Propane Injection.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Propane is a three-carbon alkane, normally a gas, but compressible to a transportable liquid. It is derived from other petroleum products during oil or natural gas processing. It is commonly used as a fuel for engines, oxy-gas torches, barbecues, portable stoves and residential central heating.

A mixture of propane and butane, used mainly as vehicle fuel, is commonly known as liquefied petroleum gas (LPG or LP gas). It may also contain small amounts of propylene and/or butylene. An odorant such as ethanethiol or thiophene is added so that people can easily smell the gas in case of a leak.

Energy content

The energy density of propane is 46.44 megajoules per kilogram (91,690 BTU per gallon).

Weight per gallon

The density of propane at 25 degrees C is .493 grams per cubic centimeter. Converting gives 4.11 pounds per gallon. Thus, Propane weighs approximately 4.2 (+/- 0.1) pounds per US liquid gallon, at 60 degrees Fahrenheit. Propane expands 1.5% per 10 degrees F.

Price per gallon (from an internet search)

10/18/2010 Prices range from a North Dakota average of $1.62 to a Rode Island average of 3.26

Marketing description from ParleysDieselPerformance.com

“Diesel Propane Injection – Propane injection for diesel engines is a time tested way to safely improve your horsepower and increase your diesel fuel mileage. When used properly, propane injection will keep your engine cleaner with less carbon buildup and cleaner oil. Propane is a high octane fuel. The slower and longer burn of propane helps your diesel fuel burn more thoroughly, increasing power, torque and fuel mileage. This is one of the best performance modifications for towing, since the use of some performance chips can lead to excessive exhaust gas temperatures when hauling large loads at high speeds, especially up significant grades. With a diesel propane injection system burning propane at approximately a 1:4 ratio to diesel fuel (1 gallon propane per 4 gallons diesel) the increase in exhaust gas temperatures will be minimal and the fuel economy gains will typically pay for the cost of the propane. Propane injection will work for all diesel engines including older mechanical systems.”

Marketing claims

Adds up to 100 Horsepower & 100+ Ft. Lbs. Torque

Substantial fuel economy gains (notice the subjective wording)

Excerpt http://moparmuscle.automotive.com/67354/mopp-0604-2001-dodge-ram-propane-injection/index.html (without permission)

Propane Injection For Dodge Ram Cummins Turbo Diesel - Propane - It's Not Just For Grilling Anymore

Installing MSD's Digital Propane Injection On Your Cummins-Powered Truck

By Dave Young

“We tested the system with the truck both loaded and unloaded and were impressed with the improvement in acceleration. We initially programmed the system to give us 100-percent capacity at 5 pounds of boost and expected to feel the system's "hit" when the propane was added. The system operated seamlessly, however, and the only indication that it was working was the speedometer's rapid acceleration to not-quite-legal speeds. Even when only programmed to 50-percent capacity while towing our 10,000-pound, enclosed car trailer, we found we had power to spare. No matter what incline we climbed, simply rolling into the throttle produced not just sustained speed, but acceleration, with transmission downshifts now a thing of the past. Exhaust temperature was also noted to be some 50 degrees cooler for a given driving parameter. A quick trip down the eighth-mile showed an improvement of six-tenths of a second and 5 mph when using the propane, with traction now limiting how hard we could launch the truck. Amazingly, it also makes economical sense to use the system when driving daily.

As a function of the extra power on tap, the economy of our truck improved drastically. In a controlled test at 65 mph, our highway mileage in an unloaded truck with the propane shut off was 24 mpg, not bad for a heavy dualie. With the propane injection on and set to initiate at five pounds of boost and give 50 percent of the systems capacity, our mileage increased to an amazing 44 mpg (factoring the diesel fuel used only)! Over a 100-mile test, we used 6 pounds of propane from our 30-pound tank, which cost $18 to fill at the local propane supplier, so the propane used for the test cost $3.60. Diesel fuel for the 100 miles was 2.27 gallons at $3 per gallon for a total of $6.82 in diesel fuel. Added together we get a total of $10.42 for the 100-mile test using propane. Without propane, we used 4.17 gallons of diesel at $3 per gallon for a total of $12.50, so we saved over $2 on a 100-mile test using propane. In addition to the cost savings, the use of propane provided us added range, which allowed us to shop for fuel, saving additional money because we now could go to the next exit or even the next state to find cheaper fuel. Even better results were obtained when towing-we saw mileage increase from 14 mpg without propane to 24 mpg when using propane injection. Our truck's range now had no problem exceeding the endurance of our bladder, even while towing our car trailer. We can derive mathematically that it doesn't take too long for the system to pay for itself, especially when diesel fuel in our area is hovering around the $3-per-gallon mark.”

