Jump to content
  • Welcome To Mopar1973Man.Com

    We can see that your guest and been lurking about. When you register on the Mopar1973Man.Com site you'll be able to interact with all the other members. This is the most friendliest Cummins forum you'll ever join. Take the time right now and  REGISTER  on the Mopar1973Man.Com this will open up many more options and functions on the website. Everyone is very friendly and helpful just ask questions and everyone will help you out the best they can. 

Sign in to follow this  
Mopar1973Man

VP44 problems - Getting tired of the BS!

Recommended Posts

Ok first of let me vent here a second... (You've been warned!)

I got a phone call from a gent this evening upset at his truck because of hard starting and P1689 error code randomily coming. He admits he's got a Raptor fuel pump, Edge Juice and 100 HP injectors. That fine... But the admits he's selling it because he's tired of all the VP44 failures and problem.

WHOA! Stop the train... This is where I'm getting really tired of people giving the VP44 a bad name now pay attention.

Now I asked him of his source of fuel. His response is he's running red dye fuel from a farm tank because its free.

Then ask him of the the fuel filter he's running. His response is a cheap wix/napa filter.

So now whining about VP44 failures but he's feeding it dirty watered down fuel and using cheap filters and wonder why the VP44 are not lasting. :rolleyes:VP44 injection pump are a great pump and work very very well only if you feed them right...

[*]Fuel lubricity of <450 HFRR (He admits in using 2 cycle oil :thumb1:)

[*]Fuel pressure of >14 PSI (Raptor pump and no lower than 16 PSI :thumb1:)

[*]Filters of <10 Microns

[*]Little to no water (We all know farm fuels get water from time to time from sitting in the weather :rolleyes:)

So what I'm finding out is people are abusing the pumps by cheating and then blame the pump for the poor quality of fuel and filters used. I'm really getting sick and tired of all the VP44 bashing... :mad:

Posted Image

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After all the time of hearing VP44 failure and how bad VP44 pump are... I now know what every VP44 rebuilder is fighting every day. Where VP44 owners are cutting corners on fuel quality and filters and feed it dirty nasty fuel from gawd knows where.Why is that you here the same guy bragging about AMSOil in every hole but feed the fuel tank with worse garbage he can find? Why is this? Then blame the VP44 for being a $hitty pump. :rolleyes:I'll admit there is a few actual short life span pump that failed premature but not as often as the big forums as pushing it... :smart:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was in a hurry a few weeks ago and just stopped by the Dodge dealer to pick up a fuel filter for each of my 2 rigs since I am a fan of fleetgaurds. I found out Mopar only offers 1 filter now for the 24 v and 5.9 cr engines the 7 micron.Good to know that mopar now only uses the 7 mic fs 19856 for both engines.:thumb1:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

my first one went out at 75k and was replaced under warranty. i dont know what happened toit, i was just happy it was fixed at no cost tome. that one stayed in the truck for 5 1/2 years and about 140k more miles. it went thru the following; me not knowing a thing about what it needed to be healthy(probably its worst torture) one lift pump failure at 140k. dodge installs an in tank pump. started acting funny about 185k. turns out my fuel pressure was almost none existant. added a booster pump and got the pressure up around 17 and 11. but still no fuel pressure gauge(still torturing her here)read an article in a diesel magazine discussing issues with the vp and the importance of pressure. stilll no gauge article did not discuss adding one. started having bucking and dead pedal issues at 215k and decided the pump was going out and bought one. major malfundtion before i could install the pump. spemt a month on cf trying teget answers and found little help. found M1973M and every thing changed. as it turns out my pump probably was not as bad as i thought. turned out to be ecm. installed pump anyway.long story short, the second vp lasted 140k and survived an ignorant owner. i did keep the fuel filter clean and used on road diesel the whole time and it was changed before it failed. they cant be all bad to survive all of that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i ran kleen diesel for4 or 5 monthson the old pump before the new diesel fuel never notice any diffarance so i stopped. i never ran anything in it after that. ther was plent of theold stuff around until about 2 years ago i think. i have been running 2 cyle for most of the life of this pump and like it. figure it is very cheap insurance to help the vp have a long and happy life. there is lots of good info here on the subject. you ought to read up on it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So what's the opinion of fuel additives?

Here is the write up...

http://articles.mopar1973man.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=68:hfrr-testing-of-common-diesel-fuel-additives&catid=36&Itemid=115

Personally after trying a few to correct a misfire issues and then after soaking a injector over night in straight solvent and seeing it did nothing to correct the problem. I can tell you that if your looking to clean a fuel system you have to take everything apart and clean it by hand. So as for keeping it clean is all about good CLEAN fuel and good fuel filters (<10 Micron)

As for keeping things lubed up I would look at the list (above link) and consider the options.

As for cetane booster just remember everytime you increase cetane you reduce the BTU's of the fuel... Just remember standard gasoline is right at 116K Btu's

Posted Image

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

another reason not to use the cetane boosters. i got no benifit from it at all that i could tell

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as I agree, you all do realize that anyone who is disgruntled with the VP isn't going to read this thread. They would rather spend $4000-$5000 to P-pump their truck and give up all the drive-ability of the 24v. To each is own.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as I agree, you all do realize that anyone who is disgruntled with the VP isn't going to read this thread. They would rather spend $4000-$5000 to P-pump their truck and give up all the drive-ability of the 24v. To each is own.

