I'am BEYOND WORDS!

http://www.prisonplanet.com/5-men-rush-to-save-dying-woman-as-cop-chats-on-phone.html

This once again, reiterates the situation discussed earlier in rancherman's thread. Except, instead of being the victim, how would you respond to something like this as a passerby?

I carry a medical bag, blankets, gloves, towstraps, some other relevant tools for emergencies. I think I may need to rethink how I could every approach such a situation like this to see if I ever could do any good for someone.

I do not know the full extent of the situation, nor the immediate area, but I think kicking the truck into 4 low and hooking a tow strap up to the rear control arms of the overturned car and pulling it out of the water enough to gain some access and try and further prevent a person from drowning would have been a good idea... Think I might need to put some of my logging cables back into the truck.

One of the things you got to do asset the scene before entering the scene. One of the golden rules of the extrication class I just took this summer. Another thing is the police officer made the mistake of rushing into a HazMat area without proper PPE (Personal Protection Gear) which should of been a SCBA (Self Contained Breathing Apparatus) which most FD have on there trucks. Since no one is has the proper PPE you stay out of the HazMat zone. One of the few thing that annoys me to death out here is the police typically will respond to the call first then call us out. So sooner or later the wasted time of waiting is going to cost someone's life or the lack of PPE gear for people will cost a life. Yes I'm certified... http://www.linkedin.com/in/mopar1973man

This Video is doubly tragic. In the jurisdiction I worked & the one we live in now, dispatch will take the call... say an auto accident or a house fire... Police, Fire, EMS will all be dispatched. Police Patrol will often arrive first because they are already in the car & cars can maneuver faster than trucks. The Cruiser overhead lights can help guide other responding units. Depending on the situation, Police or off duty fire fighters will often try to get people to evacuate or help get them out. But dip-fork!! I can see the billowing gas. Fumes! Victim on the ground! DANGER! DANGER! If you want to risk running through it, get as far away from the source. Grab the victim & drag them out... don't freaking stay there! The tanker should have been labeled... shouldn't the officer have called in "We have a leaking ammonia tanker, I see one victim on the ground" So the fire fighters would know what they are dealing with. A few seconds to prepare can save lives. (Unit commander pre arrival: Joe & Bill are going in, Dave & I will help them gear up.)

We would call the cops the, "Blue canary's".

This Video is doubly tragic. In the jurisdiction I worked & the one we live in now, dispatch will take the call... say an auto accident or a house fire... Police, Fire, EMS will all be dispatched. Police Patrol will often arrive first because they are already in the car & cars can maneuver faster than trucks. The Cruiser overhead lights can help guide other responding units. Depending on the situation, Police or off duty fire fighters will often try to get people to evacuate or help get them out. But dip-fork!! I can see the billowing gas. Fumes! Victim on the ground! DANGER! DANGER! If you want to risk running through it, get as far away from the source. Grab the victim & drag them out... don't freaking stay there! The tanker should have been labeled... shouldn't the officer have called in "We have a leaking ammonia tanker, I see one victim on the ground" So the fire fighters would know what they are dealing with. A few seconds to prepare can save lives. (Unit commander pre arrival: Joe & Bill are going in, Dave & I will help them gear up.)

Absolutely.... That's why you size up your scene before even attempting to enter or save a person. The person in this video is most likely long gone as well and the police officer had tunnel vision and ran for it. There is a web site Fire Fighter Close Calls which is exactly like the video above. All the dumb things that fire fighter do and get hurt or killed over.

Thanks for the link. The officer in that clip didn't hesitate... when he should have. Good lessons for us all. I recall reading about a large fishing vessel. A crewman was in a big refrigerated fish hold... apparently an ammonia leak over came him. Another guy went in to try to save him, didn't make it out & think a third went in too!!

Thanks for the link. The officer in that clip didn't hesitate... when he should have. Good lessons for us all. I recall reading about a large fishing vessel. A crewman was in a big refrigerated fish hold... apparently an ammonia leak over came him. Another guy went in to try to save him, didn't make it out & think a third went in too!!

Russ those Anhydrous Ammonia tanks ARE labeled. Anyone in farm country has seen them being dragged thru fields and in tandem and triple down the farm roads. IMHO, the cop should've known that…………especially since he could see the vapor coming from it. That AA is, IIRC, 97.xx% pure ammonia………………….the stuff in your household cleaners that you buy at the store is about 3-10%, and that'll take your breath away. 1 gallon of liquid AA will produce, IIRC, about 800 gallons of vapor. But that doesn't tell it all………………….remember how such low concentrations take your breath away……………………..imagine that 800 gallons of "pure" vapor dispersing in the air by 50%…………..still almost impossible to breathe.

Years ago I worked at a fertilizer plant and filled those tanks. We had to wear rubber gloves and a face shield similar to what you wear when using a grinder. There was a "horse trough" full of water by the filling dock; so if you got sprayed accidentally, you were to jump into the water. AA has an "affinity" for water…………….that's what kills you……………….it pulls the water from you nose, eyes, skin and lungs so fast that it essentially "freezes" the tissue…………..killing it.

