I replaced my VP44 pump using the procedure laid out by Mopar1973man. Thanks for that. After just joining the forum, AND after reading about the TC/transmission problems due to faulty alternator and grounding issues, I was wondering if the APPS re-learn procedure should be part of the VP44 replacement procedures?

     I was having an issue with 47re not wanting to kickdown or maybe no throttle response, is a better way to describe it ,after the transmission shifted into 5th gear. It kinda wants to buck when giving it more throttle and has progressed to slowing down on inclines even with peddle to the floor. This morning I removed the Alt fuse and unplugged the field wire to Alternator and symptoms remain the same. Fluid is full and color is fresh in the transmission. No MIL on dash. 

      Next job is to clean and re-tighten all grounds, remove all add-ons (amp, edge, back up leds, tranny cooler fan) and test the Alt.( even though the "test drive" didn't change the issue I should use the meter to verify any anomaly.

      I hadn't read any posts exactly describing my issue of the tranny shifting through every gear as it should, with plenty of torque and response, but then no response once 5th gear is achieved. It has progressively worsened in the past 4 weeks since the VP44 install. But was doing it before and I just expected it to be the PPump finally failing. The ppump controller death code had been set and check engine on the dash over a year.

    I will report back after doing the ground maintenance and volt testing. I did the APPS reset yesterday. I have used this forum info for several repairs and diagnosing. I like the fact that most posts and replies to posts aren't a bunch of users writing replies just to be posting, but actual tried it, did it, it worked, real time, real knowledge replies. Hope I can contribute to this sight every now and then. For the most part, my truck has been great and purchased as maybe the last truck I will ever need. I'm tapping this out on my laptop so anybody reading this on a phone is gonna be like."shut-upalready" . Thanks for any insight.

(Oh yeah, fuel mileage is really bad. I changed the fuel filter prior to the VP44 job)

Edited February 15, 20205 yr by InGear
add something

4 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Cleared up the noise issue at least... 

I need some troubleshooting advice

Shoot... Ask away...

 

i'm pretty certain that my lift pump is drawing through an in tank pump. The pump is dead. The wire are plugged into it and I traced it up under the hood and they are bundled in two wire looms and ther is a red wire that splits and is plugged into a relay. I guess this is the fuel pump start relay. I unplugged the Fass pump and Key on. No Noise. Bump starter. No noise. So Pump in tank, I'm guessing must be dead. The Old factory lift pump "block delete" is still attached but the lines that ran through it are unhooked. The Fass draws from the outlet of the in-tank pump and the return is still hooked into the intank pump. It looks like I will need to rework this set up before I keep trouble shooting my "driveability" problem. Thanks for leading me down the right paths.

2 minutes ago, InGear said:

5 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Shoot... Ask away...

 

I guess I need a draw tube set up. I'm not that hip on the lift pump set up.

 

 

5 minutes ago, InGear said:

i'm pretty certain that my lift pump is drawing through an in tank pump. The pump is dead. The wire are plugged into it and I traced it up under the hood and they are bundled in two wire looms and ther is a red wire that splits and is plugged into a relay. I guess this is the fuel pump start relay.

 

You'll need to either install a draw straw... I would suggest a AirDog 150 or similar or mechanical pump. 

1 minute ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

You'll need to either install a draw straw... I would suggest a AirDog 150 or similar or mechanical pump. 

Will I have to drop the tank to install the draw straw and is the airdog with the water separator and filter all in one housing the better set up? Could I remove the pump delete and the factory filter housing if I use that set up? 

Don't delete the factory filter. KEEP IT! I run both 3 micron filter on the AirDog 150 but a 7 micron filter in the stock filter. I found out that even the 3 micron filter on the AirDog is passing dirt on to the stock filter and the 7 micron is catching. 

 

Yes you have to drop the tank for installing the straw...

 

Stock 7 micron, and the AirDog 150 3 micron cut open...

Edited March 5, 20205 yr by Mopar1973Man

6 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Don't delete the factory filter. KEEP IT! I run both 3 micron filter on the AirDog 150 but a 7 micron filter in the stock filter. I found out that even the 3 micron filter on the AirDog is passing dirt on to the stock filter and the 7 micron is catching. 

 

Yes you have to drop the tank for installing the straw...

 

Stock 7 micron, and the AirDog 150 3 micron cut open...

Thanks. Can the pump delete thing on the side of block go away? I'm a retired plumber. I can plumb anything. Just now getting familiar with the Cummins. It has run strong until this bucking thing showed up. even with the VP44 death code set, it ran great for almost two years. I will be shopping now. Thanks again mopar1973man

The delete has to stay. There is a hole in the block behind it. 

 

I ran two pumps on mine many years back. If the fass is responding to the key on and starter bump the in tank pump might not be connected to the ecm. Someone would have to have spliced into the OE pump harness to make both pumps respond. I guess thats possible but dont really know. The second pump I ran was operated by an oil pressure switch and did not respond to the key on and stater bump, it was independent of the ECM control.

Edited March 5, 20205 yr by dripley

5 minutes ago, dripley said:

The delete has to stay. There is a hole in the block behind it. 

