Hello from California

[1361]

Hello, I'm Dennis. I'm the original owner of my 2001 2500 quad cab long bed 4x4. It's currently stock except for the air filter, fass, smarty. The auto was rebuilt a few years ago planning on futures mods. 3.55 and with 3rd gen brakes, wheels and 265/70/17 tires. About 150k on the clock. Last trip towing my travel trailer (about 10k lbs), the turbo started acting up. That means upgrade time. I've paid the piper and now have a log list of parts on the way. Mostly from DAP. My plan is to do these upgrades in 4-5 install stages.

Stage 1, Exhaust manifold and HX35 62/64/12 turbo

Stage 2, Quad Adrenaline and gauges (gonna use an old ipad for them)

Stage 3, 100hp injectors, head studs and valve lash adjust/correction. I probably don't need the studs, but I'm in there.

Stage 4, Fleece Sureflo, redo lines from tank to fass to vp. Thinking about eliminating the canister, but I'm unsure if it will create problems/codes. Looking forward to having a working fuel gauge again. I might switch stage 3 and 4 around.

Stage 5, All the little things that have been neglected over the years. New drivers seat cover/cushion, new hood insulation, new grill...

 

The old girl is mostly just a work horse. Not getting near as much attention as she deserves. Four or five trips a year plus hardware store and dump runs. I recently turned down the opportunity to buy my brother in law's 2016 3500 4x4 limited long bed. I've loved his truck since he took delivery on it. That's pretty much what spurred on these upgrades. 40k for a used truck with 125k on it, or give the old girl some lovin. So here I am

 

Kind regards

Dennis

 

 

[Andyba20]

Sounds like a good plan, Dennis. Only feedback I’d offer is your stages might be out of order a little. I’d go 2, 3, 1, 4, 5. 

[IBMobile]

2 hours ago, 1361 said:

but I'm unsure if it will create problems/codes

If you wire the FASS fuel pump through a relay and the relay is triggered by the fuel pump wires from the ECM then no code will be set.

https://mopar1973man.com/cummins/articles.html/24-valve-2nd-generation_50/51_engine/59_fuel/installing-protective-lift-pump-relay-r501/?tab=comments#comment-55

 

Is the truck registered in a zip code where a California biennial smog test is required?

[Tractorman]

3 hours ago, 1361 said:

About 150k on the clock. Last trip towing my travel trailer (about 10k lbs), the turbo started acting up.

 

Dennis, welcome to the forum.  Turbos are usually pretty bullet proof.  Could you elaborate a bit more on "the turbo started acting up"?

 

- John

[1361]

5 hours ago, Andyba20 said:

Sounds like a good plan, Dennis. Only feedback I’d offer is your stages might be out of order a little. I’d go 2, 3, 1, 4, 5. 

The turbo is the only part that "needs" attention. That's why I thought I'd start there. I'm curious why you think I should do it later? I'm open to all suggestions.

2 hours ago, IBMobile said:

If you wire the FASS fuel pump through a relay and the relay is triggered by the fuel pump wires from the ECM then no code will be set.

https://mopar1973man.com/cummins/articles.html/24-valve-2nd-generation_50/51_engine/59_fuel/installing-protective-lift-pump-relay-r501/?tab=comments#comment-55

 

Is the truck registered in a zip code where a California biennial smog test is required?

Yes, smog tests are required here. Don't get me started on that one...

I looked at that link, I'm not the sharpest when it comes to electrical stuff. I'll have to see if I can figure that out. On a side note, are the colors only hard to read for me?

1 hour ago, Tractorman said:

 

Dennis, welcome to the forum.  Turbos are usually pretty bullet proof.  Could you elaborate a bit more on "the turbo started acting up"?

 

- John

Thanks for the welcome. About the turbo. I just changed the fuel and air filters before my last trip. The truck was running good. The turbo was singing climbing the grades. Then, the singing would change to almost like a dragging or grinding noise. Only intermittently. When I got off the freeway and was driving slower, I noticed she was really smoking when making that noise.  It only did this when the turbo was spinning. The more it spun, the more pronounced the sound would become. It remained an intermittent issue as I babied it all the way home. So naturally, I just figured it was turbo time.

[Andyba20]

9 minutes ago, 1361 said:

turbo is the only part that "needs" attention. That's why I thought I'd start there. I'm curious why you think I should do it later? I'm open to all suggestions.