Wow, that’s a 55% fuel economy increase with an unloaded truck, and a 58.3% increase with a 10,000 lb trailer.

Hmm… If all this can be taken at face value, the $800.00+ cost of the system could be worth the effort financially.

Water/Methane Injection

Marketing description from ParleysDieselPerformance.com

“Provides better fuel economy (1-3 MPG), more power (50-100 HP), and lower Ehaust Gas Temperatures (150°-300° F)”

Cost of Methane

$33.80 + shipping for 5 gal. http://www.worldwideracingfuels.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=790072

Marketing description (FAQ) from snowperformance.com http://www.snowperformance.net/faqs_type.php?type=diesel

1. What are the benefits of Water/Methanol injection?

1. Greatly reduced EGTs - Decreases of 250 degrees F are common using a 50/50 water/methanol mix. Increased EGTs are an engine killer in today's performance diesel world.

2. Low cost power - Where else can you get 50-100 HP for as low as $549? What other modification does all these things with one system?

3. Greatly increased air charge densities - 3-5 psi boost increases are common with liquid intercooling.

4. Decreased emissions - increased combustion efficiency means less particulate matter and NOX emissions.

5. Fuel economy increase - increase your fuel economy up to 10%-15% (1-3 mpg).

6. Great for towing - more power/cooler EGT's to haul the heaviest loads.

2. Why is Water/Methanol injection so effective on Diesels?

Unlike gasoline engines, the power in a turbo diesel is largely a function of fuel. The problem with continually adding fuel is that you create an over-fueling condition and reach a point where the exhaust gas temperatures become prohibitive (over 1300 degrees F). A 50/50 water/methanol mix will decrease EGT's approximately 200-300 degrees F while increasing power 50-100HP.

Power is increased through:

• Air charge cooling - Water/methanol usually lowers air charge temps over 200 degrees F. Low air temps makes denser air charge which provides more molecules of oxygen for combustion.

• Combustion conditioning - the methanol acts as a combustion catalyst as well as a cooling agent. Water vaporization inside the combustion chamber increases torque and power output through "the steam engine" effect.

Where else can you get this kind of power with cooler EGT's, reduced emissions, and more fuel economy?

3. Is this technology new with Turbo Diesel?

Water/methanol injection has been used extensively for years in high performance truck/tractor pullers. With the elevated boost levels required for peak power, water/methanol is a common means of cooling the intake charge and reducing exhaust gas temps. Also, truckers have used water injection for years to increase fuel mileage.

4. What power gains can I expect?

In diesel applications, no additional tuning is needed to maximize the benefits.

• A cooler, denser air charge is now delivered to the combustion chamber – this allows more diesel fuel to be burned than before.

• The methanol in the injection fluid burns as a fuel. This directly impacts power production.

• The water vaporizes in the combustion chamber, creating rapidly expanding steam which pushes down on the piston to create additional torque.

The extra power produced depends heavily on the concentration of methanol used and the volume injected. Typical power gains in 5.9L and larger applications with a 50% mixture of water/methanol are 50-100 WHP and a 100-150ft lb-ft increase in torque.

5. Can the Snow Performance system improve my fuel economy?

Yes. The MPG-MAX™ systems are designed to do just that. Both the diesel and gasoline MPG-MAX™ systems are specifically designed to inject a very small and precise amount of water/methanol under normal driving conditions such as accelerating away from a stop light or driving up a slight grade.

• Diesel MPG-MAX systems benefit from the methanol directly due to the fact that it combusts as a fuel, allowing for brake specific fuel consumption (BSFC) to be reduced. Typical gains are 10-15% better fuel economy or 1-3 MPG. In some cases and in independent testing, gains of up to 30% have been observed in diesels.

