Well gang... I've been playing with theories and ideas for long enough now its time to put them into a design and see if it actually works. We all know the 24V's seem to take a good tumble in MPG's as the winter sets in well ISX proved that with the 12V engines with static timing that MPG's don't change. Well if you look at it the only thing that could be tossing this out the window is the IAT sensor on the 24V is changing the VP44 performance. Most know that colder air produces better HP/TQ because colder air is denser and requires more fuel to keep balanced. Well if you reverse this and warm the air (in theory) the VP44 should retune and burn according to the manifold temp. So what I've done tonight is fished through my resistor pile and found 3 I'm going to use for test candidates. Orange - White - Red - Gold = 3.9K Ohm = 116*F IATRed - Violet - Red - Gold = 2.7K ohm = 132*F IATRed - Black - Red - Gold = 2.0K ohm = 148*F IAT So now tomorrow I'm going to pull 3 test runs on the same piece of highway... Seeing if the highier the IAT temp increases the MPG or not... I'll can give you something to think about... Grid heaters are NOT controlled directly by the IAT... With the 2.7K Ohm resistor in place before even starting the grid heater still where hitting as normal. So there is more to the grid heater that the IAT temps... ... On the cutting edge again...

So far it has helped me. It may help only in the winter time, but I am not sure yet, as I haven't run it in the summer. So, currently time will tell.

Im waiting on prowelder to.get one ready an im going to get one bc I idle alot!

I'm waiting on a reply from Prowelder as well. It's prety much always cold here in Montana, so I think the results will be nice.

How about using a relay that keeps the IAT in the circuit by default when starting and then a momentary push button that latches the relay on and switches in the resistor of say 4.7 K. or so? Relay only de-energizes when ignition is turned off. [ATTACH=CONFIG]2622[/ATTACH]

Could someone help me understand this diagram? I'm having a really hard time following the flow of current through it. I bought a DPDT relay today and was hoping to wire up a system like this tomorrow. Here's just like what I got if it helps. http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGOTnAjrLjNQv97Y8aifYdnlPi2NaKB2HOzGBfXbkrgCSAcTrJqQhttp://forum.mopar1973man.com/image/jpg;base64,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 I tried attaching a pic of the wiring diagram of the relay but all that shows is that little red x, not sure why.

Boy I sure do wish I high a high idle fooler!!! Been sitting in the same spot now for almost 6 hours now!!! Its about 88° here!!! Wish I could let my truck idle and keep the ac good and cold! But I don't so I'm not idling for very long at a time, just long enough to cool off!

Im waiting on prowelder to.get one ready an im going to get one bc I idle alot!

I'm waiting on a reply from Prowelder as well. It's prety much always cold here in Montana, so I think the results will be nice.

Don't worry guys, they will be ready today!!!!

Could someone help me understand this diagram? I'm having a really hard time following the flow of current through it. I bought a DPDT relay today and was hoping to wire up a system like this tomorrow. Here's just like what I got if it helps. http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGOTnAjrLjNQv97Y8aifYdnlPi2NaKB2HOzGBfXbkrgCSAcTrJqQhttp://forum.mopar1973man.com/image/jpg;base64,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 I tried attaching a pic of the wiring diagram of the relay but all that shows is that little red x, not sure why.

Yeah all I see is a X also. But here's the skinny. This is what we in the HVAC field call an ice cube relay. The bottom two connectors are your coil. The second from the top, both left and right are your led or input legs. The top two, left and right are ether NO or NC contacts. The third from the top, both left and right are also NO or NC contacts. You can verify which ones are you NC and NO contacts by takeing an ohm meter from the second from the top connector to the top connector, and third from top connecter. The one that gives you resistence is your NO contact. The other will be your NC contact. This is done with a non-energized ralay. Make sure your coil leds are 12v and not 24 or 120v I hope this helps. If I didn't explain well enough, let me know.

Thanks! I was at a friend's place who is a real wiz with this stuff and he drew up a diagram for me so I'm good to go:thumb1: He even helped me figure out what I need to do my high idle with 2 switches instead of the 3 that i had.

Any one think this might cause a complication if used in conjunction with propane injection? I've been doing some reading on that and thinking about combining the two. I'd immagine it'll be safe, but I don't know if the propane mixed air ignites faster or slower, and if the advanced timing wold still be ok. Both mods should give both more power and more fuel economy.

Any one think this might cause a complication if used in conjunction with propane injection? I've been doing some reading on that and thinking about combining the two. I'd immagine it'll be safe, but I don't know if the propane mixed air ignites faster or slower, and if the advanced timing wold still be ok. Both mods should give both more power and more fuel economy.

