4th gear hunt back again

[Dave3500]

Hi all, it's been awhile,

 

I had my trans rebuilt about a year ago w an RV converter upgrade. It has been great. So last week I pulled my 68 Comanche 16' camper trailer about 800 miles from my home to Tybee Island, Georgia for a Vintage Camper Rally. Not even a hiccup! I just drove the truck a few times w no camper while down there & it was fine. On the way back, it would hunt & then go back to normal until about 1/2 way home than it seemed like it would slip in any gear. I watched as my trans temp gauge started to climb as did my engine temp, so we decided to stop at a truck stop for about 10 minutes. After that it was fine until we hit the hills of West Virginia, the truck seemed haunted. When I took my foot off the throttle it would seem to like engine brake & I don't have one. Again same thing w the gauges. So we stopped again, this time for 1/2 hr. Seemed fine again, may have hunted two times but was perfect the rest of the way home.

 

Any ideas, do I need a trans lock up kit?

Dave

[MnTom]

Those symptoms point to a visit back to the place that rebuilt your transmission. The temp rise and the engine braking feeling are not normal. The tranny shop might want to hook up to the truck and watch the tranny to see what is going on.

[Dave3500]

That was my Wifes suggestion as well. I don't know if a sensor is going out or what. I will a least give them a call now. This guy is a master.

 

Will do, will let you know what I find out. Pontoon Boat season is getting closer too!

 

Thanks,

Dave

[Mopar1973Man]

Also have the alternator checked for AC noise.

[Dave3500]

OK, Here's what's happening, John the transmission guy is saying since I towed my trailer in OD he's saying I burned up the trans. I don't think so, fluid is still red, no burnt smell. He's saying that these automatic transmissions were never intended or capable of towing in OD, only the 400LE's were made for that. So I'm not going to get anywhere w him help wise. He did say that since my check engine lights are not on that none of my new trans sensors are to blame. (this was in a phone conversation)

 

I'm thinking that since we were on the ocean the salt air may have caused a grounding issue. Anyone clean all the grounds? I have no clue as to where or how many. I will have the Alt tested at Advanced Auto, that's where I bought a reman a year or two ago maybe w only 5-10K miles on it now.Thanks for posting that Mopar. In my last Alt I rebuilt it myself w a kit from Geno's Garage but one of the diodes went out.

 

My camper is like a 16' 2280 pounds empty, 1968 Vintage Comanche single axle, it's like a flea is on my hitch. I had no heating issues needle never went off the peg while driving. It did go up to the yellow zone, 180-190, sitting in traffic waiting for an accident to be cleared in NC but as soon as we moved it was cool again. That was on the way to Georgia.

 

Mopar, years ago sent me a schematic w directions from here for the 4th gear hunt fix. One of the lines was not supposed to be cut so he used a quick connect. I will take that apart & solder the connection. A friend of my has a 96 w a 12V he had the same problem (4th gear hunt) but backed into a loading dock, jarred the vehicle & never had a problem since.

 

So if anyone can help me on the grounds that would be a start here I totally guess! 

Dave

[MnTom]

Unless the torque converter was slipping you did nothing to hurt your transmission. Personally I would not go back to that transmission guy. The first thing to try is cleaning the battery terminals, then look for grounds.

[joecool911]

I tow in OD all the time until hills. 95% of my miles are towing. Then I drop down out of OD when I hit a hill. I've got 50k since I bought this truck. Original transmission and 183,000 miles. Stock transmission with a billet double disc TC. I don't think the transmission cares what gear it's in. But lockup is important. The engines power curve is better at 2,000 rpm or above. I believe the whole power train operates cooler and more efficiently when under a load at higher RPM's. But when dropped ok of OD 55 mph seems like a good speed. I think the shop is trying to weasel out of warrenty work. If that OD issue was not in the warrenty info, I'd call bull and get serious about having them live up to their promises.

Edited May 15, 2014 by joecool911

[Dave3500]

I hear ya MnTom & Joe Cool. When My trans was rebuilt, the only thing bad in it was 4th & OD from this Hunt Haunting. I'm going to try grounds that I can find, check the quick connections from the 4th gear hunt fix, that Michael sent me years ago.

