The apparent inevitable 2nd gen front-end rebuild..... suggestions?

[KATOOM]

So as the story goes..... The past couple weeks I've been hearing and feeling with my superhero like senses as I attentively and constantly monitor my truck for any odd noises, vibrations, and clunks.....I thought I felt something.

Very difficult to detect but definitely something is not right and the best way I can describe it is as a very lite thump transmitted through the front suspension when I hit a sharp small bump, like a road reflector bump. Other than that it rides glassy smooth.

Luckily I live on some fairly low traveled rural roads because I've been driving the center and wrong lane quite a bit trying to identify where the irritating feel is coming from, whereby I finally got under the truck and closely inspected everything and yup.....as expected, the track-bar is loose, the tie-rod ends, drag link and pitman ends have play, and the ball joints have a little up and down slop. Crapola..... NOT what I feel like doing or spending money on right now.

I guess I'm going to look seriously at the 3rd gen track-bar (Mopar # 52122362AF for I hear around $350), but other than that I'm not sure about any other components.

Ball joints are freaking crazy expensive so Carli's are out of the question but I understand XRF is supposed to be OK.

At this stage of the game I'm just kinda looking for suggestions and pictures if anyone has some. Since 99% of people with 2nd gen trucks have had to do this, I'm guessing there should be some solid do's and dont's. Thanks fellas.

[notlimah]

After I threw my FASS and gauges I went straight to steering. So far I've done VP steering box brace, and a DOR track bar. It's really tightend up the front end A LOT! I'm waiting for synergy to release their new steering links and I'm throwin those on the truck as well.

 

I know there were/are cheaper alternatives but I wanted to go with parts I knew would last. Lots of guys here have plenty of good things to say about mopar replacement steering and such.  

[dripley]

I replaced everything form the drag link out with Moog about 4 and 1/2 years ago and it is still holding up. Of  course as soon as I did all the work I started hearing nothing good about Moog. Mine is still tight except for the right lower ball joint that has a touch of play in it. The track bar only lasted about 70K  and was shot. But at $80 I just put another one on since it is not a hard job to do. I just cant bring my self to put $350 + into a track bar. As far as the rest of the I have been looking at the same Mopar part you are looking at though I believe I have read the you need 17"  wheels of cut part of the ball stud off on the TRE for it to fit. Not sure about that with the Mopar part but it would worth checking on. Quad $X$ has a what they call the OEM ball joint kit for $250. My OEM's last near 200k and if it is the same(who knows for sure)I will probably use those next time. The upper is greasable the lower is not.My thought on the greaseable vs no is that the OEM was not greaseable and I got very good life out of them. + it is just one less maintenance item for me to worry about.

 

I keep hearing about the Synergy kit for the 2nd gen's, but have heard nothing about the cost. I am thinking they are going to be very proud of though. 

[Me78569]

Dripley,

 

Dennydriveshaft as OEM ball joints for a good bit cheaper than quad4X4

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/c904_ball_joints.html

[dripley]

58 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

Dripley,

 

Dennydriveshaft as OEM ball joints for a good bit cheaper than quad4X4

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/c904_ball_joints.html

I have seen those, just not convinced they are the same as the oe. Spicer has a more expensive one that might be. But who really knows. If the ones you link last over 100k that is pretty good for 00-02 trucks from what I have read. If it wasn't such a big job to do I wouldn't matter as much to me.

[Me78569]

I have talked  ALOT with people who have access to Spicer PN's and I am all but sure those are OEM.  Do you have a link to the higher priced version of them?    I am VERY interested to get to the bottom of it. 

 

I have heard of the multi grade spicer stuff, but I have never been able to find 2 different grades of ball joints.  The PN match what spicer says is the "good ones" for the Dana 60. 

 

whatever that is worth

[01cummins4ever]

I used lukes links on all the rod ends and kept my original track bar, did it about 5 years ago and still rock solid, They are greaseable  and rebuildable if the need ever comes. I rebuilt my original track bar for about $100. The only draw back is the link on the track bar rubbed on the front diff cover a little when turning and bouncing on a rough road, so I just ground it down a little with a grinder and the rubbing went away until I installed a 400 lb. ranch hand on the front. Now I have a set of heavy duty snowplow springs waiting to install, and I think that will cure that problem.

