Hi All,

 

So what do you think, would this be the best Dodge Cummins to own?

 

Why?

 

Why not?

 

I have a 98.5, missed it by this much!

 

Just want your opinion,

Dave

it's pretty common to  find a  'conversion set up'   listed on  ebay or  craigslist..   Someone's  parting out a truck. 

You'll  get  just about everything needed,  trans, flywheel, clutch, hydraulics,   cross member,  pedal set up,   Most of these run  2 to 3k bucks...

just  so you know, these will not be 'fresh' rebuilds,  and  probably  could use  a  going though!   a lot of  remanned  trans run  1800 up to almost 4 thousand..   So  just from that,  if the seller can prove its a good trans,  then the  'kit' is  good money. 

  Remember you'll need  a trans  set up for  your type of  truck;    either 2 or 4wd...   Your existing  TC  bolts right up.

 

driveshafts  need to be  lengthened, shortened..  or   cobbed off the donor, if it's  the right ones

 

 

Then there's the    pcm...   will need the   manual version 

 

After the parts are  gathered,     2 guys  can  do it in a  good weekend,   1 guy  probably will need 2..   

Easy?  no,  impossible?  no.   time consuming yes.  lots of   crap has to be  removed/replaced..      but when done,  it's just  like the  factory did it.. 

As for the Auto... If one takes the time to pick the right parts, it will put ALOT of power to the rear wheels. I know I spent $5200 and have out launched And out pulled alot of manuels! I broke it in with 375hp/680tq its rated for 500/1000! Just put a 63/68/12 and a set of 5x.014's no dyno yet but I an very colse to 450/875 without a good tune on the AFC. NOW i'm breaken the tires loose!!!

AS far as looking for a donor truck, the manual is the same? Doesn't matter if it's in V8, V10, or another Diesel? HO 0r not? How about the PCM?

 

Somewhere down the line I'm thinking, the Wife gave me her blessing on this one as well, she likes to drive stick as much as I do!

Thanks,

Dave

your  pcm  currently runs  your auto    trans... and  simply unhooking it will cause  'check engine'  light to come on..   

 

 

As  far as the   actual transmission,   an  NV 5600  is an  NV5600..ok, make sure  it's for your  configuration ie  2 or 4wd..   BUT,   the  bellhousing    is different  on the  small gasser versions.

 

V10's   and  diesel bells   are the same,  but  make sure you get a  diesel  flywheel.     These engines  are balanced differently.   (internally vs. externally)

I'd recommend you finding a   ~2001.5    and newer   nv5600,   They'll  have  a   1 3/8ths  input, and  better  synchronizer rings.  (finding the  old style  ring has been  hard,  almost have to  retrofit the whole trans  for a  rebuild then.)  might as well   start with  something  that has parts  fairly plentiful.

 

 

edit;    make that  ~ 2000.5  on the  larger  input size.       7/11/00    SUPPOSED to be the   split date

Edited June 5, 201411 yr by rancherman

V8 trucks have different bell housings, etc. Need a V10 or diesel donar.

V8 trucks have different bell housings, etc. Need a V10 or diesel donar.

 

Thanks for that info good to know that, but is the NV5600 the same mo matter what it's behind?

only differences  will be  if they are configured for  2 or  4 wd,    (output/tailhousing)    and   if  they have either the  1.25 or  1.375"  input

 

So,   I guess   that's  kinda when  the  HO  engines  came out too..    and  the   larger  input shaft  upgrades.     

5600's  need the wide  crossmember,  yours will have the narrow one.   4500's  will work either way,  as long as the  rubber mount is the correct one

Now,  I almost forgot,  you may have to  change your input gear on your   TC,   to go from   auto to the manual.   Not  a  tuffy,  but  chances are, if you find  a donor, or  a  'kit'  offered by someone who is parting out  a truck,  just  snare the whole  assembly,  tc and all.

 

Plus,  If you want to get rid of your   column shifter,  and  make it  look correct,   You'll need the column too...  ugg,  more crap to swap!    If you really want to do it up..  then there's the   dash too  (PRNDL)

your  pcm  currently runs  your auto    trans... and  simply unhooking it will cause  'check engine'  light to come on..   

 

 

As  far as the   actual transmission,   an  NV 5600  is an  NV5600..ok, make sure  it's for your  configuration ie  2 or 4wd..   BUT,   the  bellhousing    is different  on the  small gasser versions.

