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mossyoak71

02 Cummins 1850rpm max

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I swapped a 02 Cummins into my F250. Mods are, fummins twin turbo kit, 125 DDP injectors, new springs, and arp studs. Also new VP 44 SO pump. Tunning is by quadzilla, but no custom tunes yet. The motor came out of a manual transmission truck, so I sent the ECM off to be reprogrammed for an automatic because of a massive lope.  When I got it back, the lope was cured and it idle ok. When I drive the truck, it will only get to 1850 RPM and no farther. Acts like it has a governor on it. I purchased an automatic apps sensor and did the relearn on it and no help. Any suggestions???

Edited by mossyoak71
Wording

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Let me know if you get anywhere with this. I also have a manual ecm 02 24 valve that I installed in my 96 Yukon. It is backed by an Allison 6 speed with a low stall torque converter and everything works great until I get below 5mph. As soon as the rpms drop below 800 it's like trying to stop a freight train. I have not sent the ecm for reprogram because I keep reading stories like yours and right now I can still slip out of drive to stop that's better than 1800 rpms. I also love my quadzilla.

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11 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Sounds like an ECM failure. Can read codes?

No, I did not wire the pcm in to read the codes. So think I will talk with the guy that reprogrammed it and see what he says

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9 minutes ago, mossyoak71 said:

No, I did not wire the pcm in to read the codes. So think I will talk with the guy that reprogrammed it and see what he says

 

This is the tough part about doing conversions. If you just use the ECM alone then it a PITA to diagnose issue without the PCM so you can read error codes other than that you end up guessing at what the cause of the problem is. 

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I second the pcm notion. Although I have not done so yet, I intend to wire a plug into the wiring harness so I can plug the pcm (which I got with the donor engine) in when/if I need to diagnose something. For now I get tcm dtc's straight from the obd connector my trans guy wired into the the harness and the engine is running like a raped ape (FASS, Quadzilla, 4 inch downpipe, 5 inch straight exhaust) so it's at the bottom of the list. Now if I could just get that troublesome anti stall shut off that would make my month.

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ok, so the ecm is not seeing the vss signal. so i have done alot of figuring and this is what i come up with, but need a solution.

1) the engine is a 2002 as stated on the cummins plate

2) it was hooked to a manual trans in a 2500 dodge

3 the ecm wiring harness was for a manual and so was the ecm but i had it reflashed for an automatic

4) i have searched the wiring diagrams and in the harness i do not see the white/orange wire for the vss

 

so with this research, i still can't fiure out where to hook it up. the wire harness does have a engine speed sensor plug, but it tried that. so does anyone know where i can hook the vss wire up? the Ford vss signal is ac current, and with the orange white wire it should work. also does anyone know if using a Dakota Signal SGI5 is able to make it work, if i need a different input for the engine speed sensor. i have alot of time over the weekend now to try and figure it out due to IRMA. thanks for any and all help[.

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Vss from tail shaft to pin 43. Or even better take it to the Cummins Dealer and have them turn that parameter off and forget about the Dakota digital. Not that I don't like them it's just that this is probably one of those times where less is more.

What trans are you using?

Edited by Scottfunk

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42 minutes ago, Scottfunk said:

Vss from tail shaft to pin 43. Or even better take it to the Cummins Dealer and have them turn that parameter off and forget about the Dakota digital. Not that I don't like them it's just that this is probably one of those times where less is more.

What trans are you using?

I'm using the 5R110 that was in the truck. i just had it rebuilt (stage 5).

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I know next to nothing about ford transmissions. I know that in my setup the vss share to the ecm comes from the tcm. I'd try to splice off of your vss wire at your cruise control or abs to pin 43 at the ecm.

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So I pulled the connector on the ECM and there was no wire in pin 43. So being I was a aircraft mechanic, I pinned a wire in that location and no luck. So now I'm really at a loss, could it be a early 02 motor with a 01 wire harness?? I see on the 01 schematics the vss wire did not go to the ECM

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If it's an 02 motor then it should accept vss input. Where are you getting the signal from? I was thinking about this a little more in depth and a normal vss signal is a twisted pair of wires but the input at the Cummins ecm is a single wire. I'm guessing that this is some sort of 0-5v signal created by the pcm. My tcm has 3 pairs of twisted wires that come from it for various purposes but the wire to the ecm is single. Is there a location on the Ford pcm that has a similar output? Might be worth a shot.