If anyone happens to read this and is going to p-pump their truck anyway I would love to take a vp-44 apart to see what makes it tick. :lmao:
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After your done send it my way... :smart:

No problem. I'll take it all apart and make diagrams to send with it in pieces and test you on putting it back together. :lmao:Of course I would have to make sure I could put it together myself first.:lmao:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've read somewhere and heard on other forums that Wix is a good enough quality fuel filter but, when I opened the box, it said on the filter, 'made in Banglidesh'...... I think I won't be buying them any more.:nono:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've read somewhere and heard on other forums that Wix is a good enough quality fuel filter but, when I opened the box, it said on the filter, 'made in Banglidesh'...... I think I won't be buying them any more.:nono:

Is ANYTHING made here anymore?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've read somewhere and heard on other forums that Wix is a good enough quality fuel filter but, when I opened the box, it said on the filter, 'made in Banglidesh'...... I think I won't be buying them any more.:nono:

Is ANYTHING made here anymore?

Not really... Most everything from filters to parts are 99% made over seas...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the last 3 i bought were made in bulgaria. three differant brands or so the box said.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

my vp went out around 150,000 miles about a year after i bought it. I am second owner and the cause was the crap stock lift pump. Well a bunch of money and 6 hours later i replaced it all myself and installed the raptor 150 and have had zero issues since. i am now on the 2 stroke oil regiment and it does have a positive if small impact ont things :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've read somewhere and heard on other forums that Wix is a good enough quality fuel filter but, when I opened the box, it said on the filter, 'made in Banglidesh'...... I think I won't be buying them any more.:nono:

I can't say anything for the fuel filters since I've never dealt with them, but I have had to replace an engine due to a wix oil filter. The bypass valve came out of the filter and blocked the oil flow to everything but the crankshaft and high pressure oil pump.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't say anything for the fuel filters since I've never dealt with them, but I have had to replace an engine due to a wix oil filter. The bypass valve came out of the filter and blocked the oil flow to everything but the crankshaft and high pressure oil pump.

I have one Wix O/F left. Now I think I should return that one. The rest are Baldwin filters any opinions on those?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have one Wix O/F left. Now I think I should return that one. The rest are Baldwin filters any opinions on those?

Never heard or seen anything bad about them. I personally use fleetguard but know of several trucks, including some company fleets with over 100 trucks, that use baldwin filters and to my knowledge there haven't been any problems from them.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've not hidden my dislike of the VP44 and it's electronic 'wonderchild' properties..

I'm sorry, but I still feel like it's way more complicated of a device than it should be. It's too temperamental, too costly for even little crap (APPS), and so on.

The P-pump is horse of another color. It, too, is expensive to replace, and has it's idiosyncrasies (like racks sticking, timing complications, etc.

But it's far less complicated, and requires almost no electronics/computers to be used effectively.

My 12V 5speed p-pumped truck with only exhaust, bhaf, #10 fuel plate, 3K springs, and added boost (roughly $400 total spent on aftermarket parts) was 3 times the truck my 24V 6spd VP44 truck is, with it's Edge, exhaust, bhaf, (8-900$ worth of stuff.)

Both trucks have mid-100K on the odometer. 12V got 26-27mpg on highway (hand-calculated), 17-18mpg city. 24V is about 12-13 city, with rare occasions of 15-16 city, and (if I'm really lucky) 19 highway.

Seems to me the 24V, more "precisely controlled" VP44 should get a lot better than that, economy-wise. But it doesn't.

I hate the "DBW" operation of this setup; i prefer a more mechanical link between my foot and the throttle control.

Do I want to swap to a p-pump on the 24v? Yes

Will I? Eventually, most likely.

Why? Because I prefer the mechanical functionality, less expensive maintenance costs, nigher tolerance to crap, etc.

Does the VP44 functionality/usefulness not entice me? Some do, most don't.

Do I bash the VP44 every chance I get? No. It does what it does, and it does it decently. I just think it's a little too picky.

I'm sure I'll get a poke or two from this, but whatever. I am just not the fan of the VP44 that a bunch of others are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rogan, you dont have to be a fan of the VP. It is what it is to you and thats fine. The only thing I dislike reading on these forums is completely non factual negative opinions based on situations which are known to be the cause of VP failure. People cant complain about something not doing what it was not designed to do. This also applies to most all components of a vehicle with drivetrain being on the top of the list. Who "isn't" guilty of this? Yes, the VP has had its fair share of issues but this isn't to say that most of those issues have or can be dealt with. Every now and again you'll see someone post a thread talking about all the money and work they had to go through with their GM or Ford which adds up to far more than replacing a VP every 100k miles. And thats not to say that anyone shouldn't be upset either if their VP fails or if something breaks on their vehicle.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  



×
×
  • Create New...