KATOOM

Not to hijack the thread but in relation to the OP topic..... Turbo cool down timers seem like a great option so ya wouldn't have to wait around for the truck to cool down to a desired EGT. But I tried one years ago and it was terrible. Not only did it cause some warning dash lights to come on upon shutting the truck off but you also couldn't lock the doors either which meant walking away from a running truck.....with the doors unlocked. Not something most people feel comfortable with, depending on where you live.

Great photos ISX. Tells the true tale about whats going on.And I think that CUMMINSDIESELPWR is right on the money regarding cumulative hot shutdowns. This would be something that would happen over a period of time for the average vehicle. Matter of fact, somewhere I was reading that another common problem with turbo engines is people who dont allow enough start up idle time for the oil to properly circulate through the engine and turbo before reving the engine or taking off. Until the oil is fluid, the turbo bearings are basically running dry but the shaft will still spin in relation to the engines RPM's. Bad for the bushing and shaft.

I have always been under the impression that conventional oils will coke under a "constant" temperature of around *400 whereby some synthetics can sustain around 100* more. So if this is actually accurate information, maybe Cummins listed the cool down time and temp considering and how long it would take the turbo housing to reach a safe temp. Dont know but I do know when I used to cook that everyday cooking oils/shortenings can self ignite at around 475*-500*.

Thank you ISX. I appreciate your compliments and I dont claim to be "right" or any smarter than anyone else either. I kinda think the whole oiled turbo bearing concept is a little archaic but it does work and work well. I actually thought that air cushioned turbo bearings were on their way, but then again I haven't been paying to much attention. Its just that the everyday person usually doesn't have the required patience to make sure they allow enough cool down time for their turbo vehicle. If you ever feel like checking you'll find that most mechanical issues with turbo charged gasoline engines are turbo failure related. Thats because gas engines run so much hotter than diesel and unless the car is special in someway, like very expensive or very rare, then the consumer doesn't care and/or isn't smart enough to know how to properly treat their turbo engine. The same rule of thumb applies to limited slip differentials. Everyone complains that their LS sucks but they fail to realize that their one tire burn out, constant u-turning under power, and never changing the lube has or is destroying the LS clutches. In short, manufactures go through a lot of effort to make their product as simple and easy so people dont have to worry about what to do otherwise most people wont want it. Thus the reason Banks does so well.

ISX, I'm following what you're saying but without trying to rock your boat, sorry but I dont agree, and here's why. First off the turbo isn't hot because its "spinning real fast" but in reality because the turbo is a compressor whereby the process of compressing air itself creates heat and also because the turbo impeller brunt's the direct heat of cylinder combustion. So for that reason, when the combustion temps are low, the turbo is no longer producing boost, and cooler air is flowing through it, then the turbo housing is cooling off. Heat soak can only take place when one object is hotter than another object but size of the subject objects also plays a part in how much heat soak takes place. Meaning that the cooler larger engine wont heat soak the smaller hotter turbo and vice versa. But hypothetically lets say if the engine was 400* and the turbo was 300* then definitely the hotter engine would increase the temp of the smaller turbo after shutdown.The lubricating oil passing through the turbo bearing housing is always safe as long as its continually flowing through. But because of the general design of the turbo bearing, the film of oil in the bearing bushing is measuring hundredths of a millimeter whereby allowing the turbo shaft to spin so freely. And because there is so little oil volume within that bearing surface, the oil is more susceptible to coking. You can use the engine oil temp in your cool down variable but oil temps should be no more than about 225* at the hottest anyways which means that the oil temp will have no effect on cool down time since the general temperature of the crankcase oil will always be less than the turbo. So what I'm getting at is there's no way to address the oils temp within the turbo after shutdown unless you allow enough engine idle time so the cooler EGT’s can reduce the turbo housing temp, you have a turbo timer to do this for you, or you have a way to continue pump oil through the turbo bearing via a separate electric oil pump.....or something of that nature. There are such devices too.I think what you’re trying to address is that idling after high load conditions means that the turbo housing could easily be hotter than one would think simply using the EGT’s to reference from. An example of that would be to place the engine under a good load like towing down the highway and then pull over. Idle for until the EGT’s drop to about 325*-350* and then shut down. But…..(if your thermocouple is mounted pre-turbo) then continue to watch the EGT’s with the engine off and you’ll see how the EGT’s will continue to rise around another 100* or so before they level off. The lower the load on the engine during running, the less this will happen. Thus the reason why Cummins states their specific idle cool down times as per certain driving conditions. Cummins doesn’t care about the oil temp coming out of the turbo because, as I stated, the real concern is the temperature of the turbo housing, not the oil, because the oil coking takes place when the turbo housing is hot enough that the oil left within the bearing surface cannot escape before the turbo housing temperature can drop to where a specific oil isn't subject to coking. That temp is roughly 300*-350* but you can add about 100* with synthetics since "true" synthetics will coke at higher temps then conventional oils. Not sure why I’m going on and on about this either but my point is that the only thing we can or should care about is that the EGT’s are low and are going to stay low enough after shutdown that there is no chance of oil coking. That’s all…..

