Sub-Gen swap 01 into 99. Orientation of crank sensor to missing tooth on tone wheel?

[DylanJames]

So I've been battling this 01 into a 99 swap on my weekends for the past month or so. (Didn't know I bought the wrong Year) Got her runnin. No tach. Bought the destroked kit which BTW is not made for this swap. Slotted the holes so that the missing 36th tooth is 60deg BTDC. Drilled out the sensor bracket to fit the stock crank sensor. Soldered in some more wire for length and viola. I now have my tach working but I'm blowin white-ish smoke. Unplug the relocated crank sensor and no smoke. I'm thinking that my crank sensor being about 120deg from where it would normally sit in the block is fudgin me up. I'm sure the tone ring is lined up right but I guess the ecm needs to see that gap at a specific place in the rotation.

 

My plan is to build a bracket to line up my sensor excactly the same as where it sits in the block.

 

My question is what all does that gap in the tone ring have an effect on (as far as timing and all that)? Do y'all think this bracket idea will fix me up? I appreciate any info Thanks!!

A little back story....

would've swapped the cranks but she broke in the 99 hence the swap. Tore the block all to hell. But she would still fire right up and run. Lacking a bit of power of course. Haha

[Mopar1973Man]

Would of been a lot easier to just change the cam and gear case and keep the cam sensor.

 

 

[DylanJames]

You mean keep the cam and gear case from the 01? 

I did swap them out from the 99. But I still needed the tach. That's why I tried the destroked kit.

All 99 electronics.

[Mopar1973Man]

This is where the battle begins. You'd have to get back to 01 electronics because the true tone wheel is on the crank but you don't have it. The tone wheel for the destroke might not be the right frequency of tone wheel or like you figuring not the right index for the place. This why this article was created above because mixing early and late turn into a HUGE problem every single time between hardware and computer with software. Typically 99.9% are resolve by install the correct year of engine. Converting to the 01 or 02 series is much easier than trying to convert back to 99 because of the dual tone wheel (Cam and crank sensor) where the 01 and 02 only have a cam sensor (which is actually a crank sensor). 

[DylanJames]

Ok so my truck is a 99 I don't know why my signature is coming up. You're saying converting electronics to 01 will be the easiest route? Or finding the correct year engine? Bummer 

[jlbayes]

I believe he is a bit confused on the direction of the swap. The 01 electronics swap is a bit of a bastard to say the least.

 

You are on the correct direction with orientating the sensor and window for the tone wheel. The white smoke you are seeing is due to timing offset from the orientation being off.

[DylanJames]

Thanks Jlbayes that's more what I was hoping to hear. 

[DylanJames]

So I built a bracket for the crank sensor to line up in the position where it would naturally be in the block. Started it up and more white smoke than before. Looked at the old broken block to double check the position of the sensor and noticed the tone wheel notch on the broken crank was not 60 deg BTDC like I had read but instead was 30 deg. Weird, everything I read said it was 60deg. So the missing tooth should hit the sensor at around 60 deg after TDC of cyl #1. I had it hitting at 30 deg after. So took a lunch break gonna fix it in a bit I'll let y'all know

[Boilermaker453]

I will be replacing a 01 motor with a 99 because of a cracked 53 block. Will all i need to do is change out the cam gear and timing gear case ?

[jlbayes]

17 hours ago, Boilermaker453 said:

I will be replacing a 01 motor with a 99 because of a cracked 53 block. Will all i need to do is change out the cam gear and timing gear case ?

 

You are putting an 01 into a 99 or a 99 into an 01?

[Boilermaker453]

21 minutes ago, jlbayes said:

 

You are putting an 01 into a 99 or a 99 into an 01?

I will be putting a 99 into my 01

[jlbayes]

Swap the timing case and cam gear/cam. Is easier for me to swap the entire cam vs. trying to pull the gears off.

[willinmemphis]

hello, 

 

 Did you ever get it to work; was it the orientation? I will be rebuilding my engine soon and will be doing the same thing. I have read numerous pages and this is the second one that I can recall that has attempted to use the destroked ring to make timing. 

 

Thanks

 

William 

[Guest 04Mach1]

On 1/22/2018 at 7:23 AM, jlbayes said:

Swap the timing case and cam gear/cam. Is easier for me to swap the entire cam vs. trying to pull the gears off.

I agree swapping cam and gear housing is the easier option. Some ½" dowel rods cut to length the hold the tappets up and the whole cam comes out very easy. Then you just have a few more bolts and the whole gear housing is off.

[DylanJames]

On 7/16/2018 at 8:43 PM, willinmemphis said:

hello, 

 

 Did you ever get it to work; was it the orientation? I will be rebuilding my engine soon and will be doing the same thing. I have read numerous pages and this is the second one that I can recall that has attempted to use the destroked ring to make timing. 

 

Thanks

 

William 

Yes it worked. It ended up being around 34ish degrees. Had to slot the destroked tone ring to line up right. Then with it slotted was able to fine tune it a bit to get her sounding right. Here's a pic of the bracket I made to attach the sensor mount to (the one that comes with the destroked kit) had to modify the destroked sensor mount a bit. Also used a cam sensor instead of a crank sensor. Same thing I believe just different sizes.

[willinmemphis]

That looks good Dylan, thanks for the help. It's crazy on how close the sensor has to be to the wheel to get it to work. You mentioned that timing was at approximately 34 degrees. Since you have been fine tuning the engine have you changed the timing anymore? 

This one issue is the only thing holding me back from going back to a VP44 instead of a p7100 (and loose dynamic timing). I am about 90% there on my parts list including a 6.7 crankshaft (will have to deck pistons) but I didn't want to go through with a new VP44 if I couldn't get it timed.