Nasty, nasty stuff.

A person or persons down and unconscious and a mystery gas/vapor in the air Is a definite no go situation. They teach that in OSHA classes also. It is basic stuff.

A person or persons down and unconscious and a mystery gas/vapor in the air Is a definite no go situation. They teach that in OSHA classes also. It is basic stuff.

Even knowing nothing... everyone can see the spewing vapors. It smells too. Are they heavier than air? Even if you decided to enter the danger zone... First recognize it is a DANGER ZONE. Come up with a plan... It generally makes sense to be carrying a first aid kit, as the officer did. But not under these circumstances... walking in there with an unnecessary item in his hands is a bad plan or no plan. Trying to rouse the victim while still in the danger zone is a bad plan. A better plan might be 'Hold your breath, run in grab the guy & drag him out... real quick like.' When the officer was first affected by the fumes, he didn't get himself out of the danger zone... This is like pulling someone out of a car fire... get in, get out... I used to keep a small scuba tank (called a bail out bottle) & regulator & mask in my car. I could get 10 minutes out of the air in the water. It might not be as good as a full mask but it'll work.

Russ, I also worked in a meat packing plant in Amarillo, TX right out of college. They used AA/pure ammonia as the refrigerant in the coolers. Seemed like we could always smell a bit of ammonia in them coolers. Sometimes it got so bad we had to stop the line until it was fixed.Depending on "atmospheric" conditions the AA vapor can do anything. Normally the AA vapor is lighter than air, and will rise. However; there are times and conditions that will cause it to hug the ground. You saw that in the video…………………though part of that was the close proximity to the source of the vapor.

There were three guys killed in a manhole not too far from me. The first one went in to see why a pump quit and the second one(first victim's brother) saw him down and went in to help. The third one (local electrician) went in to help the other two that were down. Well, as you can guess the third one went down too. Turned out there was a strong concentration of sulfur dioxide in the pit. Sulfur dioxide is what makes rotten egg stink. Now you may ask why they didn't smell it and not go in. The reason they went in is because with a high concentration no one can smell it and it displaces oxygen. The worst part was I heard through reliable sources that there was an air monitor on the seat of the pick up the first one drove to the manhole.

Yep, H2S will desensitize you in under a minute...if you ever catch a breath of it in strong concentrations you better be heading the other way quick. We have a lot of it on site at work (it's actually a byproduct) and has been responsible for killing a few people. This was several years ago. Last year our sister company in Europe had a similar situation happen. They took delivery of a large vessel that had been padded with nitrogen because it was imperative the internals were kept dry. The maintenance guy popped the man way and then stood by as hole watch while an engineer went in to do inspections. He got down in the tank (man way at the top of a vertical vessel) and went down. Maintenance guy called the control room to call 911, supervisor heard the call on the radio and ran out to investigate. He took it upon himself to crawl in after the engineer and went down almost immediately. By the time the fire dept arrived they were both dead. There are lots of silent killers at the plant I work at, and we actually have our own first responder team that I am a part of. We train every 3 months on confined space rescue involving rappelling and ascending and the use of 3 and 4 to 1s. We recently had our annual refresher from a company out of Michigan and they taught us how to make a harness out of climbers rope. Pretty neat stuff. JR

There is H2S in a lot of places I used to work too (paper mills mostly). The worst place I have worked was at a small refinery. There is lots and lots of crap there that can kill you. There is also a chemical there that if it gets on you they give you a shot ASAP and haul your butt to the ER for more treatment. The stuff attacks calcium in your bones. Lot of fun working there in the summertime in full chemical suit, boots, gloves, and faceshield. The sun would be brutal.JR where do you work?

I work at Cristal Global in Ashtabula. You probably don't recognize the name, it used to be Millennium and before that was SCM Chemicals back in the 80s. I think before that it was called Gulf Western. Plant 1 down the road from my plant was originally built and operated by Sherwin Williams in the 70s I believe. Now we are all the same company. We make Titanium Tetrachloride (base ingredient in all titanium products) and Titanium Dioxide (white pigment found in paints and plastics). I work in maintenance and mainly weld and fit pipe or run the cranes so I'm not on the battle field very often like the operators or the field mechanics are. LOLJR

Some of the names do sound a bit familiar. You do some of the stuff I used to (up until August). I was a pipefitter.

Another good quote I learned from hazmat class:"Dont just do something, stand there"!

We have lots of Toluene on site as well. NASTY stuff. They show that video every year in our HAZMAT refresher.

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A little off track but this one has always amazed me.

I forget how many miles away the guy video taping was but it was taken from a ways out.

Heres the same video but without all the bs commentary. Much better to watch this one, puts it into perspective how big it really was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSflyJ_r77k&feature=youtube_gdata_player

..that was always my favorite one to watch, growing up. Amazing explosion...