I understand that running exhaust under the truck or out before the rear tire is extremely loud in the cab. You may find yourself and your passengers hating it real quick. Plus it will definitely turn your tire, wheel, and outer fender black.

The unit on the front driveshaft is called a Double Cardan joint, not a CV joint. A Double Cardan joint consists of two u-joints and a middle ball joint held in place by springs. Its purpose is to cancel out u-joint angle vibrations by allowing the differential pinion angle to be set at a different angle than the TC output u-joint. When the u-joints and ball joint dry out or get contaminated from road salt, ect., then the DC can vibrate and make lots of noise. Turning simply causes driveline binding and will aggravate the situation. You have the CAD front axle so its not a concern "IF" you're not using 4wd but as mentioned, if you're using 4wd then be careful because if the DC is in poor enough condition, under high load conditions it can break which will cause all kinds of damage under there.

I'm sure the reason that person suggested to use the EB only in 5th gear on the 5600 was probably referring to the fact that 5th gear is direct input shaft to output shaft connection. That will reduce or eliminate reverse loading and will also reduce heat buildup. In saying that, I dont think everyday driving and using the EB in the other gears is going to be a problem. I tend to only use my EB in 4th gear (direct) while towing with my 4500.

True, true anoldbiker. There is a clear difference between gasoline and diesel with one being that gas has a much lower boiling point than diesel. So maybe thinking pressure in the fuel pump creating a vapor which could reduce overall pressure is a stupid idea...... I'm OK with that since I really have no idea why anyone would experience lower fuel pressures at altitude. As I mentioned before, I dont ever remember my fuel pressure dropping at 5000-8000 feet but that's not to say that cumminapart didn't.

Rogan, you dont have to be a fan of the VP. It is what it is to you and thats fine. The only thing I dislike reading on these forums is completely non factual negative opinions based on situations which are known to be the cause of VP failure. People cant complain about something not doing what it was not designed to do. This also applies to most all components of a vehicle with drivetrain being on the top of the list. Who "isn't" guilty of this? Yes, the VP has had its fair share of issues but this isn't to say that most of those issues have or can be dealt with. Every now and again you'll see someone post a thread talking about all the money and work they had to go through with their GM or Ford which adds up to far more than replacing a VP every 100k miles. And thats not to say that anyone shouldn't be upset either if their VP fails or if something breaks on their vehicle.

This thread has given me reason to do some research.....I'm not discounting CUMMINSDIESELPWR theory, or possible reason, but that the more I look into this, the more it seems that there needs to be more questions asked to each of us whom have or have not ever experienced this pressure drop in high altitude. For instance, what fuel pump are you using? Do you use ANY type of fuel additive? Does this happen with the fuel you purchase at high altitude or with the same fuel you run at lower altitude? Do you have any issues with your cooling system running a bit hotter when this is happening? How much fuel is in your fuel tank when you experience this loss in fuel pressure?What I'm getting at is it seems if you do some Googleing, there is a significant similar problem people face with high altitude driving in state like Colorado. Fuel vapor lock is a big one simply because of the increase in fuel boiling points and when fuel is pressurized in the fuel pump, it can cause some vaporization and thus reduce fuel pressure. This is more predominant on oxygenated "winter" fuel.I wont go into a long drawn out post but just mull this over and maybe there is something we need to know about high altitude driving.

