Bosh Remans vs. BBi stage 1 vs something else

[Diesel]

So give me your thoughts. I called Snarty and asked about the BBis and if they had cured the injector failure problems. They wouldn't commit to a yes saying there hadn't been enough used to tell. Said 2 micron filter was the answer. So I took that as a no. So tell me what you think woul be best and why.

[mopartechnician]

If you can afford bbi get them, if not pm me and I can hook you up with bosch remans. Bbis are completly new injectors, where bosch reuses some of the parts. And yes 2 micron (now measured as 3 micron) is a must. Glacier diesel, vulcan performance make great kits and will either use a cat or a donaldson filter. Donaldson is a p551313 or p551315

[War Eagle]

I have never used BBi injectors but everyone that I have heard about that has used them seems to like them.

 

I used BMS (Bosch Motor Sports) injectors my self.  These are all new injectors and are a marine injector.  I believe they are 375 hp so that would represent ~a 50hp increase over your stock units.

 

The spray angle may or may not be an issue for your vehicle so be aware of what you need to match your truck's requirement.

 

I have 50 hp DDP nozzles on mine to match the spray angle requirement of my 05CR.  Like I said these are new (not reman'd) and run about a grand less than the BBi.

Edited September 25, 2014 by War Eagle

[dorkweed]

I have never used BBi injectors but everyone that I have heard about that has used them seems to like them.

 

I used BMS (Bosch Motor Sports) injectors my self.  These are all new injectors and are a marine injector.  I believe they are 375 hp so that would represent ~a 50hp increase over your stock units.

 

The spray angle may or may not be an issue for your vehicle so be aware of what you need to match your truck's requirement.

 

I have 50 hp DDP nozzles on mine to match the spray angle requirement of my 05CR.  Like I said these are new (not reman'd) and run about a grand less than the BBi.

 

 

Keep us.............especially me updated on these injectors if you wouldn't mind please!!  Thanks!  

[Diesel]

That's the second time the marine injectors have been mentioned. Other than the 50 hp gain, why would they be better?

[Diesel]

Thanks Mopar tech. If I can't figure out what kind of improvements over Remans the BBis and the marine injectors are I'll probably go with Remans. These marine injectors sound like they might be good, the BBis are kinda high you want to know the truth. I don't know if I can afford em or if I even want to. Shoot me a pm with a price if you want. Do we have a pm function?

[War Eagle]

Keep us.............especially me updated on these injectors if you wouldn't mind please!!  Thanks!  

I'll give you my opinion from time to time.

[War Eagle]

That's the second time the marine injectors have been mentioned. Other than the 50 hp gain, why would they be better?

Well for me there are three things that got my attention and peaked  my interest in purchasing them when it was time my truck needed replacements: one is that there are new Bosch (not reman'd or rebuilt) second they were less money than new Bosch original replacements from the dealer (and less money than any of the other new injectors I looked at like 'Dragon Fly' etc.) and they would give me a bump in hp.

[mopartechnician]

Be careful on "new" there is lots of companies that say new in the title but dont say anything on how they are new. Bbi is the only ones that will say they are completly new. I keep hearing about bosch motorsports but havnt done any research into them

[Diesel]

So are you thinking these "new" injectors are just remans?

[War Eagle]

Be careful on "new" there is lots of companies that say new in the title but dont say anything on how they are new. Bbi is the only ones that will say they are completly new. I keep hearing about bosch motorsports but havnt done any research into them

Yup.  At the time I was looking for injectors I found many places that said new Bosch injectors (CR injectors) were almost impossible to find (supply problem I assumed) but that the marine version was more readily available. Theses companies would sell you new reman'd Bosch injectors (non marine) but not new as in never previously used injectors.  My understanding is if Bosch actually reman's the injector they are marketed as 'new'.  But if a non Bosch facility reman's them then they are sold as reman's.  So indeed you need to watch what your getting.

 

The injectors I bought were billed as new and not reman'd Bosch and I was told that the new as in never used injector part numbers started with the numbers 0 445 ............ Any other Bosch part number for injectors started with a different numbering scheme if they were not new as in never previuosly used.

 

I believe you can verify this by asking reputable suppliers to verify the numbering scheme.

