03/05 injector spray angle

[organicfarmer]

G-DAY TO ALL!  i have the 04.5 Cummins and would like to uncover more facts/understanding about inj. nozzle spray angles. 

my inj. seem fine, but i [& perhaps you] want to sort out some questions on inj. options BEFORE i'm needing to replace.

A rather expensive replacement part!!   Lets do it right! 

 

as the title says, some use 03 inj. on 04.5+ eng.   i'm thinking of a moderately mod.ed eng. [not 500++ hp]

would i lose hp [305 vs 325 hp]? 

at what hp level dos the spray angle become a danger? [assuming it does]

........................................................................

[AH64ID]

The spray angle is matched to the piston bowl shape. The 03-04 spray angle can be used in the 04.5-07 bowl and it seems the results are good. The 04.5-07 nozzle cannot be used in the 03-04 piston thou. 

 

Personally I am not 100% sold on it, so my 0.02 is to stick with your OEM spray angle and when the time comes for new injectors use something in the 40-60hp range. 

 

Now the 03-04 piston/injector is a much better setup, but time will tell on the 03injector/05 bowl. 

[organicfarmer]

thanks! 

so, is the 03 inj. with the 05 piston not proven?

 

those pics are intristing!  actual take out photos??

[AH64ID]

It has been a couple years so I would guess it is getting proven. 

 

Yes those are actual pistons, 03 on the left 04.5 on the right. 

[organicfarmer]

would you know,... why do some folks use 03 tips on 600 cummins? what is the purpose?  

   i think i read that bbi does this.......maybe i was way to tired & read between the lines   that happens.

i'm not nessesarily  planing to  go this route, i just like to 'check the map' before i travel....less opp's that way!

did some digging last nite & seems some folks blamed this practlce for smoking more       thanks!

[AH64ID]

The piston/injector design on the 04.5-07 is a non-reentrant design and some folks are trying to make it re-entrant. Otherwise I am not 100% sure on the desire, maybe it's a stronger spray angle. 

 

BBi makes both and I have the 03 version; however, I have 03 style pistons. 

[organicfarmer]

i like the 8 hole nozzle! i have no prof that this helps, but it looks better!

 

The spray angle is matched to the piston bowl shape. The 03-04 spray angle can be used in the 04.5-07 bowl and it seems the results are good. The 04.5-07 nozzle cannot be used in the 03-04 piston thou. 

 

Personally I am not 100% sold on it, so my 0.02 is to stick with your OEM spray angle and when the time comes for new injectors use something in the 40-60hp range. 

 

Now the 03-04 piston/injector is a much better setup, but time will tell on the 03injector/05 bowl. 

[DESERTTOYHAULER]

If someone possibly swapped and early 04 long block into an 04.5 truck with 124* tips, how would it perform? I'm asking because I'm running out of ideas on why my truck hazes and smokes so bad.

[AH64ID]

What settings do you run on your Smarty?

[DESERTTOYHAULER]

Switch between SW3 (towing) & SW5 default with 75% POD. I switched to SW4 this morning to see if it smoked less w/o timing, but no change. It smoked/hazed bad before I added the smarty.

[Wild and Free]

My 05 was the same way, hazed fairly heavy all the time and then added smarty JR for several years and it cleaned up the easy driving haze but would down right belch black on hard romps more than stock and was about the same or maybe a wee bit more smoke while pulling heavy with the smarty jr.

I now have a Smarty touch and for some reason the thing is a lot cleaner overall.

[AH64ID]

It could have a tone ring mod or rokktech timing advance sensor. 

[DESERTTOYHAULER]

"It could have a tone ring mod or rokktech timing advance sensor."

 

I wasn't aware of the timing ring/sensor mod. I guess it was popular before the smarty software's were available? I'm not sure how I can tell if the sensor has been modified, but the ring will be obvious.

Edited April 20, 2016 by DESERTTOYHAULER

[Wild and Free]

Its been around since the 24v 2nd gens, was fairly popular early on for them for the guys not wanting to invest in an edge ez or similar, was a low cost option and simple way of adjusting the timing a wee bit.

[DESERTTOYHAULER]

Following up here.

 

Had a shop pull an injector to look at the piston bowl.....its the 03-04 style, my truck is an 04.5.....been spraying fuel outside the bowl at the top of the piston the whole time. My suspicions were correct. The motor had been replaced previously......bitter sweet because I finally know why my truck smokes, but now wondering about the motor that was put in, hopfully it was a low mileage unit....the motor runs very well considering, looking forward to getting some Stage 0.5 BBI's with the correct pattern for the pistons.

[AH64ID]

That would be why it smokes!

 

Thou it shouldn't be spraying outside the bowl, the 04.5-07 injector nozzle is a narrower spray pattern and sprays deeper into the piston. The diagram above shows this.