I'm not sure why more people dont understand why its necessary to have the "big line kit" too. Just using the most basic rule of thumb for flow and volume..... Air or fluid can not flow anymore than the smallest or most restrictive portion of whatever its traveling though. This means that, yes, the supply line is gaining the advantage of the 1/2" aftermarket fuel line volume but is then being restricted again by the OEM banjo fittings and 5/16" metal fuel line from the fuel filter to the VP. Then some will say that as long as you leave the OEM quick connect fitting at the tank then its all a mute point. Well not so because that fitting is pre the fuel pump and as long as the fuel pump is capable of fully supplying the 1/2" line during the demand of the engine without a significant pressure drop then the 1/2" line will contain enough volume to offset that difference. This is why, if your fuel pressure drop from idle to WOT is to great and you have full 1/2" line from the tank to the VP then you need to upgrade to a drawstraw which will equalize the pickup size and the fuel line. If you're still having issues then you need to upgrade to higher volume fuel pump, but since the 100 is capable of sustaining 500 HP, most guys "should" be just fine.

I purchased my Raptor directly from Pureflow but any reputable vendor will have the same kit.....or should. The "big line kit" and the big fuel line are two different things. The kit should come with a 1/2" or 3/8" fuel line (depending on what you prefer) which will supply you with all the fuel line you need from the tank to the fuel filter. The kits will NOT include anything to run from the fuel filter to the VP. If you want (and you should) to have ALL fuel lines and fittings match from tank to VP then you need to purchase the "big line kit" which I think is around $40. That kit will include more fuel line and the necessary JIC fittings between fuel filter and VP. The 100 kit will also come with the OEM fuel tank module quick connect fitting. Just know ahead of time that this fitting is very difficult to get to and can be the biggest pain in the whole installation process. Word of advice though.....DO NOT cut, tug, jam, rip, tear, or any such action when trying to get this fitting to disconnect the OEM fuel line from the fuel module. If you mess up the fuel module fitting then you will guarantee a leak. I actually loosened my tank straps and lowered it about 6" and was able to squeeze up along side it, next to the driveshaft and get a better look. It will come apart, if you're patient.

Yea, I understand that to be the case too, although the more I research this the more I hear of guys installing their hitches a couple inches back from the axle. Mine is, I believe, just about right over the axle. I plan on taking pictures of the trailer I'm interested since it doesnt seem like pictures of the truck hitch wold help since everyone knows my kingpin to cab measurement is 41", but the problem here is that I'm looking for newer used trailers so this isnt as easy as talking to a dealer. Most trailer sellers dont really care to help since they'd rather you just buy it and deal with the problem yourself. The problem compounds considerably when dealing with someone who has a trailer thats 300+ miles from me. There is/was a trailer that a dealer has/had in town but I've given up on that one since I think the kingpin measurements are to far off.

If you think you have grid heater issues then take a look at this link: http://dodgeram.org/tech/dsl/troubleshooting/Maniford_htr.htm#basics

OK..... I read what I could find on the website regarding your gauge installation and this is what I got out of it. These two links below are probably what you read too since one looks exactly like your posted picture. And if you read them again, you'll see that they are very general in the sense that they aren't telling you anything "specific" except that you need to find a ignition switchable 12v source. On the 2002 pictured, the wire THEY chose just happens to be a black/brown. They're never indicating that you HAVE to use that specific wire, so as per the instructions we know nothing about that wire or where it goes but only that its a keyed source. Its not terribly uncommon for wire colors to not match others of the same year and model. So that brings us back to your problem. We know nothing about your wire and you may have chosen a wire that isn't capable of any additional load or that you simply have a bad connection. If you cant find ANYTHING that no longer works and you're positive that the dash wire no longer has power running through it then I'm not sure what to tell you. Just grasping for possibles here but maybe your ground isn't as good as you think? Not sure but I'd think that back tracing with a test light would eventually lead you to the problem. And, I didn't think you were being defensive either. http://www.dieselmanor.com/diy/CMS-G2gauges/G2image20.htm http://www.dieselmanor.com/diy/CMS-G2gauges/G2image19.htm

Thanks Mike. I may just do that.

