground. Then I'll know exactly how much he put in. 

2 hours ago, Dieselfuture said:

but we all know opinions are like belly buttons everybody has one.  Unless it's a tranny of course. 

Lol I had to re-read that to get where you were coming from. 

  • Haha 1

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