6. What fluid can I use in my system?

• Boost Juice®: This is the best fluid to use and is Snow Performance’s 49% methanol, 51% water mixture that can be shipped to your door or picked up at a local dealer. (If you are using your washer reservoir as the injection tank, Boost Juice® is a great washer fluid – works as a de-icer!)

• Windshield Washer fluid: Only if it is blue in color and rated for -20 deg F. This means it is safe to use and made of about 30% methanol, 70% water. If it is another color or another temperature rating, do not use it. It should NOT have any extra additives or features.

• You can “spike” your Blue -20 Washer fluid to a 50% mixture by adding 3 12OZ yellow bottles of Heet® gas-line-antifreeze to every gallon of washer fluid.

• Mix your own: You just need to make sure the methanol is “neat” and contains no lubricants or other additives. We recommend a 50% mixture.

• Ethanol: It is not as good as methanol, but it can be used as a 2nd best option if you can’t find methanol. It can also be mixed with water up to 50%.

• Do NOT use E85 or any other fluid with gasoline mixed in. It will destroy the fluid delivery part of your Boost Cooler® and instantly void the warranty.

• Isopropyl/Denatured Alcohols: These can be used, but are not as good as methanol. They have a lower BTU, or energy content, and a lower latent heat of vaporization (fancy way of saying how much heat they absorb) as well as a lower octane rating compared to methanol.

7. Why Methanol?

Methanol is an extremely clean fuel with an excellent cost/benefit ratio. Its high latent heat of vaporization also makes it an excellent air charge cooler which means a denser mixture and more horsepower. Because of these characteristics, it is a better fuel than ethanol or isopropanol although they will work in a pinch. It is extremely toxic and should be handled with rubber gloves in well ventilated areas only. Care should be taken to avoid skin contact.

8. Is Methanol Safe for my Diesel?

Methanol makes an excellent adjunct fuel. Because it has a cetane number of 4CN, it makes safe power without spiking cylinder pressures.

50/50 water/methanol is also very resistant to detonation. It is in fact used as a detonation suppresant in our gasoline systems. This allows for injection without worries about pre-ignition even in very high boost applications such as sled pulling and drag racing.

"combustion of neat methanol alone results in a cetane number of 4CN with reduced PM (smoke) and NOx. " see SAE Technical Paper #940326 "Combustion and Emissions Characteristics of Minimally Processed Methanol in a Diesel Engine"

9. Where can I purchase methanol?

• Snow Performance sells a 51/49 water/methanol mix as Boost Juice™ (see products). If this is used exclusively, Snow Performance can lifetime warranty a system so long as the free registration card is sent in soon after purchase.

• Methanol can generally be purchased where racing fuels are sold. Also, most gas line dryers like "Heet" are simply methanol. Suppliers of industrial chemicals can also supply methanol for a very reasonable price.

• -20 degree F rated, blue windsheild washer fluid is acceptable for use as well, and is availble at most service stations. Although some fluids rated to under -20 degrees F contain glycol and other copolymers, most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% methanol. Try to find one that displays "contains methanol" on the label and is good to -20 degrees F, with no additives or special ingredients and is blue in color.

• Methanol can be purchased on the web at www.worldwideracingfuels.com and www.hiperfuels.com.

• Additionally, many sprint car drivers and circle track and drag racers use methanol as a primary fuel. They often have methanol on hand and will even sell methanol that has been un-sealed for a long time at a very low price. Just be sure that the methanol has NO additives or lubricants (such as top lube), as they are not needed and can damage the pump.

10. Can I use pure methanol?

While all components of Snow Performance systems are designed to be able to handle pure methanol, it is not recommended for a number of reasons.

• Safety: Straight methanol is easy to ignite and burns with an almost invisible flame.

• Performance: Water absorbs twice as much heat as methanol in the intake and inside the combustion chamber. Water cannot be flash-ignited, so has almost an infinite octane number. In the government studies for WWII piston-powered aircraft, 50/50 water-methanol was found to be the best fluid to use for auxiliary fluid injection.

• Tuning and Engine reliability: Injecting 50/50 water-methanol will prevent over-injection. If too much is injected, it will quench the flame front and the engine will bog and lose power. If too much straight methanol is injected, this will not happen, as methanol is very forgiving of rich mixtures. This could instead lead to explosive backfires, cylinder wash, etc. which will not happen when 50% or more water is in the mixture.