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On 9/9/2017 at 10:20 PM, Scottfunk said:

If it's an 02 motor then it should accept vss input. Where are you getting the signal from? I was thinking about this a little more in depth and a normal vss signal is a twisted pair of wires but the input at the Cummins ecm is a single wire. I'm guessing that this is some sort of 0-5v signal created by the pcm. My tcm has 3 pairs of twisted wires that come from it for various purposes but the wire to the ecm is single. Is there a location on the Ford pcm that has a similar output? Might be worth a shot.

I wired it up like DCS said too. The wire the say to tap into is at the Ford pcm, and it is a single wire. Also the same vss wire I tapped into, also works the cruise. And that works fine. I did all the wiring per DCS. 

ME78569- so the ECM has the engine speed sensor wire on it that goes to the transmission for the Dodge. Do you know if that is the same voltage signal as the vss signal would be. I hooked it up to it and it did not work. 

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So I have narrowed it down, the ECM isn't seeing the ground from the Dodge telling it that it is not in park. So I have a pcm on the way to wire it in and ground the #6 pin. Fingers, toes, arms, legs, and whatever else I can cross is crossed. Let hope this solves it

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That's weird. I don't even have a pcm and I don't have that issue. Must be part of the auto programming. Good to know in case I have that issue when I get me ecm reflashed. Please update with results

Edited by Scottfunk

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HAPPY, HAPPY, HAPPY, DID I SAY HOW HAPPY I AM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!😂 Man what a difference it makes, it runs so much better. Even when I come to a stop, it doesn't want to take off. That's the best thing I done. Did I say I was HAPPY!!!!!

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So it wasn't the vss, it was the park signal? Needs to see ground in park? Pin 6 at the ecm? Sorry for the questions but I gotta get rid of my anti stall so I'll be going through the exact same thing in the next couple weeks.

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5 hours ago, Scottfunk said:

So it wasn't the vss, it was the park signal? Needs to see ground in park? Pin 6 at the ecm? Sorry for the questions but I gotta get rid of my anti stall so I'll be going through the exact same thing in the next couple weeks.

Yes, although I left the vss hooked up, but it just wanted to see the ground at pin 6

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we need to get this into an article so it is not lost.  

 

Can you do me a favor and post, in one post, all the issues you had with specifiics and the resolution to the issue?  Think of it as a searchable issue and resolution.  

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2 hours ago, Me78569 said:

we need to get this into an article so it is not lost.  

 

Can you do me a favor and post, in one post, all the issues you had with specifiics and the resolution to the issue?  Think of it as a searchable issue and resolution.  

 Second that!

 

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I swapped a 02 Cummins that was a manual into a f250 (08) automatic. As I was making the wire harness up, I noticed that the harness I had did not have the vss wire. It had a engine speed sensor.  When I got the truck running with the manual ECM it had a lope so bad that it would die as soon as you put it into gear. So I sent the ECM off to be reprogrammed for an automatic. When I received it back, I put it in and the lope issue was solved but the truck would not go over 1850 rpm's. So as stated before, there was no vss wire hooked to pin 43. So I pinned a wire and that did not help at all. So upon talking with other people, I decided to purchase a PCM and wire it in, because the ECM was not seeing the ground from pin 6  on the PCM, which tells it that it it not in park. So when I received it, I wired it up and now she runs like a dream. Thanks for all that helped and threw things at me to make me think harder!

24 Valve Neutral Safety Ground method.pdf

24V PCM Schematic.pdf

Edited by mossyoak71
Clarify and add schematics

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1 minute ago, mossyoak71 said:

because the ECM was not seeing the ground from pin 6 which tells it that it it not in park. So when I received it, I wired it up and now she runs like a dream.

 

Can you clarify,  Pin 6 of the ecm or pcm?  

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47 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

 

Can you clarify,  Pin 6 of the ecm or pcm?  

I edited my post and also put the schematics I used to wire it up in there too.

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