What is the original intent of government?

[ISX]

I'm not the most well versed on exactly what the governments duties are, though I know what they have a lot to do with today. But in the beginning (I guess the first 50 years of "USA"), what was the original intentions/roles/responsibilities etc. of government? I've watched a lot of things and I have uh, "thoughts" lately on if the government should even be part of such things. But yes, original things!

[Wild and Free]

In a very short and simple explanation.............Protect our Constititional freedoms and unalieable rights our founding Fathers fought for and deal with interstate commerce issues and international trade and treaties with other countries.Now they think they are here to protect us from terrorist threats they created in exchange for the freedom and rights they have stolen from us.

[ISX]

For such a short and simple explanation, it sure speaks a lot Mind has been thinking about it for hours.

[ISX]

I guess what gets me is why smart kids in science go there to display their works of art, why? Why does the gov. control schooling? Why does the government have any input at all in anything but what you said. The government is one "segment" to me. Everything else I would think would just be a department. Something with no politics in place, only doing whats "right". So the government does what you said, the department takes care of schooling and this and that and everything else. I guess its the same as telling some kid if he does really good in school, he can see the president, someone who is supposeddd to only do the things you said, but is now the signature of "success". Just seems the government is the new uhhhh whats the word....ummm...I guess they are what the Beatles were in their hay day, cept its more by force. IMO there shouldn't be any "status" rank attributed to the president. He should be just like any other CEO, does his job, goes home. He has a lot of responsibilities now which seems to contribute to his current fame, though it is more that we just pay attention since he controls everything which gives him fame. Need to knock them all back down a notch.

[hex0rz]

I think you're finally starting to go after the right band wagon....I would put my in on this, but I fear it would be a little longer than I have time for, at the moment. But if you give me a chance, I would love to share my thought with you about the subject...

[hex0rz]

I guess what gets me is why smart kids in science go there to display their works of art, why? Why does the gov. control schooling? Why does the government have any input at all in anything but what you said. The government is one "segment" to me. Everything else I would think would just be a department. Something with no politics in place, only doing whats "right". So the government does what you said, the department takes care of schooling and this and that and everything else.

I guess its the same as telling some kid if he does really good in school, he can see the president, someone who is supposeddd to only do the things you said, but is now the signature of "success".

Just seems the government is the new uhhhh whats the word....ummm...I guess they are what the Beatles were in their hay day, cept its more by force. IMO there shouldn't be any "status" rank attributed to the president. He should be just like any other CEO, does his job, goes home.

He has a lot of responsibilities now which seems to contribute to his current fame, though it is more that we just pay attention since he controls everything which gives him fame. Need to knock them all back down a notch.

I finally have a moment to deliberate on this subject with you. Dunno if you have put the subject to rest yet or not, but what the hey. I will talk about it even if its to no one.

W&F really summed up the subject very nicely. I would like to expand on that a little more to maybe give you a deeper understanding on the issue. Anyone, please feel free to chime in if I fail to explain something properly.

I first off would like to stress the point in the beginning of the subject about the issue of the foundation of our nation. Our country was founded on biblical principals. Does this mean you have to be a person who believes in the bible to be a citizen of this country? NO.

Many people who are not Christian get very offended by that idea that we were founded on the principle of the bible. But it just simply means we structured our government according to the foundation laid before us in the Good Book. Let me explain:

In Romans 13, we have here a very popular area in the book that many people, govts have used to educate the people about the role of govt. but also to "control" govt.

Romans 13:1-7:

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. ² Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. ³ For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. ⁴ For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. ⁵ Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience. ⁶ This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. ⁷ Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

In this respect we see that the bible calls for us to be subjected by the govt. Because God has instituted the govt. It also says that those who rebel against the govt. will be subject to judgement. You also see that I have highlighted a section in bold for emphasis. Govt. institutions are here to keep civil order and bring justice to those who do wrong. It also says that govt. can also institute taxes.

Some people have a huge problem with the idea of govt. You have to be able to read distinctly between that fine line of govt. and no govt. Some people think that we are to rule ourselves. Some people think that govt. is to have total rule over us. Just in these verses, we see that the ONLY thing govt. has control over us for is to secure civil order and administer justice for evildoers and taxes.

Taxes are biblical. Capital punishment is biblical. But there is no where that says what limitations, "We the people" have in how much a govt. can have.

We need to stop and think here for a second:

The bible did not say anything about the forms of govt. It allows for all forms of govt. to exist. But, given the spectrum of govts. that do exist, there can only be one that can be as close to biblical as possible to allow for a people to be free. We have to then take into the account of a single and certain disclaimer to this fact:

Mark 7:21-23

21“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries,22deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness.23“All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man.”