11. How much range will a tank of Water/Methanol provide?

Diesels use more fluid than a gasoline application, and are in heavier load states more often.

• On a Stage 1 or 2 system, the factory washer fluid tank on a pickup truck (usually 1-1.5 gallons) will last a tank of fuel. This is for normal mixed driving with no towing and some aggressive acceleration.

• On a Stage 3 MPG MAX™ used for towing, the 7 gallon reservoir (included with the MPG MAX™) usually lasts 1-2 tanks of diesel fuel. In an un-loaded state, the 7 gallon reservoir will provide about 1000 miles of range. When towing, the 7 gallon usually lasts about 500 miles.

• A standard Stage 3 system will use about 1 gallon of liquid for every 75 miles of towing. Many Stage 3 users take advantage of their stock washer tank or the special universal fitting included in Stage 3 Snow Performance diesel kits with a custom large capacity tank. Be sure to use a solenoid upgrade for any reservoir mounted in the rear of the vehicle.”

So they say 3.5 gal of methane will last about 500 miles (towing) will keep the EGTs down and provide about 1-3 MPG increase for a cost of about $23.66 and unknown shipping costs in Methane. That’s right around $.05 per mile or around $.66 per gal of fuel used based on 14 mpg towing.

Questions I have.

First what are your (if any) experiences with either Propane or Water/Methane injection.

Is it cost effective?

Has anyone used both at the same time to both add power and keep cooler EGTs?

Is either one practical for everyday use with the added hassle of monitoring the reservoir tanks?

Jim

So if diesel is $3/gal and I use 14.5 and 21mpg, that is going from $0.21/mile to $0.14/mile. Over 1000 miles that is a difference of $64. 3 tanks at 21mpg would get you 2205 miles and save you $141 over the 14.5mpg tanks. The propane costs $30 to fill up at $2.50/gal.I think it is worth it

To me, it is totally worth it. I was filling up with diesel evey week and now I am filling up about every 3 weeks, and filling up with propane about every 6-8 weeks, depending on usage. I have towed heavy with mine and it helped alot. I towed about 13,000 lbs about 200 miles and got 15 mpg at 60 mph. I did this on 2 different occasions. After doing this, I had to fill the propane tank up, and refueled the truck 2 times. The more boost, the more propane you use, and yet, the more power you make.

What happens when you turn the truck off? I assume it just closes a solenoid valve. Any other things it does to prevent leak down?

To me, it is totally worth it. I was filling up with diesel evey week and now I am filling up about every 3 weeks, and filling up with propane about every 6-8 weeks, depending on usage. I have towed heavy with mine and it helped alot. I towed about 13,000 lbs about 200 miles and got 15 mpg at 60 mph. I did this on 2 different occasions. After doing this, I had to fill the propane tank up, and refueled the truck 2 times. The more boost, the more propane you use, and yet, the more power you make.

wow...mopar gets...23 to 24mpg's..just think what he would get with some propane?wow

wow...mopar gets...23 to 24mpg's..just think what he would get with some propane?wow

No kidding. Man thats neat stuff. ISX would be in the 40mpg range !!! HAHAHAHAHAHA

STODG73, I do have some questions.What size tank(s) are you using and where/how are they mounted?What sort of propane range are you getting compared to your fuel tank range? In other words how often do you find that you need to refuel with propane?How do you know when your propane is getting low? Is there a mountable indicator or gauge to put in the drivers view for monitoring while driving?What injection system do you have?Can you post pictures of the tank mounted in your truck?How difficult was the install of the whole system?You said "With propane you have to worry about predetonation. This will blow head gaskets with the increased pressures."Would you recommend installing head studs and a better gasket before/with the propane system installation? Since I've never experienced predetonation on a diesel what are the indicators that it's happening and what do you do to correct it?Do you feel there is any danger of propane detonation in the manifold?Lastly, if you didn't have the system on your truck, but knew what you now know about propane on diesels. Would you still buy and install a system for your truck?

STODG73,

I do have some questions.

What size tank(s) are you using and where/how are they mounted?

The tank size that I have is 12 gallons, and it is mounted under the crossover box in the bed.

What sort of propane range are you getting compared to your fuel tank range?

