additives

[burb31]

what do uguys recommend for fuel additives?I see some of you use 2 cycle for its lubricating value but what about for the cold winter months to prevent gelling......all of them pretty much the same?I think they use a product called 911 at my work.Oh....and what do u think of stanadyne additives?

[ISX]

Lubricity is the main concern with winter products that nobody considers. 2 stroke oil adds the lube back into the fuel. It is good practice to add something like power service or something to prevent the fuel from gelling since you never know what the diesel station protects their fuel to (temperature-wise). The only problem with something that prevents gelling is that it takes lube qualities away. So you add whatever amount of anti-gel it says to use, then add a quart of 2 stroke per 35 gallon fillup and the lube should be sufficient. I stopped running any anti-gel and just go to the big trucker station as I am pretty sure they add anti-gel to it. I have gone down to 0F with their fuel with no problems. Mike has ran down to -20F on 2 stroke without issue. As long as it is a reputable fuel station, they should have the fuel protected down to the temp the area normally sees. I doubt Florida is going to have diesel rated for -20F... http://mopar.mopar1973man.com/cummins/general/2-cycle-oil/2-cycle-oil.htm

[flagmanruss]

Adding antigel might be a good idea if you were going to be out in extreme conditions or using hold over summer blend in winter. I buy my fuel from an active station (local FDs & businesses do to) and have the right season blend. I don't believe any fuel dealer could/would sell fuel without a additive package. It's normally added at the fuel depot. I continue to run TCW3 rated 2 stroke year round 1oz per gallon of fill up. 3 years doing do. I had bought other additives on the advice of the Dodge dealer (poor mpg complaint) but the additives did not fix it... you'd a thunk, they'd have found the serious brake drag... but you'd a been wrong!! The additives are just gathering dust in my shop. I've begun running TCW3 added to fuel in my old JD diesel tractor. It only gets run intermittantly & the extra lubrication to the cylinders seems to quiet it down.

[Mopar1973Man]

Best suggestion is pick up a bottle of 911 (red bottle) keep it in the the truck for when it does gel then you add it to the fuel but as for something to add to the fuel all winter long I would just continue with a good fuel lubricant.

[dually]

I would like to add to moporman's 911 post.If you ever have frozen fuel get a quart of 911 and put some in the filter as well as the tank.That stuff really works.

[AH64ID]

I run Amsoil Diesel Concentrate on every tank, year round. I use it for the lube, cleaning, stabilizing properties. I generally only add Amsoil Cold Flow Improver for the tanks at elk camp (pre-winterized fuel), the first tank or so of cold weather (unsure when the stations switch), and if I am leaving the local area for a colder one. Otherwise the local blend works well for me. I also keep an Amsoil Diesel Recovery in the tool box year round, and 2 in the winter.

[Wild and Free]

I run Schaeffers soy shield fuel additive every tank on all 3 of my rigs. The last mine I worked at goes through about 35K gallons of fuel everyday of the year and over the years of testing found schaeffers fuel additives to be by far the best. I have ran the amsiol additives for years but have noticed better traits with the schaeffers versus amsoil. I run straight #2 until temps drop to and stay below -10 for extended lengths of time before running a winter blend fuel only when needed. One thing to note is if you do run winterblend fuel do not mix it with normal #2 as the additives in a preblended winter fuel will cause more issues than straight gelled #2 fuel. Run your tank as low as possible before filling with winter blend fuel. I am not talking about blender pump blends where you can choose % of #1 and #2 mix, I am talking about the specific winter blends you find at the pump. For example Cenex harvest states stations have whats called a "WinterMaster fuel" which has a specific additive package already added to it.

[Mopar1973Man]

Yeah I know what you mean... This why I suggest not adding more anti-gel unless you actually have a gelling issues... Like my local Cenex pumps in a unknown amount of this to the fuel tanks. But they might have 12-20 barrel behind the store... Since Xylene is a poor lubricant I tend to keep a watchful eye on the lubricity more so than the gelling issues... Xylene explained... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xylene

[jlwelding]

I still like the old comparison, have you ever seen a snowmodile freeze up. lol

[Wild and Free]

I still like the old comparison, have you ever seen a snowmodile freeze up. lol

A few years ago I saw about 20 sleds melt down/lock up within a few hours time. It was around -35 to -40 overnight at a snowmobile lodge and that morning about half of the ones that actually got them to start had some serious issues. Most due to the 2 stroke oil being to thick on the sleds with oil injection to work properly. Talking with some of them I think all I talked to had synthetic oil in them also.