 

If you buy the marine version you need to be aware of the spray angle and if it will match the needs of your truck.  If it does't then there is the option of installing a replacement nozzle that matches your truck's requirements.   You need to make sure that any replacement nozzle will fit the marine bodies,  as I have been told there has been a design change ( to the marine injectors) sometimes in the recent past that has eliminated some of the various nozzles being able to fit the marine injectors.  I just made sure I had a workable combination.

 

Of course there are many stories of people using injectors with differing spray angles than what the truck originally came with but I can not attest to the goodness or badness of doing so.

I am telling you this so that you are aware of the potential that you might be looking at purchasing slightly used bosch injectors that might have been billed new from the seller but were actually reman'd and called new.  I have found in my research that actual new injectors seem to come with at least a one year warranty and all the remaned or rebuilt injectors seemed to have something like 90 days warranty.

 

These injectors that I bought actually cleared up all the smoke I was making in stock tune (from the original injectors).  On occasion I was seeing slightly over 20 mpg with my originals but they were smoking on the slightest acceleration.

 

With my new injectors I am regularly seeing over 21 mpg (hand calculated) and have seen 22+ on several occasions.

 

So far I am all smiles.  I am coming up on 20k miles with the new injectors.

 

[Diesel]

And where do you get them?

[War Eagle]

And where do you get them?

Well you are going to have to do a little research because there are some dynamics to the supply and distribution game.  Somebody that had the BMS units last month may not have them today when you are looking for them.

 

But DAP (in Utah) usually carries them (they are also a sponser of this forum).  I got mine from USA Freedom Diesel (in Montana).  I have even seen them listed on Ebay at times.  So if you do some internet searches for BMS injectors that should get you started with a list of possible sources. 

 

Be sure to ask lots of questions before you pull the trigger so you get exactly what you need for your truck.

 

I'll bet there are local suppliers in Az that have access to them and can help you out.

 

But you won't go wrong with DAP or USA Freedom Diesel.

[mopartechnician]

If you are in AZ you are close to Brown's. Give erick a call and he will answer all your questions

[AH64ID]

It is very hard to get new bodies these days. Bosch only lists one body for the Dodge trucks, and they can be Bosch Remans or new.. just depends on what is in stock. 

 

If your supplier can get marine bodies some of them are new (QSB480) and some of them are possibly reman (QSB 440 and below)... All marine bodies use the 03-04 spray pattern, but can be fitted with the 04.5-07 nozzles.

 

I have BBi's in my 05 (03-04 spray pattern and pistons), and we just put DDP 50's on new marine bodies in my dad's 06 last week. Inital thoughts between the two.. BBI's are quieter, and easier to make smoke free. Aside from that the DDP's seem to be doing very well and my dad is beyond impressed. I detuned his truck, UDC, to be back where he was with SW1 on the SJR (no want/need for more power). The reason I went with 50's over stock nozzles was to be able to drop the duration and use less timing, and a quicker faster burn.

 

He pulled a empty 16' stock trailer from Boise to Pocatello last Friday with about 2K in the bed and at 75 the OH was telling him 16.x, and IIRC he said the tank ended up in the 13-14 range... Pretty damn good!!

 

I went from Boise to Challis last Friday at 21K combined and got 9.9, which I think is good for mountain towing.

 

 

So my 0.02, BBi's are the way to go if you can afford them and the extra power is wanted. If UDC where not an option I would have never gone BBi's, too much fuel with stock duration and and no tuning gives the proper timing with stock duration so I wouldn't have been as happy.

 

DDP's are next. If you buy the complete injector from them it's going to be a new/reman Bosch (whatever Bosch has on the shelf) with their nozzles. Their nozzles are good quality.

 

Steer clear of non-Bosch remans.

 

The BMS stuff out of the box has the wrong spray pattern for an 04.5-07, but some shops will fix that (what my dad did) but if your buying a complete BMS setup it's not going to be the proper spray angle. Lots of people running the 03-04 nozzle with the 04.5-07 piston, but I am not sold on it yet.

[Diesel]

Thanks for all the replies. Very informative. But I think my injectors are good. Check my thread" Maybe it isn't the injectors" to see whats going on.