Ball Joint Help

[diesel4life]

I don't understand Spicers logic on making the uppers greasable but not the lowers. On the 00+ Dana 60's, the lower joint supports the entire weight of the front end while the upper is more or less there to hold alignment... My originals only lasted 70k before the lowers were toast so I elected not to go back to them.

 

If mine go bad again, I'll most likely go with the Dynatrac Pro Steers. A bit pricey but they are fully rebuildable joints.

[rancherman]

If  the logic  is  similar to non greasable   cardan joints,   It's  the  seal.    Non  greaseable    units  tend to have  a  much  tougher  seal,  because  they  don't  have to allow  grease to   pass  during   re lubing.      Otherwise    we'd  blow  the  seal.   

 

So  it's  probably  a   catch 22,       you  want the  best  seal,  or  the ability  to flush out  contaminants  when  the  seal doesn't  do the job? (as it  gets  older).

Edited January 25, 2015 by rancherman

[Dieselfuture]

I don't understand Spicers logic on making the uppers greasable but not the lowers. On the 00+ Dana 60's, the lower joint supports the entire weight of the front end while the upper is more or less there to hold alignment... My originals only lasted 70k before the lowers were toast so I elected not to go back to them.

If mine go bad again, I'll most likely go with the Dynatrac Pro Steers. A bit pricey but they are fully rebuildable joints.

Do you have link to dynatrac that fits 00-02 I looked and seems it only goes to 00 and then says 99 and newer but how can it be past 02 if in 03 they changed size of them, I confused.

[Dieselfuture]

If the logic is similar to non greasable cardan joints, It's the seal. Non greaseable units tend to have a much tougher seal, because they don't have to allow grease to pass during re lubing. Otherwise we'd blow the seal.

So it's probably a catch 22, you want the best seal, or the ability to flush out contaminants when the seal doesn't do the job? (as it gets older).

I agree but also I think in this design it's not going to matter as much on greasing as much on material it's made out of. Because of the size of lowers and 100% of load on them! they should really make them out titanium, but I guess no one would be able to afford them. Maybe dynatrac is something like that and that's why they are so much more money.

[Wild and Free]

Anyone ever try the Dyna trac ball joints? I hear they have been very good overall. I have the carli Ball joints in my 05 and need to replace tem again but I got the early version which they had metallurgy issues with and they warranty for life I just need to get hold of them for a new set some day.

[rancherman]

I agree but also I think in this design it's not going to matter as much on greasing as much on material it's made out of. Because of the size of lowers and 100% of load on them! they should really make them out titanium, but I guess no one would be able to afford them. Maybe dynatrac is something like that and that's why they are so much more money.

ya know,    even with   driveshaft  joints...  how many of  us  can claim  pretty close to 200k  on the original  joints,  (or more)    and   replacement   parts  are good  for    less than half!

Even if  they are greasable!   

   I'd be  really  impressed/surprised  if  the   replacement   spicer  ball joints  are the same  quality as  the originals.      I'm  sure  compared  to  other  replacement  brands  the spicers  are   top  notch...   But   I'd  bet  they are still  poorer  than the  originals  they  replaced.

[diesel4life]

Anyone ever try the Dyna trac ball joints? I hear they have been very good overall. I have the carli Ball joints in my 05 and need to replace tem again but I got the early version which they had metallurgy issues with and they warranty for life I just need to get hold of them for a new set some day.

No personal experience but have heard countless positive reviews on TDR, and generally speaking they are a very conservative group (compared to CF or CompD)

I wish they would have been available when I replaced mine.

[Dieselfuture]

ya know, even with driveshaft joints... how many of us can claim pretty close to 200k on the original joints, (or more) and replacement parts are good for less than half!

Even if they are greasable!

I'd be really impressed/surprised if the replacement spicer ball joints are the same quality as the originals. I'm sure compared to other replacement brands the spicers are top notch... But I'd bet they are still poorer than the originals they replaced.

I hear you, but isn't spicer are the ones that came on our trucks? Or you're saying that replacements are still poorer quality? I got Sadler Power Train 5 miles from me they have all of it on hand I'll go check them out and ask a bunch of questions, see how fast they kick me out I actually know most of them there, been dealing with them for 15 years or so, hopefully they give me some answers.

[diesel4life]

If  the logic  is  similar to non greasable   cardan joints,   It's  the  seal.    Non  greaseable    units  tend to have  a  much  tougher  seal,  because  they  don't  have to allow  grease to   pass  during   re lubing.      Otherwise    we'd  blow  the  seal.   

 

So  it's  probably  a   catch 22,       you  want the  best  seal,  or  the ability  to flush out  contaminants  when  the  seal doesn't  do the job? (as it  gets  older).

Well, maybe I drew the short end of the stick on the whole Spicer quality gig, but every single one of my universal joints and ball joints were replaced by the 80k mark. EVERY single universal on the rear driveshaft was worn due to lack of lubrication. The car done joint and universal on the front driveshaft were the same, and my ball joints squeaked so loud every time the wheel turned or suspension flexed it drove me insane! I'll never forget those ball joints, I could pull in a parking lot and heads were turning from the squeaking and that was OVER the noise of the engine! Every single joint was a matter of lubrication (or a lack there of) that pushed me away from Spicer and into a greasable joint.... And this was a truck that led a VERY easy life hauling a small slide in camper throughout the NY mountains in the summer and nestled up in a shop during the winter months...very easy 67k miles before I got a hold of it...

[rancherman]

I'm saying  just about  any  'replacement'  regardless if it's   a   shock absorber,   coil spring..  ball joints,   u joints..     all   are    a  tic  lower   than  the originals.

 

This day and  age,     the amount of   'parts'  being  built by   low bid   and  packaged  in     name brand  boxes   is  horrendous.   

 

When   a  spec  for  a  part  comes  from  the  auto manufacturer,     you better believe  the  Spicers,   Danas,    Saganaws,    etc,  are going to   make dang sure  it meets or exceeds  the spec...  They  don't want to lose  Chryslers  business.

 

Now  for   'replacement'  type  parts,    for  'out of  warranty'   service...  (what we are doing now)      It may look like a duck,  walk like a duck..

 

Example.. 

 

John Deere   stocks  a LOT  of  parts  for  tractors they built  40-50  years ago...   Do they  tool up and  knock off  a  bunch of   hard parts?   NO.

They  put out a  parts request  and  receive bids  on  this or  that.   They  spec out  what  the  gizmo  needs to be made out of,   machining  tolerances,  etc...  even  spec out  the formula  of  the color of  green  paint  and  thickness it  needs to be painted.

They no longer  need to take up valuable  space  for   the tooling,   warehousing, personnel,   and  the best part for them is;    They can reject  any part or  whole  batches  that  don't meet approval.

 

Lets  face it.    replacement  ball joints  for  our  2000-2002   rams   is   a  TINY  amount  in  a  HUGE  corporation.     Back when our  trucks  were rolling off the assembly line  in  blocks  of  hundreds  a day,   Spicer  probably  knew  how many they needed to supply for that production run.. and  built them  all in  a  couple days.   They probably  built  'x' amount over  the required amount,  (I bet the peanut counters  can  zero in on   SPR  (service parts required)     on  any amount  built for  assembly line  installation.

Edited January 26, 2015 by rancherman

[diesel4life]

Do you have link to dynatrac that fits 00-02 I looked and seems it only goes to 00 and then says 99 and newer but how can it be past 02 if in 03 they changed size of them, I confused.

I'm sorry I do not. I've only checked for my truck (98), I will get on and see if I can find a set for the 00+ Dana 60.