I just measured the rear edge of my rail to the end of the bed and it was 24 7/8". Strange that my rails would be farther back than your friends. Its a standard install too. My kingpin sit just about right over the axle. Maybe I'm more OK than I think.

Did you ever start a thread regarding this because.....I fully disagree with you. A naturally aspirated engine will normally run at about 80% Volumetric Efficiency with amazing scenarios where a NA engine could reach up to 100% VE. But a forced induction engine will run at 100% VE or more which means that in short, the volume of air within the cylinders is far more than the actual displacement. So therefor the overall volume will increase dramatically. I could also go into great depth with this too but I'm only being short about it here incase you have another thread started.

Sorry to sound offensive if that's how I came across. Its not only difficult to send the right expression through the Internet but its also more common than not that someone isn't an electrician apprentice and is looking for one line answers for their lack of knowledge. I'm sure I thought you were less than skilled since you called yourself a newbie. But it clearly sounds like you have enough smarts to get through this. If you're positive that there is no longer power running though that black and tan wire then, have you checked every fuse in both the dash panel and the underhood fuse box? It could be something stupid like your horn wire since it also has a 20a fuse. And did the instructions say black/red and you used black/tan only because you couldn't find a black/red? What aftermarket manufacture gave you the instructions? I'd like to see if there's an online version.

As long as his hitch sits what I think is to be normal, where his kingpin should be setting right in the middle of the rails. If that's the case then I can take his measurements and compare with mine. Thank you very much for the effort.

Hmmm..... I'm not sure how to address this because I'm obviously not the norm here. In the winter, my fuel pressure "increases" about a pound, where as in the summer my fuel pressure "decreases" about a pound. I only attributed that to colder fuel which equals more dense fuel which would equal less pressure drop throughout the system and hot fuel is less dense so causing the fuel pressure to drop a little throughout the system. In saying that, my cold weather is only down in the teens and I have yet to drive in sub zero temps where fuel could gel either so maybe I'd get different results then. As for high altitudes affecting fuel pressure, I dont really know why it would cause your fuel pressure to drop 5-6 psi at idle. Was your WOT pressure staying the same? I've driving up to 5k-6k feet many times and my fuel pressure never changed. Maybe you got some junk in the fuel or maybe your gauge/sender was acting up. Also, I dont use Teflon tape or thread sealant on my fuel fittings but then again, my fuel fittings are all JIC fittings which dont use such sealants. But point being is that I know my fuel pressure sender also has its own ground wire so I cant imagine how many senders utilize the fuel line itself as a ground since most fuel lines are rubber or other non-conductive material.

So that black and tan wire no longer has power but it did before? What does that wire go to? Did you check before you hooked your pyro to it? If not then you definitely should have since just because a wire is a hot lead does not mean its capable of sustaining any more load than it currently is set for. The correct way to hook up your gauges is to run leads into the fuse box on the left of the dash and then locate a strong hot lead which gets little to no use like the 12 volt power point or the cigarette lighter. I believe both of those are 20 amp fuse hot leads. Also using wire taps like you have pictured are garbage and can easily result in a loss in connection. You only find them in kits because they're easy. So I'd suggest you make sure your grounds are fine, your connections are fine, and see where that wire leads.....or if its no longer hot then find out whats no longer working because you overloaded the wire and possibly popped a fuse.

Yes, as Moparman stated, its because of the injection pulses. The "clatter" that diesels make is because of the noise you hear from the diesel fuel combusting during the combustion stroke. Amazing that it would be that loud but it is. Because the 2nd gen trucks have mechanical injectors there's no way to change what each injector does without affecting all the injectors, but when the newer injection systems where introduced, they use electronic injectors which allow multiple shots of fuel in the cylinder during that same combustion stroke. So in short, one big spray of fuel equals a big bang but many small sprays of fuel equal many small bangs, which equals less noise. Thats not all they did to reduce engine noise but thats the biggest contributing factor.

Is ANYTHING made here anymore?