This shows and tells us that man is inherintly evil. His heart inclines to wickedness rather than good.

Our forefathers understood the bible very well and knew these things. They were FLEEING such men in govt. because of this!

So why the diff. forms of govt.?

We see in the bible that it comes down to SIN. When the Jewish people rebelled against God, we see them being given over to bondage. A couple examples of this is during bablyon and egypt. These men who ruled these kingdoms were allowed to rule the way they were because they served a purpose for God. God can use even the most wicked of people for his purpose. Does that mean they are doing anything that is good for him? No...

When we as a people rebel against him through sin, we are given over to bondage. He will allow these men of wickedness to rule over us and institute things at their pleasure.

Once again, our founding fathers knew these things. They knew that they had to structure this new govt. they were building to restrain these things from taking place. But they also were aware that EVEN IF they set these things in place, that the people of this nation could STILL be given over to bondage. Why?

Because we as a people rebelled, we became drunk and have fallen asleep. We were and are to remain vigilant to restrain the govt. as we were given such duties to do so.

@$#%@%$^%^&Ran out of time will add more soon@%^%^%^*%*&

[Wild and Free]

You need to watch the documentary from Russel Means "RIP" Called "Welcome to the Reservation", it is very insiteful and pretty much sums up where our government came from and what it is doing to us as a whole. The indian reservations was the governments experiment that it has taken nation wide and pretty much every citizen is included in it now. http://www.infowars.com/russell-means-welcome-to-the-reservation/

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LA-S64QY3o&feature=player_embedded

[ISX]

I was thinking about this the other day. Whats stopping people from going door to door and getting to know everyone in their block or town and working as a team? Hell with the government, be your own. For instance. There is a town called clifton city about 5 miles from me that has a mechanic shop right in the middle. There are maybe 15 houses all in the blink of an eye. Its just a T intersection city... no streets or anything. They could team up, get to know everyone, even have gatherings where they all have lunch together. I think they already do this as I might be related to some of them. Anyhow I live in a city of 100,000 now. Every blind is closed in every house, nobody knows their neighbor, etc. But whats stopping this? The government isn't here putting up barricades. I think it was like this in the "old days" but I'm not sure. But if anything weird happened, people would call each other and help each other. Someone with a gun could go out and see what was up My parents live around mennonites and they all team doing for their common goals. I don't know, I just think we can all easily be our own little "mini governments", pay taxes to the blowhards in the big government, tell them to mind their own business, and we do our own thing. We take care of schooling, we are the police, etc. Is there anything keeping this from happening? I don't think the government has enough control to stop it from happening. Then blocks communicate with other blocks, next thing you know we have entire subdivisions teaming up. The government will have no purpose other than the original purpose and they can get back in line. Just a thought, how many flaws are there with this

[hex0rz]

You can't just be your own. You already reside in a state. The state has a defined territory. Are you in a city? The city has a defined territory. What things you could do is establish your own town. It would take some hoops, but it is possible. You need a few things to become a town/city, etc.There is like I have always thought about bigger cities and towns. People seem to get into this mindset and they no longer care about community. Most of the time smaller towns, cities, areas, communities all know each other, know whats going on, etc.I think population density is big problem.As far as telling govt. to go shove it, refer to W&F's video. Without awareness and a big realization, govt. gets away with the small things... We have to stand together, power in numbers. But we are too peppered aroud the country and people don't wan't their bubble popped. As long as their world is okay, life is good.Take the head outta the sand, remove the rose colored glasses, pop the bubble, turn off the tv.

[ISX]

I dont mean write up our own constitution for the city block. I just mean stand together and do whats right with each other. We gotta follow laws but if the cops are part of the communion then they are part of the group as well. Cops shouldn't be some external person to come into the territory and enforce what they think is right when it could be stupid and wrong. Cops should only be there to assist you in your time of need, such as getting robbed. Other than that, they should be part of society. Not this pulling people over for going 1mph through a stop sign crap. There is nothing saying we can't unite as a community for the greater good. The government can do what they want but they are not for coming into our societies and telling us what to do. Amish people do this already. They have no town or anything, they just unite as one for the common purpose of helping each other. Thats what I am getting at. Like I have really fast internet. It's $80/month. There is no reason I cant put the router in next to my door in the middle of the 4 plex and then we just pay $20/month each. Why can't we all rent a place like this for $600 a month to pay $150 each instead of each of us paying $450. This division of society costs us dearly. Rich people surely love it.