[jlwelding]

-40, I will stay right here in Tx. lol

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm thankful it not that cold here in Idaho... Maybe -20*F... But not -40*F...

[LiveOak]

I use Amalgamated TDR-S formula during summer and warm weather and use the TDR-WDA forumula for winter. I bought a 5 gallon pail of each. I added in the Walmart Supertech 2 stroke oil at about 1 oz. per gallon just to be on the safe side with lubricity. Probably don't need both. But it is cheap insurance. http://www.amalgamatedinc.com/tdr-wda.aspx http://www.amalgamatedinc.com/tdr-s.aspx

[moostang]

An older guy I know who only drives older vehicles (gas) adds a quart of ATF to his tank every so often. He says it keeps things clean and lubed. Would that work in a diesel?

[flagmanruss]

Old school ATF had whale oil in it... At the time they said it was the best lubricant... then they banned whaling. (My age is showing.) Modern ATF is supposed NOT to burn! I would not add it to my fuel. I used to winterize inboard (boat) gas engines by fogging with M Mystery oil. Knowing what I do now, I'd use TCW3 2 cycle oil. I've begun adding TCW3 to diesel fuel in my old John Deere tractor. It might be my imagination but I think the extra cylinder lube can be useful in an engine that is only used occasionally. Russ

[LiveOak]

Old school ATF had whale oil in it... At the time they said it was the best lubricant... then they banned whaling. (My age is showing.) Modern ATF is supposed NOT to burn! I would not add it to my fuel. I used to winterize inboard (boat) gas engines by fogging with M Mystery oil. Knowing what I do now, I'd use TCW3 2 cycle oil. I've begun adding TCW3 to diesel fuel in my old John Deere tractor. It might be my imagination but I think the extra cylinder lube can be useful in an engine that is only used occasionally. Russ

DITTO what flagmanruss said.

[Dave3500]

A few years ago I saw about 20 sleds melt down/lock up within a few hours time. It was around -35 to -40 overnight at a snowmobile lodge and that morning about half of the ones that actually got them to start had some serious issues. Most due to the 2 stroke oil being to thick on the sleds with oil injection to work properly. Talking with some of them I think all I talked to had synthetic oil in them also.

Man that's cold. I'm a believer in what Michael writes. The best insurance is the cheapest dtuff from Wally World, but again I never get that cold here thank God! The Tech brand in not synthetic anyway correct? Dave

[Mopar1973Man]

SuperTech actually is PennzOil and no its not synthetic... Just good ol' fashion petroluem oil. Now going back a few year and remembering the stuff I did research on back in 2006-2007. As for SuperTech Unversial 2 Cycle Oil it has a pour point of -40*F. Normal winterized diesel at least here in Idaho has a pour point of -20*F. The the reason why synthetic 2 cycle shouldn't be use is because since all synthetic oil hav no parafin base oil in it... It had no reason to use a pour point depressant (PPD) which all petroluem oil must have to keep them from gelling. As for the effect 2 cycle oil has on fuel it not very clear as for gelling. But this is the way I look at it... If you got a jar of water you know the water is going to freeze at 32*F. Now take a jar of salt water you know the freeze point of salt water is below that of normal water. But it depends on how much salt is in the salt water. Now mix the salt water and normal water together and you know the salt water will have effect but how much is unknown. Now with that said replace water with diesel fuel and salt water with 2 cycle oil and you'll now understand my thoughts and theory of 2 cycle oil in the winter time. So if normal diesel is -20*F for a pour point and 2 cycle oil is -40*F surely it got to have a effect..

[AH64ID]

I still am not 100% sold on the effects of 2 stroke on gelling. I realize the pour point is much lower, but does 2 stroke have anything it it that will chemically prevent the paraffin from gelling? Or does #1 not chemically change the #2 paraffins?

[Mopar1973Man]

As far as the research I did on the Super tech it uses the very same PPD chemicals as normal #2 diesel which was a shocker for me... Like you I don't put my full trust in it but I know it got to make a effect how much... I don't know! ADDON: After searching the web rapidly and reading a few pages from different companies you'll find all petroleum base oils (engine, gear, 2 cycle etc) all have to have a PPD added to allow it to perform in cold weather. It the synthetic oil that don't require on because of the simple point they are not produced from a petroleum base (no wax).