 

V10's   and  diesel bells   are the same,  but  make sure you get a  diesel  flywheel.     These engines  are balanced differently.   (internally vs. externally)

I'd recommend you finding a   ~2001.5    and newer   nv5600,   They'll  have  a   1 3/8ths  input, and  better  synchronizer rings.  (finding the  old style  ring has been  hard,  almost have to  retrofit the whole trans  for a  rebuild then.)  might as well   start with  something  that has parts  fairly plentiful.

 

 

edit;    make that  ~ 2000.5  on the  larger  input size.       7/11/00    SUPPOSED to be the   split date

So it's not really a simple swap then is it? Lots of factors that one has to be aware of, thanks for the enjoyable read & info!

Not easy, that's why a donor truck is most desirable.

well,  yes and  no..    

I consider an  'easy' swap,  in which case  old  parts  are   unbolted, and  the new desired parts  bolt right  into place..  

 

'hard'  is  where I consider you have to do  fabrication/cutting/welding/rewiring...  in order  to   stuff  something  into where it  was never intended... 

Well, many variables to make it all pull together nicely. it could easily turn into a winter project w/o a donor vehicle, even still!!!!

 

I've had a few manuals out for clutches & stuff but never a swap from auto to stick on a so called simple/easy one. It would be nice to have a friend close by if I did do one myself. I wonder if I could find the swap on YouTube maybe?

 

Thanks guys, a 12V 98 5-speed would be the bomb!

Well, many variables to make it all pull together nicely. it could easily turn into a winter project w/o a donor vehicle, even still!!!!

 

I've had a few manuals out for clutches & stuff but never a swap from auto to stick on a so called simple/easy one. It would be nice to have a friend close by if I did do one myself. I wonder if I could find the swap on YouTube maybe?

 

Thanks guys, a 12V 98 5-speed would be the bomb!

I thought you were  thinking 6 speed,  no matter,    It's still the  same  swap..  just have to   get the  right   parts..  a donor  sure  comes in handy!    If you bugger anything up on the dismantling of the  donor,  you'll know what NOT TO DO  when  the wrenches  attack the  'good' truck!!    One thing for sure,  you'll LEARN a LOT about your  rig  during this process!

 

     I did  a  quick search on   ebay and  searchtempest,   and  there were  only a couple of  guys  wanting to TRADE their  autos,  for manuals..   nothing  today  for a  'swap setup'..   That can change  pretty fast!  keep your eye out.

Check your boneyards  especially the  smaller  mom and pop type,   They  tend to  'have time'  for  our  type of requests

You could  go ahead and  upgrade the  4500  whilst it's  awaiting it's new home home;    large input shaft, and one of the  5th gear nut  fixes

A 6-spped may be on it's way for me from a 2001!

A 6-spped may be on it's way for me from a 2001!

 

And there ya go!       Let the games  begin!

There's several  threads on this matter on  CF,   a lot with   pics too.  Once you get past their  BS  of   'why'  or  'why not' of  this  project,   you may actually  get  some info!   (that's  why I like  www.mopar1973man.com )

I had in my mind  to go  6 speed the whole time  on my project truck,    but  didn't limit it to   the  NV5600...    a  G56  would've worked fine too.    I   waited until  I found  a  fairly close one,  and  for a good price.        I ended up with a  NV5600  for   450 bucks, needing  seals.    It  was actually  cheaper than a core,  so if  I do have to   abandon it,   (something  catastrophic  inside)  I'll be  ahead of the game.    I was told by my local salvage guy,  he'll allow   600  on this trans,  and  would sell me a  g56  for $1600

..........1600 bucks   towards  repairing  the  nv5600   about covers  the   bearings, syncros, and  seals....       

Good luck,  I   fully plan on  'abusing' my  welcome here  LOL,   with  pics  and  build-notes  on my   Ram  amalgamation..   So  let's see  who 'gets er done first' 

Cool, let the games begin! So would you please explain NV5600 & a G56. Mine is from a 2001, so what would that be? Someone mentoned to get that year because of the input shafts being larger

g56  was  introduced  to replace the  nv5600..     New venture  went  belly up.  (ummm,   'they had problems')      This was  also the  time  when   Mercedes   owned    Chrysler...    So    This   Mercedes  designed,  Brazilian built  trans  was     put into play..

