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Fender or Door

leathermaneod
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Haggar

Haggar

Posted
Posted

ohhhh, that gets fun!!!! (which part is right? or were any of the parts right? or just take the best you can with the pieces you have...)   

 

At first I would say fender, but the fender looks good to the rocker.  I think your door looks low.  There is no gap at door to rocker....

 

FSM page attached (23-56) shows 7.7mm +/- 2.0

 

Hope that helps!

Hag

2001 FSM Ram 23-56.pdf

2001 FSM Ram 23-58.pdf

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Buzzinhalfdozen

Buzzinhalfdozen

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I would say the door is off. You can adjust them some by loosening the door to hinge bolts (not the hinge to body bolts) but be warned they can be a royal pain to align. To get all the gaps right and the door latch lined up is  frustrating. Unless the hinges are completely worn out there might be a reason it's aligned the way it is. 

Not trying to scare you off but I have hours into aligning panels on mine. 

Trace around the hinges before you start so have a good reference line to go off of. 

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leathermaneod

leathermaneod

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3 minutes ago, Nekkedbob said:

Check your hinges, that looks like mine before I rebuilt the hinge pins and bushing.

How exactly do I do that? Was yours low in the front like that too? or just sagging at the back? It was my understanding that if the hinges are worn, sagging will be the issue....i might be totally wrong on that though lol

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Nekkedbob

Nekkedbob

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most auto part stores have hinge pin sets. You have to support the door and grind off the top of the pin with a dremel and knock it out  the bottom and if the bushing are still there get them out, replace the bushings and drive the pin in. Hardest part is to support the door, I hung mine from a rafter so it had no chance to fall and I made sure to only do one at a time.

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leathermaneod

leathermaneod

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Alright so I gave this a try today. Unfortunately, not only were you guys right that its a major pain in the rear, it seems my door is unable to be adjusted properly for some reason. I'm guessing something to do with the fact that its not the original door...I did get it moved some, but the problem was, I would get it really close, but then it wouldn't close properly. With the rear door open, it didn't want to close flat against the truck. Something up at the hinges was holding out about 1/2-3/4 of an inch. I could not figure out what it was to save my life. Then with the rear door closed, it would latch, but I could tell there was a lot of tension on it wanting to push it open. Also, the interior light wouldn't go off at that point either. So I had to settle on this

FullSizeRender.jpg

FullSizeRender 4.jpg

FullSizeRender 5.jpg

Not much difference I know, but I know I moved it up some based on the marks I made before I moved the hinges.

My biggest concern is that the door does not leak at the top now. If you zoom in on these two pics, you can see that the driver side is not contacting the seal as well as the passenger side

FullSizeRender 2.jpg

FullSizeRender 3.jpg

I also get a lot of wind noise on that side so I was hoping adjusting the door would help. Unfortunately, for the reasons I described above, I couldn't get the door in enough at the top to help that seal better. Hopefully it doesn't leak now....I was reading on other forum that guys with this issue just bent the top of the door in a little bit. I tried it, but I couldn't seem to budge it at all. 

In the course of all this I also discovered why my driver side rear door has never closed as tight as the passenger side. The bottom latch is broken! the little finger that clips around the pin on the body of the truck doesn't lock into place when the door is closed. I tried to take it off but of course the torx screw are in bad shape so ill be drilling them out. Anyone know the best source for a new latch? Anyone taken one apart before that might be able to help me?

 

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Haggar

Haggar

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This gets fun.... but you can reshape the top of the door with a 2x4....  I wouldn't believe it if I had not seen it....  getting the stuff to match back is odd.  its not hard, but you do some weird stuff.  and you have to do it in small small increments.    

 

Before you do this, make sure that the out at the top is a door problem, not that you have it adjusted out at the top.  Before bending, try to use shims.  (like shim bottom hinge out.)  Take a 2x2 or 2x4 and put it between the A pillar (near the hinge) and the door then push the top of the door...  you will be tweaking how the door leans out at the top.....   be careful it is harder to undo.   (you are slightly bending the door to close at the top.)

 

as you learned its like building a house of cards, so many things need to line up... so what you are doing is chasing your movement.  once the front door is right, then you need to readjust the latch and rear door to match.  there is some movement in the latch part of the quad doors to the front door.(if you readjust the front door as much as you needed to (assuming everything else was perfect) you will need to readjust the latch.)

 

you need to figure out what it pinched on.... sounds like the front of the door is "in" (toward the cab) a bit too far, causing a pinch making that last 1/2 to 3/4 a force fit.

 

Keep playing with it.  you will get it.  you just need to keep moving toward something else that has adjustment.  then you have to "accept" the happy middle ground when you get them close....

 

GL

Hag 

Oh btw  its looking a LOT better.  looks like you could lift the fender a tad and move the fender in a bit and look really good. 

 

Keep in mind it is not just a 2 dimension problem, but 3 dimension.  You may or may not have control of all dimensions so you have to guess and cheat.

 

Hag

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leathermaneod

leathermaneod

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I appreciate your help @Haggar, but I'm honestly not sure I could get it any closer than this. I tired every different combination of adjustments I could think of...I even tried moving the rear door and the latch. Oddest thing about the pinching is that it is way worse with the door adjusted all the way out (I thought the same as you when it first happened). Also, as I adjust out, then the body lines don't line up. I had to have it pull in towards the truck as much as possible in order to get it to where I did.... The pinching was also the least bad the lower the door was. So when I had it way down on the rocker, it was great, but when I move it up, it becomes a problem. Obviously having it all the way down is a problem because then it rubs. As far as tweaking the top of the door and shimming, how would I shim the door exactly? you cant put any washers on the hinge because one fastener is a bolt and one is a stud, so that would require taking the door off....I'm not exactly sure how you mean to use a 2x4 either....just cant picture it :-/

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dripley

dripley

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My door is in similar shape as yours is at the top. I locked my keys in the truck on 2 different occasions. The locksmith used a small inflatable pillow to move the upper corner away from the opening to gain access into the cab. The second time  I did it myself but did not have the pillow. My way was a little more savage than his. There is a good chance this has happened to your door. What Hag is talking about is block the door before it is closed and then pushing on the upper part to bend it ever so slightly inward. You have to stop the door before it hits the body to do this. One day I am going to do this to mine. 

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Haggar

Haggar

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Yeah the too far thing is spooky...  

 

You have to get leverage to push it.  With the height of our trucks, you will probably need to stand on another truck sitting right next to it. (you won't push hard if you are on a bucket or ladder...)   It takes time as you have to move that truck out of the way each time. (or maybe you could stand on the tailgate, and fold that up to check door operation....)

 

I have helped my neighbor a couple times.... it can take days to get it right.   (putting a total restore back together, or getting all the old stuff back to middle of adjustment, so you know where to put the new quarter panels on...)  Sometimes it just wont work out, so he would cut/weld the door to make even gaps at all the right places...

 

the shims are "C" shaped, not "O" shaped (washers)  so you just loosen the bolts and slip them in. 

 

 

fender shims.JPG

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