1999 24v cummins changes engine tone while keeping steady speed on highway

[Tractorman]

2 hours ago, daav544 said:

But any way i did a front main seal today and the mfer is leaking

 

Just double checking here.  Was the new seal a PTFE seal?   Was it installed dry (as it should be)?

 

Interesting coincidence - I just installed one yesterday.

 

- John

[Doubletrouble]

So either the adrenaline installed the issue stopped or was it the repair on the map sensor plug?.....or, is it still doing the same thing?

[daav544]

Havnt noticed it yet, but also havnt had à long enough stretch on the highway to cruise at 80 for a while but for the couple minuets i  did keep steady speed it kept the same klunky tone the whole time wish i could figure out how to get it to have that smooth tone, it really quiets things down in the cab a bit. And @Tractorman idk if it was ptfe but said install dry so i did. Ive heard of people installing 2 seals one in front of the other so atleast one seal will be out of the groove. Also i read that the majority of the wear sleeves are used with stock size seals. And the cummins brand ones have a larger sleeve? So i ordered an aftermarket seal with a sleeve that im guna take the sleeve from and use the plastic install thingy and slip the plastic under the seal thats installed on my truck already then press the wear sleeve on so it slips under the seal. Decent plan? I really do not wana have to do it all over again so id like to try that before tearing it all apart again

Edited April 8 by daav544

[Tractorman]

2 hours ago, daav544 said:

idk if it was ptfe but said install dry so i did.

 

That is a PTFE seal and it sounds like you installed it correctly.  I am not sure if slipping in a standard seal size sleeve will stop the leak, but I can see how it may be worth a try.  From my understanding of how a PTFE seal works, there is a frictional bond that occurs where the two dry mating surfaces meet on initial shaft rotation, before engine oil contacts the surface.  It is that action that seals the seal.

 

Hopefully, installing a sleeve will work for you.  Let us know what the results are.

 

- John

[Mopar1973Man]

I always put the seal back in the same position. This way the wear groove lines up with the dust lip and the seal lip is back in the smooth spot. Never leaked on my truck.

 

Now if you do the sleeve you must change the seal and sleeve together being the different dimensions. Also be aware when removing a sleeve is a PITA because you have to score it with a chisel and hopefully get behind it with a small screwdriver to hopefully tear it in half. I avoid using sleeves if at all possible being it just makes the next seal change a PITA later to do.

 

I typically get the NAPA crank seal with the tapered installing tool that way you don't tear up the seal lip trying to get it over the crank tip which I'm kind of betting you tore the seal lip. Be aware it suppose to be installed DRY! NO LUBE!

[daav544]

I know for sure i didnt tear the seal lip i used the supplied plastic install tool it slipped right on easy peasy. I installed it dry and i used permatex great stuff grey gasket maker on the cover used  a generous amount but not a crazy amount l, installed cover and put bolts in hand tight and let it set up for over an hour and a half before tightening the cover down. Can i start the truck with the harmonic balancer off for just a minute or 2 to verify its the seal and not the cover leaking?

[Mopar1973Man]

Yes. You can pull the dampener and run the truck for several minutes without worry. It will take awhile for the coolant to heat up 6 gallons.

[daav544]

Ok cool ill double check its the seal, and i think i just happened to bang the seal into the same exact spot as the old one so its sitting in the slight little groove my crank has. I have plenty of room behind the seal to tap it in a little more do you think thats worth a shot? Also i have plenty of room infront of the seal for a second seal. Ive read of guys running 2 seals and having success im thinking of slipping on a second seal and tapping it in while the cover is on the truck i really dont wana pull it apart if i dont have to. And im damn near positive that i didnt mess up the first seal i used the plastic install tool and it slipped right on like butter and the plastic piece came out with  little effort

[Great work!]

If you have the old seal you may be able to measure it and buy a traditional style seal to put in next to it.

 

I had a rear seal start leaking about 5000 miles after replacement, should have used a sleeve but the crank didn't look bad.

[daav544]

What do you mean a traditional style seal? And tonight when i get home from work i plan on taking my harmonic balancer off and making sure its the seal that is leaking then i have a mahle sleeveless seal just like the one i already put in the truck and im guna drive it in while the cover is on the truck. Another form im on on facebook people are saying the seals go in from the back which i tried at first but it wanted to cockeye alot easier than from the front i ended up driving it in from the front fairly easy. So ill take the plastic bottle neck tool thats for slipping the seal over the crank and ill get the seal on the crank then drive it in like i did the first time and hopefully the seal will sit on a better part of the crank i think my first one ended up in the same spot as the one i replaced landing it in the groove

[Mopar1973Man]

Seal should go in from the front side not back. Like I said I typically like up the dust lip with the groove in the crank. Unless the oil seal part of your crank is getting too thin. Maybe?