I get about 800 - 1200 mile per tank, depending on how I drive. I did a 1000 mile trip and used about 10.5 gallons of propane.

In other words how often do you find that you need to refuel with propane?

I try to fuel it up at about 10 % on the gauge.

How do you know when your propane is getting low?

There is a gauge mounted on the tank that I can see. If you run out of propane, there is no problem as you still are running on straight diesel.

Is there a mountable indicator or gauge to put in the drivers view for monitoring while driving?

I don't have a gauge inside the truck, I use the one on the tank. There are replacements for the gauge that I have that can be wired up for placement inside the cab.

What injection system do you have?

I have the one from Ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DIESEL-PROPANE-INJECTION-KIT-GAIN-UP-100-HP-NEW-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem27b5e3ad19QQitemZ170555321625QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Can you post pictures of the tank mounted in your truck?

In the picture the tank is under the crossover box.

How difficult was the install of the whole system?

The install wasn't that hard. I had to drill 4 holes in the bed of my truck, I hated doing this. Then I had to drill a hole in the intake, preturbo.

You said "With propane you have to worry about predetonation. This will blow head gaskets with the increased pressures."

Would you recommend installing head studs and a better gasket before/with the propane system installation?

What I meant with this was, it is very easy to turn up the propane to higher levels, i.e. the more the better concept(bad idea with propane), propane does burn faster than diesel, the piston will still be before TDC when pressures will start to spike and you will have a failure somewhere, typically headgasket. The injected diesel will ignite the propane, and since the propane is a gas it will be distributed around the cylinder just like air is, therefore the propane will help burn all the diesel that is injected. Currently, my truck is stock, no modifications to the engine. The only thing that I have done to it is propane injection and I use a SMARTY on fuel saver mode. I have to be careful with this setup because the SMARTY has very aggressive timing on the IP on level 1. I have also turned up the SMARTY to level 9 with as yet no problems.

Since I've never experienced predetonation on a diesel what are the indicators that it's happening and what do you do to correct it?

When I first installed the propane injection, I added a little too much and the engine started rattling more than usual. It sounded like it wanted to come apart, stall out, run very rough, blow a connecting rod, very bad things happening, or destroy itself. It ran like this for about 2 seconds before I let go of the button. After letting go of the button, the engine returned to normal idle speed. I did this while adjusting the propane system. Once you hear this sound, you don't ever want to hear it again. Depending on the system that you get, you turn down the propane.

Do you feel there is any danger of propane detonation in the manifold?

No, I don't feel like there is any danger of detonation in the manifold, due to the lack of an ignition source. The fire triangle, fuel-oxygen-ignition source, doesn't work. Now hypothetically, if there was a detonation in the intake manifold, the most likely fail point would be a intercooler boot. These are a weak spot, everything else is metal.

Lastly, if you didn't have the system on your truck, but knew what you now know about propane on diesels. Would you still buy and install a system for your truck?

Yes, I would still buy and install the system again. Soon, I will be installing a system on my dad's '93.

SASQCH, answers are in red, I think.

ISX, I have 2 electric solenoid valves on the system, one is at the tank that turns on with the key and main propane switch. The second one is at the propane regulator that is turned on by a Hobbs pressure switch, which is mounted to a boost bolt, and activated by boost pressure. There is no leakdown due to the fact that you are using a gas instead of a liquid.

When I was testing the system, I would push the override button, and the engine would smooth out considerably.

STODG73,The heater grids in the intake manifold are a potential ignition source. Will propane ignite from heat or does it need a spark/open flame?Thanks for the great first hand information.Jim

STODG73, The heater grids in the intake manifold are a potential ignition source. Will propane ignite from heat or does it need a spark/open flame? Thanks for the great first hand information. Jim

The propane might ignite from the grid heaters, I am not sure as I have not had this happen, the reason is that the propane is not available until boost/psi is built. This is a safety feature built in the system. There is a Hobbs pressure switch, set at 4 psi, that electrically controls the flow of propane through a solenoid. When you first start your truck, there is no boost available so the Hobbs switch is open/off(open circuit). When you develop boost, the Hobbs switch closes/on(closed circuit), 12 volt power flows to the electric solenoid(off-closed/on-open) that is attached to the propane regulator and propane is released into the intake. What this means is that you have to be making a minimum of 4 psi of boost before the propane is released. I added a second fuel cut-off solenoid at the tank for safety reasons also. This solenoid is hard mounted to the tank, via steel clamp and grade 8 bolt.