 

Also in nother post Michael thinks that this is all caused from a bad diode. It could still be diagnosed w the Alt is still in the vehicle?

 

Thanks,

Dave

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm thinking that since we were on the ocean the salt air may have caused a grounding issue.

 

All main electronics (ECM, PCM and VP44) are grounded to the battery cables NOT the body or block. So double check your cables. The body grounds are for lights and other accessories.

 

Mopar, years ago sent me a schematic w directions from here for the 4th gear hunt fix. One of the lines was not supposed to be cut so he used a quick connect. I will take that apart & solder the connection.

 

I suggest you remove all wiring mods or aftermarket devices and return all wiring back to stock lay out. There is absolutely no reason to modify the wiring. Its all about fixing the problem. If the truck ran 10-11 years without this and now requires it now that tells me something is broken and needs to be fixed.

[MnTom]

I suggest you remove all wiring mods or aftermarket devices and return all wiring back to stock lay out. There is absolutely no reason to modify the wiring. Its all about fixing the problem. If the truck ran 10-11 years without this and now requires it now that tells me something is broken and needs to be fixed.

My truck is old enough to vote and has not had anything done to the wiring to fix anything. The wiring is all stock for the engine and transmission plus charging. I have tied into the trailer wiring......

[Dave3500]

All main electronics (ECM, PCM and VP44) are grounded to the battery cables NOT the body or block. So double check your cables. The body grounds are for lights and other accessories.

 

 

I suggest you remove all wiring mods or aftermarket devices and return all wiring back to stock lay out. There is absolutely no reason to modify the wiring. Its all about fixing the problem. If the truck ran 10-11 years without this and now requires it now that tells me something is broken and needs to be fixed.

I have the original battery cables in perfect condition. I wouldn't know how to remove the 4th gear hunt fix. I took the downloaded copy that was sent to me from this site years ago to a trusted mechanic, I hate wiring issus, he's no longer in the area. That fix just added a ground & bypassed some wires but...........?

[JAG1]

I am disappointed that your transmission guy is not at least willing to look at it. That's not honorable, coupled with the bit of bs he conveyed, I don't think I'd ever go back.

 

I think you should let everyone else know the name of this trans shop cause it sounds like he's not grounded himself.

 

 

 

Trans shop horror story;

 

years ago I went to a highly recommended shop for a rebuild. With the front counter people always acting there is nothing to worry about, that  they are the best. I later walked in out of the blue to see the progress on my truck. But they in no way would let me in the shop..... 'due to insurance reasons', they said. I went ahead and acted like I was leaving but then snuck in thru the rear shop door. He he.

 

My truck there on the lift,  I noticed a long haired hippie looking guy with very dirty unwashed clothes. Unshavin' and unbathed himself, I said, you should not be working on my truck with the starter motor hanging buy the wires. Felt like sayin' something else but didn't..... I could see the smaller gauge wires stressing with the weight, but the guy argued with me about it.

 

My concern is that loads of these shops only care about the money and the 12 month warrantee.

 

A week later, truck all complete, I was on construction a job, go to start the truck, but the starter motor keeps running and would not shut off. Somehow we eventually stopped it and got home. It was a simple fix later but, 6 months goes by and my trans goes out slipping up a hill. They did fix it under warrantee but never trusted the truck after that. It never felt quite right and sold it at a good deal to the buyer.

Edited May 18, 2014 by JAG1

[Dave3500]

My situation is a little different, the guy that pulled the Trans & the guy that worked on it are in two different locations. The rebuild guy, in his mid 70's, very old school, only rebuilds, I don't think he has any diagnostic equipment. While he was rebuilding it he had me go over & check it out, the only thing that was worn was the 4th & OD because of the 4th gear hunt. I did take my truck 2 years ago to a Dodge service center& he reflashed my PCM or ECM don't remember, you guys know what it would be. That mechanic told me that my TC was weak I needed it replaced. So since I was getting my TC replaced I figured I should have my trans gone thru, esp since that is the weak link on the truck supposedly!

 

I just called the guy that removed & installed the trans, he said just to pull the Alt take it back to Advanced & get another.

 

 So one more question, does Chrysler recommend not to tow in OD w these transmissions?