 

I ran two pumps on mine many years back. If the fass is responding to the key on and starter bump the in tank pump might not be connected to the ecm. Someone would have to have spliced into the OE pump harness to make both pumps respond. I guess thats possible but dont really know. The second pump I ran was operated by an oil pressure switch and did not respond to the key on and stater bump, it was independent of the ECJ control.

The second pump being the in-tank pump? There does look like a splice connector in some wiring that plugs into  a sensor that is in the block on the drivers side near the delete. would the pump run when the oil pressure came up? That splice connector may be for the edge attitude

My second was one I added when the intank pump was getting weak and it ran off of the oil pressure switch. That pump only ran after the engine started and built oil pressure the intank pump ran off of the ecm.

Edited March 5, 20205 yr by dripley

18 minutes ago, dripley said:

My second was one I added when the intank pump was getting weak and it ran off of the oil pressure switch. That pump only ran after the engine started and built oil pressure the intank pump ran off of the ecm.

This keeps popping up in my ad feed at the top of page. it doesn't look like the one in Mopar1973Mans pictures of his airdog install

 

2 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

I found out that even the 3 micron filter on the AirDog is passing dirt on to the stock filter and the 7 micron is catching

This tells me that ether airdog filter quality is not as good as the hipe or something else happen where debris got by the 3 micron filter to be cut by a 7 micron. Jmo

45 minutes ago, dripley said:

The delete has to stay. There is a hole in the block behind it

I cut my bracket off and left the block off plate on the block, probably could have bought a separate block off plate instead of murdering the original one but I didn't care at the time

Air Dog makes a kit to replace the in tank pump. My 165 came with one back 9 years ago. It was only a 3/8" pick up and thats most likely why I see a 3 to 4 psi drop at WOT. But I still only see 15 to 16 psi for a low pressure so I dont worry about it. It also has both the pump and engine return lines in the basket with the pick up. Some folks think its a bad idea but I have not noticed any difference in how the trucks after the install.

 

19 minutes ago, Dieselfuture said:

This tells me that ether airdog filter quality is not as good as the hipe or something else happen where debris got by the 3 micron filter to be cut by a 7 micron. Jmo

 

Doesn't matter... I've tried Donaldson 3um, Fleetguard 3um, AirDog 3um filters all them pass dirt. The 7um in the stock always has some dirt in it.

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Doesn't matter... I've tried Donaldson 3um, Fleetguard 3um, AirDog 3um filters all them pass dirt. The 7um in the stock always has some dirt in it.

I offer wonder if new filters have garbage inside that gets flushed out. It's really sad when you open a filter box and first thing you do by default is to blow inside  I like donaldson as they have plastic on them, few others do that too. I was at Walmart and out of curiosity open daily few different brand of filter boxes, even like expensive k&n had crappy inside, truly sad.

3 hours ago, InGear said:

This keeps popping up in my ad feed at the top of page. it doesn't look like the one in Mopar1973Mans pictures of his airdog install

 

Look for  “Vulcan Performance Draw straw 5”. Vulcan is an advertiser on this site. It will replace in-tank pump. Either need to tilt bed or remove tank to install. If you look in articles section I believe there is an article with photos of the install. 

12 hours ago, Royal Squire said:

Look for  “Vulcan Performance Draw straw 5”. Vulcan is an advertiser on this site. It will replace in-tank pump. Either need to tilt bed or remove tank to install. If you look in articles section I believe there is an article with photos of the install. 

Thanks Royal Squire. I Found the straw and pump for a good value. Should arrive to me next week so it gives me time to wrap my brain around the process of removing the tank and I can pump it down into some 5gal. containers as it is full.

9 minutes ago, InGear said:

Thanks Royal Squire. I Found the straw and pump for a good value. Should arrive to me next week so it gives me time to wrap my brain around the process of removing the tank and I can pump it down into some 5gal. containers as it is full.

Your old pump might pump it out. Worth a try. Or just tilt the bed up. 

5 hours ago, dripley said:

Your old pump might pump it out. Worth a try. Or just tilt the bed up. 

Take all the bolts loose, drop some long bolts through the passenger side to keep the bed from sliding off then tilt and support the bed, Pull out the fuel pump/sender and modify w/Draw straw?  Otherwise with out  a post lift, I would need to jack up the rear to clear the high rear part of the tank and accommodate the jack and what ever I would use to support the tank, which I'm guessing I would need to lift it about 10" minimum.  I'LL spray down the bolts tomorrow. Snowing here at the moment.

1 hour ago, InGear said:

Take all the bolts loose, drop some long bolts through the passenger side to keep the bed from sliding off then tilt and support the bed, Pull out the fuel pump/sender and modify w/Draw straw?  Otherwise with out  a post lift, I would need to jack up the rear to clear the high rear part of the tank and accommodate the jack and what ever I would use to support the tank, which I'm guessing I would need to lift it about 10" minimum.  I'LL spray down the bolts tomorrow. Snowing here at the moment.

I have pulled my tank twice but dont remember having to jack up the truck to get it out. I am 4wd so I am sure that made a difference compared to 2wd. Dropped mine on the ground and pulled it out at doors. 

 

I have not tilted the bed but folks I have seen do it remove the front bolts then loosen the rear and raise up the front of the bed.