I was fiddling around under the hood today and come to find out that there is excessive turbo play and a lot of oil film in the housing. I can see that the turbine has contacted the oil film and I’m fairly certain I can see a faint mark around the housing beneath the oil. What should I do for a turbo? Rebuild this one or go with a aftermarket or He351cw? Currently running Dap 75s. I think this has something to do with low low end power. Top end with these injectors is really good it takes off well but low end power feels very laggy.... Ipinions? 

I am not the genius here but you dont want to go back to stock, you wont like it. The 50's I have spool my hx much faster than the stock ones ever did. If you put a Quad on there you an tune it back so you dont exceed your goals. 

10 minutes ago, dripley said:

I am not the genius here but you dont want to go back to stock, you wont like it. The 50's I have spool my hx much faster than the stock ones ever did. If you put a Quad on there you an tune it back so you dont exceed your goals. 

Hmm my 75s don’t seem ttoo spool to fast but that could be due to the play in the shaft. If I go back to stock I’ll be putting a can bus tuner on it idling it’ll be a smarty or xzt. Still can’t decide if I wanna do 275hp or 400....

Also something wierd. I put a qaudzilla boost foolernon with h my 75s and it made absolutely no difference??

3 minutes ago, Marcus2000monster said:

Hmm my 75s don’t seem ttoo spool to fast but that could be due to the play in the shaft. If I go back to stock I’ll be putting a can bus tuner on it idling it’ll be a smarty or xzt. Still can’t decide if I wanna do 275hp or 400....

I have a Comp on mine. I am just running around on level 1X2 for now. It is much better than the Banks 75hp tuner and the stock injectors I used to have.

1 minute ago, dripley said:

I have a Comp on mine. I am just running around on level 1X2 for now. It is much better than the Banks 75hp tuner and the stock injectors I used to have.

How much hp does 1x2 add?

40 hp on level 1. The 2 is how fast 100% fuel is added based on boost pressure I believe. @Mopar1973Man can quote that one from memory, I cant remember off the top of my head. 

I added RV 275's to the Banks and it made a big difference. The Banks was not adjustable though. One thing I have learned with all the hype on the Quad is it is better to have big injectors and tune them back than to have small injectors and tune them up.

3 minutes ago, dripley said:

40 hp on level 1. The 2 is how fast 100% fuel is added based on boost pressure I believe. @Mopar1973Man can quote that one from memory, I cant remember off the top of my head. 

I added RV 275's to the Banks and it made a big difference. The Banks was not adjustable though. One thing I have learned with all the hype on the Quad is it is better to have big injectors and tune them back than to have small injectors and tune them up.

All this tuning up and down is confusing! Lol. 

3 minutes ago, dripley said:

I believe. @Mopar1973Man can quote that one from memory,

 

Yes, I can...

 

Main level

 

1 = 40 HP

2 = 60 HP

3 = 80 HP

4 = 100 HP

5 = 120 HP

 

Sublevel 

 

1 = 33% of stock fuel till 20 PSI of boost

2 = 50% of stock fuel till 15 PSI of boost

3 = 67% of stock fuel till 10 PSI of boost

4 = Some extra fuel added at low boost

5 = Full fuel at 0 PSI of boost. 

 

I typically ran 5x3 in the later years but early I was on 5x5 and could drive without making a ton of smoke. 

Edited April 9, 20187 yr by Mopar1973Man

8 minutes ago, Marcus2000monster said:

All this tuning up and down is confusing! Lol. 

That would multiply with the Quad to get its full benefit. The comp is a bit more brainless. Much less to choose from. Now that does not mean the Quad is not the better tuner, I am convinced it is. There is just alot more to learn with it.

 One big difference is the Comp on 5X5 will throw some power down but it will got hot quick. You can tune that back with the quad electronically. You can also do that with the Comp but you have to use your right foot and the gauges. My Banks tuner did it with the programming. 

4 hours ago, Marcus2000monster said:

All this tuning up and down is confusing! Lol. 

 

Like I'm learning there is no canned tune that will fit your particular case. Every truck and driver has different tastes and hardware. Like me, I want a good balance of power and economy. My tunes typically are going to be a bit on the retard side being I'm looking for power down low RPMs. Then my power band I've got to change up my upper end once I get my boost controller in. Even though my economy tune is using the minimum amount of wiretap I still can get rather hot EGT wise but is this because I hit choke point? or am I over fueling yet? or maybe both? So I got to systematically fix these little issues one step at a time. First, gain control of my turbo boost pressure and limit it to about 35 PSI for starts. Then see what it does from there. If it's still hot then tune the 20-30 PSI band of the CANBus fuel back. I know my performance tune is a bit over fueled and it shows it blows a cloud but clears up rather quickly. My economy tune is basically smokeless.

