New developments on turbo diagnosis and a surprise!

[woodtrucker]

I got a surprise call from the PO of my 07 mega cab tonite and boy was it a surprise! 

He gives me the history on my truck and wow, it answered all my questions about a 6.7 and I've solved the EB not working mystery! 

 

He says:

-It's got a category 5 suncoast rebuilt transmission. Said he hauled a heavy load on original trans and messed something up and immediately had the category 5 rebuilt transmission put in with a package deal they were doing at the time with H&S tuner. He said it was good to either 500 or 700hp. I think 500. Claims this was an $8k tranny that he was really bummed about just letting go with the truck. He wanted to replace it with a stock one but just decided he didn't want to go through with all that and told I had a really great truck that should last a long time. 

 

-He also said it was deleted in 2011. Not sure of mileage at that time. probably around 100k. Has 160k on it now and new turbo since it's been deleted and ccv reroute so turbo has never seen any junk. 

 

-He also said the reason exhaust brake wasn't working was that he had the turbo replaced and it needs dealer to set it up. I'm assuming that means it either needs to be calibrated or enabled in pcm? or both? So will a dealer be able to understand exactly how to do this? It definitely explains why turbo seems to spool correctly but exhaust brake doesn't work. 

 

Should I return truck to stock before the reflash to enable exhaust brake if that is the problem? Or Should I just ask them to calibrate and see if that gets it online? 

Thanks guys and for the record I trust answers on this forum more than anyone so thanks for being so good at cummins diesels y'all! 

 

 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

This would be in @Me78569 realm he would know a little about the VGT turbo setup.

[woodtrucker]

Thanks. I am thinking if the vgt was replaced, he likely bought it and the actuator together as a unit and it was probably pre-calibrated. Seems like most direct replacements/reman's come pre calibrated so you slap it on and go. So the fact that turbo is working fine and exhaust brake not on, I'm of the opinion that it just needs to be enabled by the dealer. I don't want them to get into doing a calibration because it's working fine just no exhaust brake. 

 

@Me78569 knows more than a little about vgt set ups! lol. I'm anxiously awaiting his response to this post. I have been working/learning on all this for a month and I was so thankful the PO called me last nite. Set my mind at ease on a lot of things related to the truck that I didn't know and helped me solve the exhaust brake issue! 

[Me78569]

Just build the calibration tool,. It's less than $50 to do it.  Smae thing as the dealer would do

[woodtrucker]

Thanks for response. If turbo is precalibrated then exhaust should work unless it's disabled in ecm correct? Why would I need to use calibrate tool? Sorry this is all new to me. Turbo works fine just exhaust brake not working. I'd rather buy the cal tool and use your instructions but if turbo was purchased with actuator pre-calibrated I wouldn't need to calibrate it correct? 

Can the cal tool enable/disable tool? Dealership wants $125 to do the enable if that is the problem. smh...

 

[Me78569]

you can't buy an actuator precalibrated without it being installed on the turbo.  If the actuator comes off the turbo you need to calibrate once you put it back on.  

calibration finds the full open and full closed position of the actuator, as the motor does not have any  "limits" it just spins

[woodtrucker]

He told me he replaced entire turbo with one that had cleanout port etc. so in that case it’s an enable issue right? He didn’t just replace the actuator. He bought a new turbo and actuator together. But I think you answered my question bc an entirely new turbo and actuator would mean it is calibrated and probably exhaust brake is disabled in ecm. I am still thinking the reflash done in 2012 might have disabled it. I don’t mean to be difficult here but according everybody that sells these entire vgt turbos they are supposed to be plug and play on the calibration end. 

[Me78569]

i've seen brand new turbos need to be calibrated.  I have a friend with a diesel shop has to use his snap on tool all the time for new 6.7 turbo installs.


the calibrate tool can't enable/disable,  As far as I am aware of is there is no "switch" to disable the EB function in the ecm.  The eb function is just a map in the ecm that tells the turbo how closed to go based on engine rpm.  Here is udc pro showing the eb control on a 6.7l you could flat line the tune, but the Dealer wouldn't be able to undo that without flashing the ecm back to stock.    The Dealer wouldn't flash to disable EB functions.

 

 

 

you are guessing either way I suppose, but dont rule out a new turbo needing to be calibrated.

[woodtrucker]

Doesn't make sense to flat line a tune to the point to disable EB all together. What you are saying makes sense for sure. 

I found another post that discusses the rebuilt turbos requiring dealer calibration in order to work so it certainly can't hurt to go ahead buy the components and do the calibration myself. At least I'd have it for the further when the enevitable comes back around again and I have slider ring problems! lol. 

Would I need to remove the actuator to calibrate since it's already installed and likely in the correct position.I'd be afraid I would screw it up when it's already in the correct position and maybe just needs to be run through the sequence. 

It's a less expensive option to just try calibrating anyway and at least I'll have everything. I really appreciate the help and I'll donate a few bucks to you for your help!

[Me78569]

nope just pass the calibrate command while the actuator is on the turbo.  It just tells the actuator to find the high low limits of movements.   