 

The saga continues,

Dave

[JAG1]

I haul my camper(3475lbs fully loaded) in OD on the flats all the time, never hammer it up the hills. I just sort of let the truck ease into the hills and go at about what is reasonable, never pushing it hard to give all she's got. I let the truck mostly decide when to shift of OD and go back in.

My trans temp gauge is the real guide how I drive the truck in hot weather hauling the weight..

Edited May 19, 2014 by JAG1

[MnTom]

You can tow in O/D all you want. In fact the transmission will like you for it because it will be in lock up and the temps run coolest that way. If you get to where it wants to hunt or your pyrometer is getting to high then you should down shift. I pull a 28' fiver in O/D all the time and can pull a 6% grade with no problem. If i am below about 55 mph I lock out O/D because when my transmission shifts into O/D it shifts so fast that the turbo barks real bad so I run the speed up, let off the throttle and push the button at the same time then just ease back into it and ride.

[Dave3500]

I too run w the trans temp gauge, using it the same as you Jag1.

 

You can tow in O/D all you want. In fact the transmission will like you for it because it will be in lock up and the temps run coolest that way. If you get to where it wants to hunt or your pyrometer is getting to high then you should down shift. I pull a 28' fiver in O/D all the time and can pull a 6% grade with no problem. If i am below about 55 mph I lock out O/D because when my transmission shifts into O/D it shifts so fast that the turbo barks real bad so I run the speed up, let off the throttle and push the button at the same time then just ease back into it and ride.

Is it stated anywhere that we should not tow in OD? I thought that the Overdrive was designed to allow the engine to run more efficiently! 

 

I do not have a pyro or a boost gauge but I usually drive to get my most MPG while not getting run over by the 18 wheelers if that makes any sense. ST tires are only rated for 65MPH so I try not to push it much beyond that.

 

Wow a 28' fiver, don't give my wife any ideas! For me I'm only a standard cab, so that would be like the tail waggin the dog. She has in mind a resto on one of the old Spartans. I hope not, this 16' Comanche is plent big for the two of us. What mods do you have to pull a camper that big? Are you following Michaels recipe?

 

So this afternoons activities included pulling the Alt getting it bench tested at Advance Auto & it failed the diode test, it said 8.1. So I had the guy check the replacement they were giving me & it failed too. So I have another coming in the morning. So since I needed to get Hay, I had no choice but to but it back on, it did run better the Hunt happened twice & after that ran like a charm at Highway speed & enery speed in between. We'll see what happens in the morning, w my luck they did the set up for the test wrong & I won't get my replacement or something like that.

 

I'll keep you posted,

Dave

[MnTom]

Your truck would handle my fiver real easily! I run ST tires on it and generally set the cruise at about 67 mph or so. Then I just sit and ride! Even with my boat on the back of the trailer I only have a gross weight of 17,160lbs according to my last weight slip.

[Dave3500]

Looks like you have some extra fine juice in your truck, 12V! I like those torque numbers, nice 833, I Like it! Is 1996 the first year of the 47RE?

[MnTom]

Yep, Dave the first year. The only 'problem' is that it being a first part of a new model I can't put a lock up switch like3 everybody else can. Yea, I do like the torque. The torque line on my dyno sheet is actually quite flat! I don't know if you can make out what is what, but the first time I dyno'd the truck had 299HP and 678TQ.

[Dave3500]

Well I finally have another Alt in my truck, I got it in my truck this afternoon & had to go to a Cleveland Indians game tonight, my wife won the tickets, great seats, perfect weather. They did win against the Detroit Tigers, Yipee!

 

But thank you all! It was worth my time combing through the TC issues here. I don't think I would have started w the Alt again since I don't have that many miles on this rebuilt one. Then alsoThanks to someones suggestion of having the replacement checked before I left the store. Three out of the four replacements were bad on the VAC side, including one new one. I would have been chasing me tail for weeks. Even the guys at the part store didn't believe it. I didn't even start it yet but it should be OK.

 

Now, what makes the diodes go bad, this is like my 4th Alt & I only have like 203K. I don't mind cause the replacement is lifetime & I can swap out the Alt now in about 20min. (less time than I can clean a horse stall) Whinee!!!!

 

Thanks again,

Dave