 

My previous version of the Economy tune was smokeless but never got hot at all. Now add the wiretap at got stupid hot quick. Toss on the backdown limit as a band-aid. Now if I start a pass on the high from about 50-55 MPH pulls like a mule for about a car length then hits the backdown, drops hard for a second or two then starts to fuel again but limited. I want to get a nice smooth power band that I can hold my foot to the floor till 100 MPH with even thinking about EGT's.

6 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Like I'm learning there is no canned tune that will fit your particular case. Every truck and driver has different tastes and hardware. Like me, I want a good balance of power and economy. My tunes typically are going to be a bit on the retard side being I'm looking for power down low RPMs. Then my power band I've got to change up my upper end once I get my boost controller in. Even though my economy tune is using the minimum amount of wiretap I still can get rather hot EGT wise but is this because I hit choke point? or am I over fueling yet? or maybe both? So I got to systematically fix these little issues one step at a time. First, gain control of my turbo boost pressure and limit it to about 35 PSI for starts. Then see what it does from there. If it's still hot then tune the 20-30 PSI band of the CANBus fuel back. I know my performance tune is a bit over fueled and it shows it blows a cloud but clears up rather quickly. My economy tune is basically smokeless.

 

My previous version of the Economy tune was smokeless but never got hot at all. Now add the wiretap at got stupid hot quick. Toss on the backdown limit as a band-aid. Now if I start a pass on the high from about 50-55 MPH pulls like a mule for about a car length then hits the backdown, drops hard for a second or two then starts to fuel again but limited. I want to get a nice smooth power band that I can hold my foot to the floor till 100 MPH with even thinking about EGT's.

Good words. That tune your talking about at the end is exactly what I’m after!

Out of the blue my truck flipped a P0237 code this evening while out fishing. Is this directly related to my turbo play issue or not?

Not related to play in the bearing housing but could be related to the sluggish feel of your truck

7 hours ago, trreed said:

Not related to play in the bearing housing but could be related to the sluggish feel of your truck

I’m pretty sure it’s no in. Limp mode becuase I was doing 40 mph on a back road. I never tried to get on it though becuase I wasn’t sure what the code was till I got home

Think it’s related to my Qaudzilla Boost Cooler? 

There won't really be a limp mode.  If the map sensor is stuck reading a certain voltage, the ecm will be reading the fueling table wrong and that's why there's a loss of power.  

It might be the boost fooler.  Take it out, clear the code, and see if it comes back.

1 hour ago, trreed said:

There won't really be a limp mode.  If the map sensor is stuck reading a certain voltage, the ecm will be reading the fueling table wrong and that's why there's a loss of power.  

It might be the boost fooler.  Take it out, clear the code, and see if it comes back.

Took the boost fooler out and cleared the code. It hasn’t came back yet but Iv only driven it betweeen my shops that are a mile apart 

0237 has nothing to do with limp mode or your turbo shaft play. Map sensor is the issue

 

https://mopar1973man.com/cummins/articles.html/24-valve-2nd-generation_50/51_engine/obdii-error-codes_94/p0237-map-sensor-voltage-too-low-r65/

 

2 minutes ago, notlimah said:

0237 has nothing to do with limp mode or your turbo shaft play. Map sensor is the issue

 

https://mopar1973man.com/cummins/articles.html/24-valve-2nd-generation_50/51_engine/obdii-error-codes_94/p0237-map-sensor-voltage-too-low-r65/

 

That code can put you in limp mode. I had it happen when I had the Edge EZ tuner. 

Again, it's not really limp mode.  Your transmission cannot lock itself into 3rd gear by itself to protect itself.

What you were feeling is the map sensor is returning a static value, say 1 psi, despite the turbo actually supplying 12 to the manifold.  The ECM sees that throttle position is at XX%, timing is at YY*, but MAP pressure is at 1 psi.  So it takes all three of those values into the fueling tables and computes what fueling command it will send to the VP, but because MAP pressure is static, the fueling command will be wrong and the truck will be sluggish.

 

Edited April 12, 20187 yr by trreed

1 minute ago, trreed said:

Again, it's not really limp mode.  Your transmission cannot lock itself into 3rd gear by itself to protect itself.

What you were feeling is the map sensor is returning a static value, say 1 psi, despite the turbo actually supplying 12 to the manifold.  The ECM sees that throttle position is at XX%, timing is at YY%, but MAP pressure is at 1 psi.  So it takes all three of those values into the fueling tables and computes what fueling command it will send to the VP, but because MAP pressure is static, the fueling command will be wrong and the truck will be sluggish.

Well I’ll be! I always thought it was limp mode. Hmm well I’ll see if the code comes back and if it does I’ll do the testing outlined in the articles. I plan to go pick up a new boat tomorrow night if the truck acts up and throws the code it won’t hurt anything to drive it right?

Shouldn't hurt to drive.

Test your map sensor's resistance.  Hook it up to some compressed air and see if the value changes as the supplied pressure increases.