Well the turbo you listed (62/64/12) is quite a bit bigger than your stock turbo which I assume is an HY35, so without having the tuner and bigger injectors it would be pretty laggy and smoky. Even with the tuning and injectors that turbo will feel laggy compared to a stock unit (maybe consider upgrading to a stock HX35 for an easy drop in turbo upgrade). Also, in my opinion, you won’t save any money by breaking that work into stages, so if you have the money now just do it all at once (meaning the turbo, injectors, tuner). 
 

If I was going to get a modified HX35 I’d get the savage fabrication Instaspool super 9 (especially with the 3.55 gears). Many will also recommend the GXE 57/65/12. Towing 10k I’d prefer to have my turbo spooling quicker, and the 2 above will do that. 
 

all that said, the Quadzilla opens up a lot of tuning capabilities to dial in most anything you want, so if you’ve already made your purchase it’s ok, there are guys on here smarter than me that can help you get everything running really well. 
 

I bought a 62/68/12 and I really wish I’d have bought the Super 9. 

[1361]

1 hour ago, Andyba20 said:

Well the turbo you listed (62/64/12) is quite a bit bigger than your stock turbo which I assume is an HY35, so without having the tuner and bigger injectors it would be pretty laggy and smoky. Even with the tuning and injectors that turbo will feel laggy compared to a stock unit (maybe consider upgrading to a stock HX35 for an easy drop in turbo upgrade). Also, in my opinion, you won’t save any money by breaking that work into stages, so if you have the money now just do it all at once (meaning the turbo, injectors, tuner). 
 

If I was going to get a modified HX35 I’d get the savage fabrication Instaspool super 9 (especially with the 3.55 gears). Many will also recommend the GXE 57/65/12. Towing 10k I’d prefer to have my turbo spooling quicker, and the 2 above will do that. 
 

all that said, the Quadzilla opens up a lot of tuning capabilities to dial in most anything you want, so if you’ve already made your purchase it’s ok, there are guys on here smarter than me that can help you get everything running really well. 
 

I bought a 62/68/12 and I really wish I’d have bought the Super 9. 

 

I'm not paying for the work, I'm doing this myself. That's why I'm doing it in stages. My truck wont fit in my garage. It's gotta be back in the driveway every night so I can close the garage door. I'm hopping to get the exhaust and turbo changed in one day. Maybe drive it for a few miles to insure everything is good. Rest a few days and let my wounds and old body heal. I did buy one of those topside creepers. I'm hoping it will help. Then I'll start on the next stage.  I'm hoping to get this finished by x-mas. maybe a week or two later. I start a training class at the end of Jan. and I wont have time for this. I need to get this done. Just gotta get over the hill to pick up parts. Stupid laws...

 

I was really looking hard at that super 9. I even called and talked to them. In the end, I decided to trust what jkidd said on CF.  Now I'm really bummed...

Do you think the HX35 62/64/12 is too much turbo for my setup. The Super 9 has a 3 week build time. If I change my mind, I need to do it right away.

 

 

[Andyba20]

Jkidd knows his stuff, I’m a little surprised he recommended that turbo, only because it seems like he recommends the SXE line 90% of the time. He doesn’t sell the Super 9. Maybe he is out of the 57 GXE? The Savage Fab guys are in California I believe, maybe they can get it to you quicker than 3 weeks. 

[1361]

40 minutes ago, Andyba20 said:

Jkidd knows his stuff, I’m a little surprised he recommended that turbo, only because it seems like he recommends the SXE line 90% of the time. He doesn’t sell the Super 9. Maybe he is out of the 57 GXE? The Savage Fab guys are in California I believe, maybe they can get it to you quicker than 3 weeks. 

 

Sheez, I've been looking at our interactions and now I'm wondering if I misunderstood him.  I received a message from a user on CP that mentioned that some smog techs were now being instructed to look for "Holset" on the side of the turbo. So I used needing a Holset turbo as one of my guide lines. Thats probably why the 57GXE wasn't mentioned. Dang it. Perhaps I should make this my first question in the 24v section. Thanks for your insight.

[Andyba20]

1 hour ago, 1361 said:

  I received a message from a user on CP that mentioned that some smog techs were now being instructed to look for "Holset" on the side of the turbo

That may very well be the case, I don’t have to deal with that in Tennessee so I wouldn’t know. 

[Me78569]

He did not recommend the 57 because it will not pass smog due to it not being a holset.

 

Everyone has their opinions, that doesn't mean either choice is "wrong"  the 62 modded hx will run good with the 100's and a quad the stock hx35 would also work good.  The 62 gains some up top the hx gains some down low.  