[daav544]

The groove on my crank was really miniscule nothing id think woulda been a huge deal, and i really dont think i ****** the seal up with how easy it went on with the plastic bottle neck installer. And could it be that i didnt use any loctite on the outer rim? I couldn't see that area leaking a drop evert 15 seconds like it is, its a decent leak. Well ill find out in the next hour or so when i dig into it.

[Tractorman]

3 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Seal should go in from the front side not back.

 

Not according the FSM....,

 

Installation -

 

 

Removal - (16) Support the cover on a flat work surface with
wooden blocks (Fig. 105), and using a suitable punch
and hammer, drive the old seal out of the cover from
the outside of the cover (Fig. 105).

 

 

It is probably not crucial to remove and install the seal according to the FSM, but there could be a reason for doing it this way. 

 

I used a sleeve and installed the sleeve and seal with the correct sleeve installer tool and seal installer tool.  I have yet to see if there are leaks as I have not run the engine yet.

 

- John

[Mopar1973Man]

Yeah I see. But the whole cock8ng and getting crooked is more of a problem with people that don't have that special seal tool. I've managed to change 3 seals on Beast from the front which allows you to gauge alignment as you start and always tap on the high side of the seal. 

 

There is a lot I don't do exactly like the FSM. Like changing VP44, and other common task that I figured other ways that work for common tool guys. Like me don't have the seal tool as shown. So you'll be beating with a small dowel or simular on the inside rim and it will distort seal. There is more meat for just using a small ball pen hammer and just nicely light taps on the rim where it's strongest.

[daav544]

Welp seals dry as a bone its the damn cover i must of over tightened it or not let it set up long enough before i tightened i gave it about and hour and a half 2 hours with the grey great stuff. So i cleaned all the oil residue off( it actually slowed leaking from the other day) and then i slathered on some more of the great stuff all over the seam where the cover meets the engine. I even took out 4 bolts on the bottom and pryed the cover a tiny bit so i could smoosh more sealant under the cover. Now im letting it set up. It will probably be a bandaid or it might stop it enough to where i dont give a **** lol. Also next task is vacuum pump seals  for the second time in 8 months....

Edited April 10 by JAG1

[daav544]

Anyone happen to know the pin orientation for the fuel pressure sensor for the adrenaline? I know i should probably just get the adrenaline sensor but im cheap and want to see if this sensor would work. Also the leak is pretty much stopped did see any drips. Next will be the vacuum pump for the second time. I think it might have started leaking prematurely cus i didnt put the stiffener bracket back on that goes from the power steering resi to the block

[Tractorman]

On 4/8/2024 at 2:32 PM, daav544 said:

i used permatex great stuff grey gasket maker on the cover used  a generous amount but not a crazy amount l, installed cover and put bolts in hand tight and let it set up for over an hour and a half before tightening the cover down.

 

At first, I was questioning your application method here.  Then I went to the Permatex site to read how to apply the grey gasket maker and learned that you applied it exactly as instructed. 

 

For me, another thing learned today.

 

- John

[daav544]

Lol i try to do things right, i just ordered a gasket so once that comes in ill pull the cover back off(carefully not to damage the new front main seal) and clean it all up again and throw the gasket on with a thin layer of the permatex on both sides and hopefully ill be golden. Then next step wil be the vacuum pump im friggin sick of that god damn thing. Ill have to get genuine cummins gaskets for that. Oh and my god damn power steering resi is rotted a little bit and has a pin hole so ill be welding that friggin thing up too or covering it in jb weld

Edited April 11 by IBMobile
foul language

[Great work!]

It's hard to get in there to the power steering area and even worse getting the lines undone. Mine are so rusty that they would have to be replaced too.

 

On sheet metal covers I sometimes use a ball peen hammer on the holes so they are dimpled out ward then the bolts flatten them out. Puts more tension on the gasket.

[IBMobile]

2 hours ago, daav544 said:

steering resi is rotted a little bit and has a pin hole so ill be welding that friggin thing up too or covering it in jb weld

I've fixed leaking PS reservoirs that crack where the mounting bolts go through the sheet metal by using a brazing rod and acetylene torch; don't use JB Weld, it won't hold up to the vibrations.