Tranny swap

[David E]

does anny know of someone or want to do the adapter for me to bolt a road ranger to a 5.9 with the fctory bell housing

[Mopar1973Man]

I've done one trans swap here. Converted from a 47RE automatic to a NV4500 5 speed. I did it in 2 days with the help of the truck owner. Not too bad of a project.

[Tractorman]

@David E, I can't help you regarding the adapter, but I am interested in your project.  Would that Roadranger be an 8 speed?

 

I always thought that this transmission would be an excellent choice for a Dodge Cummins powered truck.

 

- John

Edited July 20, 2023 by Tractorman

[David E]

no i was thinking a 10 0r 13 speed if you get the 13 speed you can switch things around inside

and get a double overdrive, that is at least if its an over drive to start with but i havent yet decided if i am for sure going to do it 

i really like shifting the big trannies much better they can float shift that is nice in my opinion

[Mopar1973Man]

Something to be aware of... I know a few members did Allison transmission which is 6 speeds and the final ratio in the top gear is too low of ratio in the RPM's will be too low running down the road. Optimally you should see about 2k RPM's at about 65 MPH. It will not hurt to run 2,450 RPM even at 80 MPH which I'm currently set up for with my 5 speed. Being too low in the RPM range while running the highway will be an issue, being the timing will be more retarded and create higher EGT's. Cummins ISB is actually designed to be ran at about 1,800 to 2,500 RPM's from their own specs.

 

The other problem I see a lot is the members with larger tires on 3.55 axles and this will net you higher EGT's and lower MPG's. For example 35 inch tires on 3.55 gears will create a final of roughly 3.27:1 to the ground. The final ratio does matter... 

 

The other that was popular years ago was the addon over drive box (Gear Vendors) this did the same thing most people tried using the extra overdrive and dropped the RPM's too low and now EGT's sored, MPG fell. 

[David E]

Yeah i thought about that  i dont think that will be a big deal for me i think i have 410 rears  i am running 1750ish at 55 and 2200? at 65 or so i thought if i can

 get a 13 speed i coul split it down into smaller steps to keep my egts and rpms in the sweet spot i do have an egt guage

[Max Tune]

I'm not sure a 13 speed would be very practical in a pickup. I'd think you'd probably only use the 5 speeds in mid range.

 

Don't dump trucks with those transmissions have rear ends somewhere in the 5:50 range? 

 

Been a long time since I drove one.

Isn't it 

Low range - 1 2 3

Mid range - 4 5 6 7 8

Hi range - 9 10 11 12 13

 

Let us know if you do it. I'd be interested to know how it worked out.

[Royal Squire]

If you look long enough on line, there was a guy who put a 13 speed in a 2nd gen dodge. Had to make a lot of modifications. There is a good article and photos if you can find it. 

[Mopar1973Man]

Consider the fact I can launch out of 2nd or 3rd gear (little tall). Then I can be in 4th gear by 25 MPH, then hit 5th gear (overdrive) and bury the tach at like 110 MPH. That's 3.69:1 final ratio after tires.

 

Nv4500 in top gear is 0.75:1 ratio.

47RE in top gear 0.68:1 ratio.

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by Mopar1973Man

[David E]

yeah some trannies shift like you were saying but not all 13s do maybe the smaller ones are diiferent, but 

i drove one that had    low range low1234 

                                     mid range low or (cheater gear)  5678 

you get the 13 spee by splitting 5lo 5hi 6lo 6hi 7lo 7hi 8lo 8hi in high range 

i think maybe it was a 9513 which is rare anymore and no parts easily avalible but it may be that the 6613 will not work the same a good 10speed

with over would work as well i dint decide yet. is there a way to find out the shifting pattern of the6613 aand is it oerdrive or not

[Mopar1973Man]

Look up the ratios for each gear and see what the ratios are. This means much more than number of gears.

[David E]

yeah i found a road ranger 13 gear ratio chart for all the 13s i beleive it looks like the 613 is 1.to 1.24 in over drive if i am seeing right 

Eaton Fuller 13 Speed Transmission Ratios is what the page is called if you want to see it 

[Tractorman]

The 1.24:1 is still an underdrive in 8th gear on the 613 transmission.  The 613 had two choices - direct drive 1:1 or 1.24:1.  No overdrive.

 

- John

 

 

[David E]

ok yeah you might be right unless the 1.00 direct in the high side of the split 

it looks like that is for the rt 613 the rto 613 appers to have a smaal overdrive it is showing .8 to 1 which would work 

eaton-transmission-specifications-catalog-en-us.pdf

[Mopar1973Man]

The ratios above you would be starting out in 5th gear. That would be close to first gear on a 5 speed. The entire bottom end is wasted with first at 14:1 is way too low. Then most likely skipping gears up. Then top gear at 1:1 direct is only 4th gear on a 5 or 5th gear on a 6 speed.

 

5 speed top is 0.75

6 speed top is 0.73

4 speed auto top is 0.68

 

Edited July 23, 2023 by Mopar1973Man

[Tractorman]

I agree with @Mopar1973Man.  Way too many gears that will never be used.  Awhile back, I made a chart to compare some manual transmissions. I added the Eaton Fuller RTO 6610 (10 speed Overdrive) transmission.  I think it could be a good option.  660 lb/ft input torque and transmission weighs in at 359 lbs.  Very uniform close ratio transmission.

 

- John

 

[David E]

Right i beleive to now that i see it that the 13 speed doesnt make a lot of sense. i am not real good with gear ratios etc but that does look 

like the 10speed is the key so we will have to see what we can figure out.  unless i would do the rtof909b that looks to be .73 on the over drive but either way 

making sure i have a good over drive is key as i would mind bringing my rpms back slightly.  my brother has a 07 with the g56 and different rears and empty he can get 20 or so, where i can only get about 18 

[Mopar1973Man]

Ummm I'm already touched 30 MPG at 500 HP at the rear end with just a simple 5 speed NV4500. Running custom tuning on the Quadzilla Adrenaline where timing is about 24.5 degrees BTDC. Changed out the stock 265s for 245s tires changing my final ratio to 3.69 which puts me at 2k rpms at 66 MPH. I crossed the entire state of Washington for just 1/4 of a tank of fuel.

 

If you want MPG you need to chat with me. There is way simpler ways to get high MPGs than swapping transmissions. 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Mopar1973Man

[David E]

yeah i am thinking about getting a new nv5600 and maybe changing my ratios out as i have 554,000 on my truck chassis so the rear diff is worn fairly well and 

has some annoying play in it i had it checked and they said it is in the spider gears not the ring and pinnion so i am drive it for now . 

with your tune can you drive empty with good throttle response and still pull heavy like 30k lbs with out over temping the exhaust 

i do know my truck is from Florida and seems to run slightly different on factory setting than trucks from the north. it is built in 10/05 and i 

wondered if they advanced the timing from factory for emissions purposes. i have a smarty tuner on it and with the advanced timing it can rattle 

slightly at times they shop says it might have factory advanced timing to a small degree anyway. PS would 3.54 or 3.73 ratio be about the optimum for fue milage i have plenty of low gears i take off in 2nd most times and usually only use 1st when pulling above 22k or so