 

The  g56 is  still 6 speed,   the ratios  are  dang near the same as  the  New Venture....    And  the  G56  has  been used  in  tons of  commercial trucks around the world...   It  uses  a  straighter  cut  gear,    which   is  noisier,  but  doesn't   put as much  lateral  pressure  on the  case..  (which  is   aluminum btw)     It's a perfectly fine  trans  for  what our  trucks  are designed for,    it's  when   the  trucks  are   attached to a   set of  drag slicks,   a  pulling sled,   etc,    is  when  things  get  goofy.

Nv's  have problems  with   lubrication,  bearings   will seize,   syncros   prematurely  go out...  

'56s   the gears  are  a little  whiney,    the  trans  'chirps'   in neutral,   and   the  case  will bust  under  extreme  usage..

There are  'fixes'  for  both.

 

As  far as the  larger input....   Your  2001  should  have it       1 3/8ths  inch     is  what the   splined area  will measure....   Yours  will also have the better  quality   synchronizers too.   This is good,  because  that  is  all that is  available  for   rebuilding  this  NV.     The old style  is 'gone'.    You'd have to  upgrade the whole trans to   newer specs  in order to  'rebuild'

1999  up to about  mid year 2000,  they had  1.25 inch  input 

Thanks for getting me up to speed on the 6speeds Rancherman. What should I use as far as fluid? I don't know yet if it's been changed.

Thnx,

Dave

Change it now.  LOL

 

 

Our  6 speeds  run hot..   and   oxidation  (cooking of the oil)   breaks it down.    

 

THE  most  recommended is  the  MOPAR   trans  fluid.   This is  for the  operator  that  follows  the recommended  change interval...   It's  pricey,  but  what isn't these days???

 

Now,   on the other hand   I've read  tons of  posts  on  CF  about guys  running    various   alternatives;    Pennzoil,  amzoil,  all the major oil companies  have  some sort of   synthetic  gear lube available....plus   many I've surely missed.

One  thing  is  common  in these  "non mopar"  oils...  and that is to change it  more frequently.     Since  I'm  about 100 miles  from a dealer,  I've  begun to run  Delo   gear lube,    about  50%     50wt.  and  50%   15w40, just because  I'm close to a  vendor.    These are  synthetic  gear lubes,  NOT engine oil!  

I  plan  on  changing out the fluids   yearly..  regardless of  miles.    It may pay dividends to  do the  same  with Mopar fluid too!

 

When I  replaced  my last  nv5600,  I got it  from  an outfit  from Memphis Tenn.   They   raised the  fill plug  a couple inches for  better lubrication.   Some guys  will  take the shifter off to do the same thing.  (that's a lot of screwing around to add an additional  2 quarts!) 

It  may be easier to  jack up  one side of the  truck,  or  find  a  steep bank to  park the truck on to   overfill the  trans.

I just  thought of  a trick that may work:  screw in a  street L,  pointed up,  in place of  the  fill plug.  The added height will give you  an additional  2 inches  of  oil,      Just keep  adding oil until it wont  flow away,  and  put a   plug in the top of the  street L.  

A  street  'L'  is  just  a simple   90 degree  pipe coupler,   with  male threads on 1 end(part that screws into the trans)  and  female threads on the other (where the  plug would go)

 

The additional oil  helps  keep the trans  cooler,  and  takes  more  to  break down the  oil that is  there...  plus  keeping that  input  needle bearings  totally    lubed  is  the  main  culprit  In our 6 speeds.

In  'normal'  non  od  trans,   most  miles  are  in 'high'....  or  straight through.   Everything is  turning at the same speed, along the mainshaft.

Now,  on  OD  type trans,    most miles  are still in 'high',  but  this time,  the  small  needle bearings  in the  input shaft are forced to  turn....  and  turn  very fast they do!      This  is  where  extra oil  comes in handy!

My old  5600  had the  input shaft welded so badly to the main shaft,  they had to torch it in 2  to  get it out...

Edited July 5, 201410 yr by rancherman

Excellent advice Rancherman, how many quarts should I buy? Street L, I like that idea, 3/8 or 1/2 inch pipe? Hope it's not metric.

Thanks,

Dave

factory specs  are   4.75  quarts.    I'm  putting   a full  6  in  with the  raised  fill port

 

You'll  easily  get  5 in   by   parking on a  tilt,  without   any modifications