Steering Gear Adjustment

[leathermaneod]

Thank you again @Wild and Free for giving me Ryans number. He was extremely helpful! Although now I totally understand why you prefer to leave this adjusting to the pros. He informed me that he rebuilds these boxes with oversized ball bearing for $180, which is what I paid for this crappy one from autozone. Really wish I had known that before because that's the route I would have gone. He said this could potentially be pretty difficult to get adjusted on the truck as the bearing preload should be set without the sector shaft in the box. He also said without the oversized ball bearings in the worm gear I will likely never get all the play out of the box. So now I have no core, a crappy rebuilt box and $180 invested. When I could have had a sweet bluetop rebuild for $180 smh. Hopefully others will read this and go the bluetop rebuild route. Just gona have to play with mine a lot now and try to get it where it returns to center more easily. 

[Wild and Free]

Trying to do this on a steering gear by ones self can be a huge safety risk if going down the highway and the gear locks up due to too tight of an adjustment and you get into an accident and get hurt or hurt or kill someone else as a result of a messed up gear is not worth the risk IMHO.

[dripley]

Out of curiosity @leathermaneod will they not take your rebuilt as a core?

[leathermaneod]

They will. Its just I already spent $180 on the one from autozone and turned in my core. So, now to get another one from bluetop is another $180. I actually did order one up though. Ryan seems to be a really stand up guy! I called him around 1 east coast time and he dropped what he was doing to scrounge parts together to build me a box (he didn't have any on the shelf) and got it shipped out the same day, all because I asked if there was any way he could get it out quick because I need it asap as I'm taking a 600 mile round trip this weekend! He does usps flat rate boxes too so shipping was only $18. Oh and he spent about 15 mins on the phone with me before I called back to place my order, trying to help me out with how to get mine adjusted back where it should be. My plan right now is actually to try and return this box to autozone though. That way I can get $180 back instead of the $75 as a core. If not though Ryan assured me he will take it and refund me the $75. We really need to get the word out about Bluetop though! Assuming the box is as good as Ryan's customer service of course. $180 for a quality rebuilt box is a very fair price! He is also using the oversized bearing in the worm gear to take up all the slop from wear. Had I know about them before I bought this one from autzone, that is what I would have gone with. I thought the only alternatives were the insanely expensive redhead or borgsen. 

[Wild and Free]

Ryan is a one man show and does his best to keep his customers happy on top of shift work @ full time job with overtime mixed in with his family too.

I am not sure when he eats or sleeps.

[leathermaneod]

Well I now have 600 highway miles on the new Bluetop steering gear box and I believe I can safely say my steering is now the best it has ever been :-) I really think we should start promoting Bluetop on here. I'm not sure how sponsoring works, but maybe Ryan would like to become one. I am sure there are lots of guys out there that would go with his box if they knew about it....

 

My only complaints at this point are as follows and I do not believe they are the fault of the Bluetop box. 1) my return to center still isn't quite as strong as I'd like, but I don't think thats the gear box, I think its either my reman PS pump being weak, or just me expecting to much. It was easy to keep the truck on the road with one hand and I did not have to be constantly correcting one way and then the other. 2) I still have a slight dead zone. Smaller then ever before, but still there, and I think I know why. I replaced my intermediate shaft with a Doorman replacement from Rock Auto because mine had a lot of slop at the upper joint, the weird one I think is called the Rag Joint, and it did not slide freely anymore. Anyway, this new Doorman one has been on the truck less then 2000 miles and already has as much slop in the Rag Joint as the old one! Very disappointed. Anyway I'm wondering if I could drill the rivets out of that joint and bolt it together to tighten it up like it should be? Anyone else ever done this?

All kinds of play at these stupid rivets. Any reason I can't drill those out and put it together with some bolts and lock nuts?

Anyone have any ideas on tightening up that rag joint?

Edited August 8, 2016 by leathermaneod

[TFaoro]

That sounds like exactly what I'd do. Drill and replace with bolts. I think I'd use nylon locknuts or thread deforming locknuts through. I wouldn't want any chance for them to come loose!