But when you doing you math make sure to include the gallons of propane too.

What would you like to know about propane? There is a massive thread here: Propane & water Meth Thread

I am using both currently and have my SMARTY on setting 1, the fuel saver and aggressive timing.

Hey guys, I apologize for this but I cannot find a picture of the MPG Fooler setup. I am an electrical chicken so if someone could link a photo of the resistor installed so that I can better understand I would very much appreciate it.

I'm looking at ways to safely improve fuel economy (and possibly sneek in some extra power:evilgrin:). Propane here in Montana is less than $2.00/gallon as is the blue walmart brand wiper fluid (water methanol blend good to -20F). I mostly drive my truck empty and occasionally pull a travel trailer. My concern is the advancing of injection timing with the MPG fooler. Will that advancing of the injection timing be a bad idea when combined with propane and meth/water injection? I know that these "drugs" have the potential to really hurt our engines if not used in moderation. I also know one of the big risks with them is predetonation. I just don't know if the predetonation risk comes from injecting too much propane or if it's from excessive advancement of injection timing. Are they seperate issues - can I use all three together?

Unknown yet... The trouble is there is no way of seeing the VP44 timing value. But I know where people have stacked Edge Comp and Smarty both with timing and ended up eating a piston...

The smarty instructions specifically say not to combine the smarty programs with advance with a programmer that does advance.

The smarty instructions specifically say not to combine the smarty programs with advance with a programmer that does advance.

Hence why I mention it... Because if that is a known failure then you got to be careful with how much timing and such your messing with. (Propane / Methanol)

The IAT/MPG fooler should not affect the AMOUNT of timing advance... It should give you the timing the ECM/smarty/other box specifies... whether the engine is hot or cold. That's all it does, fool the IAT. If that gives better mpg, then so be it.

Thanks. That makes sense. I was worried the results of adding the MPG fooler would be like stacking two tuners (a box and a program in the ECM). I've done quite a bit of reading on the use of propane and it seems to be safe, as long as you don't use too much, and it's properly installed and operated. The same can be said about a lot of performance products (or 2 cycle oil I suppose). The other thing I was worried about was severe knocking (pre detonation) and the subsequent damage. From what I understand, propane does have a lot lower self ignition temperature, and that is where the potential for severe engine damage comes from. The way around that problem is adding only small amounts of propane (pre turbo). This way the amount of propane in the cylinder isn't enough to ignite on it's own just because of compression temperatures - it needs the diesel injection to start the explosion, and the propane in there just adds a little fuel to it. A proper propane injection kit doesn't add timing. So, I think this MPG fooler will be safe to use with a tuner box and a conservative amount of propane. :thumb1:Now all I have to do is convince my wife that I need this.

Thanks. That makes sense. I was worried the results of adding the MPG fooler would be like stacking two tuners (a box and a program in the ECM). I've done quite a bit of reading on the use of propane and it seems to be safe, as long as you don't use too much, and it's properly installed and operated. The same can be said about a lot of performance products (or 2 cycle oil I suppose). The other thing I was worried about was severe knocking (pre detonation) and the subsequent damage. From what I understand, propane does have a lot lower self ignition temperature, and that is where the potential for severe engine damage comes from. The way around that problem is adding only small amounts of propane (pre turbo). This way the amount of propane in the cylinder isn't enough to ignite on it's own just because of compression temperatures - it needs the diesel injection to start the explosion, and the propane in there just adds a little fuel to it. A proper propane injection kit doesn't add timing. So, I think this MPG fooler will be safe to use with a tuner box and a conservative amount of propane. Now all I have to do is convince my wife that I need this.

Actually propane's autoignition temp is almost twice as high as diesel's. You just don't want a ton of propane going in and filling up the bottom of the intercooler since it is heavier than air. If all that propane somehow receives a spark, kaboom. This is why it is safer to install it in the intake horn, just remember that you will also have to overcome boost pressure, so if you want 5psi of propane and you are building 10psi of boost, you would want 15psi of propane.

When testing the propane system on my truck, I would listen to the truck run without propane, then turn on the propane, the engine would smooth out, turn off the propane and about 2 seconds the engine would be running like a regular Cummins again. So, the propane being injected into the airstream before the turbo only lasts about 2 seconds before using up the propane. ISX needs to come out here and make a video of my truck with and without propane at idle, that way everyone can hear and see what it does. HINT ISX: Road Trip!!!!