 

6 in one hand half dozen in the other.   

 

 

I think you will be fine with the 62, but you will be wanting those 100's to fuel it better.      I am not convinced the "super 9" is a better choice than the 62 you have.    the tighter exhaust housing will help spool, but you might run out of steam faster when towing up grades in the ~2500 rpm + area,    Also the super 9 requires an aftermarket down pipe which again depending on the smog tech won't pass.  

 

there is no free lunch with turbos each fits a specific range of use.  

 

Edited December 10, 2022 by Me78569

[Andyba20]

19 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

super 9 requires an aftermarket down pipe

They offer a “drop in” Super 9 so no need for a new down pipe. 

[Me78569]

26 minutes ago, Andyba20 said:

They offer a “drop in” Super 9 so no need for a new down pipe. 

I didn't see that specifically on their site, good to know. 

[Andyba20]

Just now, Me78569 said:

idn't see that specifically on their site, good to know. 

What I don’t know is what/if anything else is different between the drop in vs non drop in version, I just know they rate it up to 500hp which is more than I want/need anyway, especially for a tow rig with a single disc converter.

[Me78569]

the hx40 they rate at 600 hp so the drop is is a full 100 hp less.  This tells me there is significantly more restriction with the drop in.

[Andyba20]

@Me78569 question-in this scenario,  which turbo (Stock HX or 62) is moving more air at 2000 rpm’s? Subjective question, but thought you might know, generally speaking. 

[Me78569]

When not at cruise state the 62

[Tractorman]

20 hours ago, 1361 said:

About the turbo. I just changed the fuel and air filters before my last trip. The truck was running good. The turbo was singing climbing the grades. Then, the singing would change to almost like a dragging or grinding noise.

 

20 hours ago, 1361 said:

When I got off the freeway and was driving slower, I noticed she was really smoking when making that noise.  It only did this when the turbo was spinning.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would investigate the cause of the above-mentioned turbo performance issue before I started making any modifications to the engine.  You could have something simple such as a broken clamp on a hose connection on either end of the intercooler or at the intake plenum.  The leaking connection will only be heard under boost and the sound produced can vary widely.  And, of course, black smoke would come out of the tail pipe due to not having enough air for the amount of fuel injected.

 

If the turbocharger is found to be at fault (determined after a close inspection), then I would want to know what caused the failure and why before moving forward.

 

- John

[1361]

On 12/10/2022 at 4:54 PM, Tractorman said:

 

 

If I were in your shoes, I would investigate the cause of the above-mentioned turbo performance issue before I started making any modifications to the engine.  You could have something simple such as a broken clamp on a hose connection on either end of the intercooler or at the intake plenum.  The leaking connection will only be heard under boost and the sound produced can vary widely.  And, of course, black smoke would come out of the tail pipe due to not having enough air for the amount of fuel injected.

 

If the turbocharger is found to be at fault (determined after a close inspection), then I would want to know what caused the failure and why before moving forward.

 

- John

 

You know, you are 100% right. I've been a commercial driver for the most of my working life. I know what a broken clamp/hose feels and sounds like. It wouldn't be intermittent. But I just assumed this was the turbo and never really took anything apart to verify. I just jumped on the opportunity to upgrade. I can't pick up my major parts until this coming weekend. Plus, I have a few parts still arriving this week. I think I need to spend some time verifying what exactly is going on. Thanks for reminding me of that.

 

On a side note. My mechanic friend is trying to convince me into pulling the head and doing a head gasket and valve springs while I'm doing this. It's tempting to just spend the money and hand over part of the work. But I'm just too cheap. Plus being retired, I have more time than money. Probably sense too.  Especially if I end up with a problem later. What say ye with more knowledge than me? Run it doing one stud at a time, or do it all while I'm doing this? I'm already way over budget. I imagine paying him to do the head gasket and valve springs is gonna be at least another $k if not more.

[Andyba20]

45 minutes ago, 1361 said:

mechanic friend is trying to convince me into pulling the head and doing a head gasket and valve springs

I have nearly 300K on the factory gasket, you’re at 150K. Unless there is actual evidence of a HG issue I’d skip on that advice. I did head studs one at a time at 289K just to make myself feel better. I think machining the head, studs, gasket, valve springs plus labor would be closer to 3K. Seems like aftermarket gaskets are hit/miss these days, which is even more reason to stick with what’s working.