[hex0rz]

I dont mean write up our own constitution for the city block. I just mean stand together and do whats right with each other. We gotta follow laws but if the cops are part of the communion then they are part of the group as well. Cops shouldn't be some external person to come into the territory and enforce what they think is right when it could be stupid and wrong. Cops should only be there to assist you in your time of need, such as getting robbed. Other than that, they should be part of society. Not this pulling people over for going 1mph through a stop sign crap. There is nothing saying we can't unite as a community for the greater good. The government can do what they want but they are not for coming into our societies and telling us what to do. Amish people do this already. They have no town or anything, they just unite as one for the common purpose of helping each other. Thats what I am getting at. Like I have really fast internet. It's $80/month. There is no reason I cant put the router in next to my door in the middle of the 4 plex and then we just pay $20/month each. Why can't we all rent a place like this for $600 a month to pay $150 each instead of each of us paying $450. This division of society costs us dearly. Rich people surely love it.

Ahh, yea. Your getting at the idea of community. Some of it even to the extent of the role of church body. What I was gonna get at with my previous long-winded post was to describe an aspect of that. Govt. was intended to be in existance for the role W&F said they were purposed for. They were given boundaries defined by our framework. The rest of the responsibilities were to be entrusted to the people. Church IS supposed to help bring people together as community. We are charged with doing things like this: Caring for the homeless widowed sick poor needy hungry Govt. was never supposed to be the nanny like it is now. The Church has failed its role...

[Mopar1973Man]

The Church has failed its role...

I don't think the church failed its role. I think that the entitlements from the government looked better than the entitlements of the church and everyone flocked to the government side. Church was willing to help with food and clothing but thats about it. But when you can get all your bills paid, a free cell phone, food card, medical, etc. on the government side, why not? Like down in Donnelly, ID the local church is still running a small food bank every Tuesday feeding the hungry people of the area. They have food and clothing and some house goods but that's it. I think where the fall over comes from is looking for free medical coverage of some sort. So looking from this angle the Church can only do so much but the people want everything. Whats really upsetting is I had a store manager tell me she can make more money and have more benefits on unemployment than she does currently working her current job. Now there is something wrong with this picture isn't there? This is why so many people are attached to the government roles now. But going back toward the right side... Every man that works an honest day will earn an honest day's pay. I surely don't see that from the unemployment. But the citizens are sure taxed heavily to pay for the lazy ones that do nothing.

[Wild and Free]

Russell Means stated it best in the video I posted above, "we as a nation have lost our culture". People coming from all around the globe and settling everywhere and intermingalling has caused a lot of this versus living in tight kint communities of other countries and things are easier to do and most of the country is already developed so there is less need to be as tight knit as when the country was spreading and growing. People now have what they came here for "Independence" but that has come with the price of not keeping the Government in check and now they find independant people a threat to their adgenda and you see where that is taking us.

[hex0rz]

Mike, what I mean by that comment is that if you go to a church now, more often then not, you will see those that will be unwilling to do the smallest thing for another person. Yet, they go home and edulge in everything of pleasure without a second thought about the suffering of others they could have helped stopped.Church as a whole is usually good on support. But I believe it has dwindled to the point that it has failed. Does that mean it cannot return to good standing? No..We can all agree though, too, that Govt. needs to stop changing the diapers. We are a melting pot of culture. I think the biggest problem we face from immigrants is probably the extremely lax education that they have to undertake to become a citizen. I bet you they don't even teach anything American, let alone make them learn to say the pledge of allegience.I get frustrated every time I listen to an immigrant come here and they are speaking their native tongue, as if they were still citizens of their former country. You wanna speak your native tongue? Okay, but don't do it in front of me cause your probably talking about me...

[Mopar1973Man]

@ HexOrzI see your point too. Your so right the Gov't has to quit being our nanny and let us fall on our face. How else are we going to learn from our mistakes? Also being that the entitlements are much better than working why work? So now you got a entire country for of people that won't even think for themselves. Truely sad. What happen to all the great thinkers and dreamer that design and produced things? Oh that's right Gov't entitlements are so good why think... Just lay back on the couch with a bag of potato chips and watch movies all day. From my side of the fence I gave up TV nearly 10 years ago. We yanked out the satellite dish and maybe watch a DVD movie now and then but most of the time both MoparMom and myself would rather study and gain knowledge than watch a idiot box. One of the small sacrifices we've done. Like I had a conversation with a friend of mine from the Fire Dept. like I told him I hate the idea of even asking for unemployment or anything from the Gov't. I had a girlfriend way back when that had a son and she use to file for food stamps and the whole bit. I found out what it like to have the Gov't peering into you life. I swore that I would never do that again. Even myself today no matter how hard things get with the economy I always push forward and manage to find a day job doing something. Might be just hurdling cows, to working on computers, building / repairing web sites, to fixing vehicles. I never want to be the one with my hand out asking for free ride. So coming back to the topic. The fact is too many people in the US just would rather have the easy way of collecting the entitlements... But some of use small percent actually fight to stay away from it.