The problem most have is the DOT approved tanks that have to be filled. These are mounted in/on the truck solidly, usually between the frame rails for protection. Rburks is right, sometimes the propane distributor doesn't have long enough hoses to fill the tank on the truck, or the fill station is inaccessable to the big rigs. They do have remote fill hoses that you can purchase to relocate the fill point, yet they can only go so far. When I go to have mine filled, the hose that they use is barely long enough.

If using both propane and water/methanol is predetonation still an issue, or is it a propane only concern? Can they both be used at the same time and compound the results? Is the predetonation hazard dirrectly related to the diesel injection timing - will something that advances the diesel injection timing like this http://mopar.mopar1973man.com/cummins/2ndgen24v/mpg-fooler/mpg-fooler.htm be counterproductive. Or, can it be used at the same time as these upgrades? I have a feeling the predetonation at idle may have been caused by too much propane - the flash point of the propane was reached in the cylinder as the piston was still compressing (and super heating) the air and propane. By lowering the ammount of propane being fed to the engine enough (or delaying the introduction of propane until 4 PSI of boost is reached), it is deluted with enough air that it's no longer really flamable, and is only a combustion aid and simply helps the diesel to burn more completely. I wonder if the water/methanol injection aids in cooling the intake air enough to slow the predetonation as well.

Propane is not injected at idle, unless you have a positive pressure regulator. This is not a good idea. On my propane set up, the propane is not turned on until 2 psi of boost. I am not sure, but I think that diesel has a lower flash point than propane. I also think that propane helps with burning all the diesel.

I'm really liking the sound of this propane injection stuff. Propane is under $2.00/gallon here in Montana. Also it shouldn't cause any corrosion issues in the steel cylinder head like water/methanol can.

What is the deal for Propane in hazzardous locations? I know that there are some places where propane tanks are verboten! What would people do? Mount twin 30's (camper style) in the bed? I might be interested in meth/water injecting... no restrictions to carrying a case of wiper fluid.

The 30 lb propane tanks should not be used, as they are not DOT approved. I have not had a problem trying to find a parking spot for my truck as yet, and I know that eventually I will, and will deal with it at that time. I know that it will be a longer walk for me.

From what I've read it's best to draw the propane out of the tank in the liquid form like forklifts and vehicles converted to run on propane alone do. Then the regulator/evaporator meters out the correct ammount of gassios propane via a hose into the intake pre turbo. This way it prevents a splash of liquid propane making it threw the vapor style regulator (like on a grill tank) and blowing up your engine. Any good advice on companies that sell the liquid meassured kits? How about something that increases LP proportional to boost like the kit from ATS? Know of someplace to find a good price on a used 12 to 15 gallon LP tank for my truck bed? Thanks for the help. I'm learning a lot.

Since 1 gallon of liquid propane translates into about 265 gallons of gaseous propane, would you want even a little bit of liquid propane entering your engine? That is why I use the vapor side of the propane tank, as to not have a huge amount of liquid possibly getting into the engine. Also, most auto propane regulators have a heat port for the coolant flow, to heat the propane just in case any liquid got to the regulator. So, using the liquid side of the propane tank in your truck is very dangerous as there might not be enough heat from the coolant to flash the propane to gas before it hits that engine. Here is the Diesel Propane System that I am using. This system is working quite well for me. I also added another solenoid lockout valve and filter on my system at the tank for safety purposes. Look on Craigslist for DOT approved propane tanks that are from RV's, this way you are compliant with the regulations.

You are explaining the same idea as I am concerned about. I knew it needed to be heated by hot engine coolant to aid the evaporation and prevent the regulator from freezing. I didn't know that the systems already draw off of the vapor side and protect from the liquid LP getting to the engine. Sounds great! I'll start checking the local craig's list for a decent DOT approved tank, and maybe check the local salvage yards. The local propane shop sells used forklift tanks for about $100, and steel mounts are on e-bay for about $20. I could use one of those setups, but they aren't realy DOT approved.

I found my tank on Craigslist for $75. I just had to wire wheel it and repaint it.