'

 

I personally dont believe you need to set the turbo to central position before activation.  I think holset was smart enough tojust check for high and low limit of movement and use that for eb vs wide open

Edited July 19, 2018 by Me78569

[woodtrucker]

Cool man. I saw where you posted on cummins forum about this very thing! Sorry to make you post it again to me. I was about to go delete that but you already responded. I'm headed over to the article now to get parts on order. I'm so excited I'll just postpone my lunchtime run and do it tonite! I wanna get this stuff on order so I can get my eb back in time for the several camping hauling episodes I have coming up! Thanks again for the help and I'll let you know how the calibration goes!

 

[woodtrucker]

Canbus Shield V2.0 is all that is available on SEED website. 

What about this one on amazon?

https://www.amazon.com/MakerFocus-Makerfocus-CAN-BUS-Shield-V1-2/dp/B00T3XPH6C

Or should I get the V2.0? I can machine parts and do 3d printing and mechanical design but this electrical stuff involves too many electrons for me to be comfortable!  PM me your address. As I'm working on a 3d printer calibration, I'll send you a couple of these as I get some done. 

Edited July 19, 2018 by woodtrucker

[Me78569]

Either should work, the difference is normally just what pin you talk through.  I'ved use 4 or 5 different boards and they all work once you get the right pin. 

 

[woodtrucker]

All parts have been ordered. I'm excited about the prospects of getting this brake working. It sure is nice to have someone with your expertise helping us out on these really cool trucks and I'm a fan of VGT. I'd really like to get it going like it's supposed to and how cool would it be if I hook all this up and do a 5 min cal at home get that brake back online! 

And I have the unit built for future troubleshooting as well. I can kick the dealer aside once again. I live for being able to do that so I hope you are correct for that reason only! 

[Me78569]

i've been wrong before hahah.  

you should be able to command full closed position with the tool and verify if the actuator is moving that far or not.  If it isn't then you start looking at the tune for some sort of max close limit in place.  

 

the ecm doesn't ask the turbo for EB mode it just says close to x point.  

[Guest 04Mach1]

10 hours ago, woodtrucker said:

He told me he replaced entire turbo with one that had cleanout port etc. so in that case it’s an enable issue right? He didn’t just replace the actuator. He bought a new turbo and actuator together. But I think you answered my question bc an entirely new turbo and actuator would mean it is calibrated and probably exhaust brake is disabled in ecm. I am still thinking the reflash done in 2012 might have disabled it. I don’t mean to be difficult here but according everybody that sells these entire vgt turbos they are supposed to be plug and play on the calibration end. 

I can't speak too much about the VGT actuators on the Chrysler ISB6.7 but on the Cummins ISB6.7 using HE351VE turbo and on the bigger Cummins like the ISC, ISL, and ISX that use the HE400VE and HE500VE turbos you have to calibrate the actuator anytime it's disconnected from the ECM using Insite. It is impossible to calibrate a VGT actuator off the truck without the ECM.  Maybe the Chrysler Cummins ECM is different from the Cummins Cummins ECM but I haven't messed with too many Ram 6.7 turbos. Just sharing my  if it's even worth that. 

[Me78569]

36 minutes ago, 04Mach1 said:

I can't speak too much about the VGT actuators on the Chrysler ISB6.7 but on the Cummins ISB6.7 using HE351VE turbo and on the bigger Cummins like the ISC, ISL, and ISX that use the HE400VE and HE500VE turbos you have to calibrate the actuator anytime it's disconnected from the ECM using Insite. It is impossible to calibrate a VGT actuator off the truck without the ECM.  Maybe the Chrysler Cummins ECM is different from the Cummins Cummins ECM but I haven't messed with too many Ram 6.7 turbos. Just sharing my  if it's even worth that. 

 

 

The reason for that is the Insight tells the ecm to tell the turbo to calibrate.  If the turbo isn't on the truck the ecm doesn't know it is there and thus can't pass it a calibrate command.   

[Guest 04Mach1]

Makes sense. 

[woodtrucker]

Ok. I'm passed an led command to the arduino! Pretty cool stuff. I haven't fooled around with this type of stuff before but I have done a fair amount of hardware work on computers. This is going to be a cool set up to use and as I said, a donation is headed your way for figuring out all this for a cheap set up to calibrate. I only am having one problem. I cannot seem to get the turboreset.ino to load. It's a dead link on this website. Do I need to make the donation before using this file? Can't right click and save as .ino either. 

Double clicking does not launch Arduino software. 

I'd like to load up everything and uplug then bring it all home after work today and plug up to the turbo. Would you also happen to know what type of criimp tool is need for the connectorizing? I have an EE that will likely have it but I'd like to borrow it from him to take home so I can crimp the connector on when I get home. That might mean that I can set this thing up tonite and do a cal which would be incredible! 

[woodtrucker]

Check that. I just copied and pasted and was able to upload it via the Arduino so I hope to go home after work today and connectorize and hook up power to turbo and usb to arduino and hopefully it will do a full calibration! 

Thanks,
Scott