[leathermaneod]

Sounds like I know what I'm doing when I get home from work tomorrow :-)

[leathermaneod]

Well I tried replacing those rivets with bolts. They were a lot harder to get out than I expected though. It was a lot of work and didn't seem to help much. I think I also damage one of the u joints in the process as it was not moving very freely anymore so I replaced that shaft with an OEM one off eBay, only slightly more expensive than the doorman. After this I would not recommend the doorman version to anyone. Best bet is the OEM if you can find one on eBay. I also finally got my steering brace put back on. I think that removed a little more of my dead spot. It's weird though because it also made my return to center just a little worse and made my steering wheel slightly off of perfectly straight. How complete is your guys return to center? Does it bring the wheel all the way back, or only within 45° - 90°?

[Buzzinhalfdozen]

Mine will pretty much return all the way to center but doesn't necessarily hold center on the highway if that's what you're referring to. It wants to drift in the lane which is normal for these rigs. 

Have you checked or adjusted the caster setting? That has more to do with return to center than anything else. 

[leathermaneod]

Thanks for the reply! Yes I know about the wandering. Thanks to all my recent steering upgrades(4th gen tie rods, bluetop steering gear, new intermediate shaft, sway bar bushings and links, steering stabilizer, and Rock Solid Ram Column bushing) my wander is very minimal and my dead zone is also very minimal. Problem(if it even really is one), is that the wheel does not totally return it self to center. Especially after making a 90° turn at low speed. I have to bring the wheel back to center, only the last couple inches, but still. At high way speeds, if I make a correction, I have to return the wheel to straight or it will stay very slightly to the one side. It not a huge deal, just trying to figure it out. I'm really wondering if my reman ps pump is weak and not putting out enough pressure. I need to call Ryan at Bluetop and ask for his opinion since I just got the steering gear from him. He has been extremely helpful so far so maybe he will have an idea. As far as caster, I have never touched it, but the truck was aligned not too long ago. 

[Buzzinhalfdozen]

Honestly the best thing I did for driveability is max out the caster adjustment. 

"In spec" caster is like 2.5-4 degrees but these rigs need as much as they can get which is about 7*. Best part is it's free but can be time consuming if the adjusters are rusted up. 

[leathermaneod]

They are the forward bolts on the lower control arms right? I know my driver side is good because I just replaced it. Needed new control arm bushings and the bolt had to be cut out. Not sure how the passenger side is. How do you know how many degrees you are setting it to?

[Buzzinhalfdozen]

Yes the front  bolt on the lower control arm. The oval adjuster washer thing should be pointing at your front bumper. I don't know how many degrees you'll end up with but adjust both sides evenly and it won't matter. 

[Wild and Free]

On the second gens I have never seen a stock caster cam get to much over 5* positive caster maxed out. Best thing is to just max them both  out.....................if you can get them to move at all. Most alignment shops will never touch them if it is within spec which unless you have a bent axle or something major will pretty much always be within the wide range of "Spec".

[leathermaneod]

Well my driver side has new control arm bushings and new adjusting bolt and washers so that one will be fine to move. The passenger side may end up being cut out just like the driver side had to be. We'll see. I soaked it good with PB a while so maybe it will loosen up. Here are pics of both sides

Passenger

Driver

So you guys are saying the adjustment marks, dash on one side, hole on the other, should be pointed directly at the front axle, or straight forward in other words? to have castor maxed out?

also, should I have the front wheels off the ground for this? Or does it not matter?

 

Edited August 20, 2016 by leathermaneod

[leathermaneod]

Also, I'm thinking I might as well replace the lower control arm bushing on the passenger side while I'm loosening up the bolt anyway. That way lowers on both sides will be done. Anyone have any tips or advice for replacing those bushings? Should I take the arm out and have a shop press the bushings? Or can I easily do this myself? 

[leathermaneod]

anyone?

[Mopar1973Man]

I've just done full replacement of the control arms so far. You are going to need to create a jig for beating them out then beat the new bushings in. Best yet, a nice shop press.

[leathermaneod]

I was actually able to get the bushings out and back in pretty easily with some of the parts from a ball joint press kit, a short piece of flat steel to keep the arm from colapsing, and a big hammer. At this point I was more looking for advice on the which way the washer needs to be to be at max castor? I believe it's straight to the front, but I can't find anywhere that tells me including the fsm.