[dripley]

On 5/25/2016 at 11:47 AM, Me78569 said:

I have talked  ALOT with people who have access to Spicer PN's and I am all but sure those are OEM.  Do you have a link to the higher priced version of them?    I am VERY interested to get to the bottom of it. 

 

I have heard of the multi grade spicer stuff, but I have never been able to find 2 different grades of ball joints.  The PN match what spicer says is the "good ones" for the Dana 60. 

 

whatever that is worth

Her is the kit I have seen. I have not checked out any part numbers since I am not that close to doing yet and I have not tried to see if you can just buy the joints themselves,http://www.quad4x4.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=acton&key=4510

[Me78569]

while he is a good resource for info I have found his prices to reflect that.  I have found parts on his site elsewhere for %50 of what he has them listed as.  

 

I don't think there is a difference between the quad ball joints and the ones listed on Denny's site. 

 

I dont think he sells just the dana joints.

http://www.quad4x4.com/category/D216/00-02-D60DF-BALL-JOINT--STEERING/1.html

 

 

interestingly enough the greaseable kit he has is ~$200 more and it looks like they are just acdelco joints.  

[Mopar1973Man]

That's the thing I get tired of... Price hikes for a part because it grease-able or otherwise and sold by a known name on Internet like Quad here for this example and the price goes high for the parts but you can by the very same part for less. Not like Quad is manufacturing ball joint I'm pretty sure is common part just re-boxed. Kind of like by a Mopar oil filter it just a repainted Fleetguard oil filter that is re-boxed again.

[KATOOM]

Quad does tend to be a bit "pricey".

[dripley]

I was sitting here typing up a response and trying to look things up to link and just give up. ME, I like Dennys prices just not convinced it is OE. Then again I am not promoting Quad 4X4, just saw the kit( a little over board for me ) but contains non grease-able lowers, which I am after, but still not convinced it is oe. Plus the "kit" lists things like the nut, the cotter pins, and other things that should come with an individual ball joint of any brand when purchased. My Moog's came with all that hardware for about 50 bucks each. All the other stuff is just I candy. The only other thing I have seen that gets my attention is some of the "Mopar" sites that sell parts for us lists a set of 1 upper and lower for about $160 and claim them to be OE. It you have not seen them Google the part number from the parts look up and they will pop up.

 

On a side note to ME. When I say ME I mean you. When I say me in my text I mean me it is not you. So ME, this aint helping the head ache I get whenever we talk about ball joints.

 

KATOOM, I hope I have not derailed your topic. The only experience I have is with the Moog that I bought and have served me (I) pretty well over the years. Most I see speaking of them now do not speak well of them. 

[Me78569]

I agree with you completely Dripley,

 

It is hard to know what was truly OEM, I am not %100 convinced about denny's either.  I am really just going off of the limited PN info I have.  $70 a side is cheap in terms of OEM compared to what Dodge will sell you, but if we go off of the 2x price rule of thumb ( dodge prices) it is starting to get closer in price hahah.  

 

 

 

For whatever it is worth the last ball joints in my truck were moogs...they had about 15k on them and they were as loose as bells...literally.  I dunno what was to blame for that as the PO installed them.

 

all in all it's a crap shoot haha.

[KATOOM]

I appreciate all the input guys.  Yeah, I'll admit that I've become completely stumped on what to do simply because the more people I talk to and the more kits I look up the more confusing this whole adventure gets.

I really just dont understand how ball joint quality can vary so widely.  I mean if OE has lasted me over 100k miles then how bad could any aftermarket ones be?  But yet so many people say that their aftermarket front-end parts only last 10k-20k miles is just CRAZY to me.  Are improper installs to blame or are parts these day really just made out of play-doh and Super Glue?

And you'd think being able to shoot a little grease in them every now and again would be a benefit since they're only pre-packed with whatever grease they come with.....and thats it.  So technically they could be fairly dry of lubricant off the shelf.

 

None of that even addresses the track bar or the tie-rod either.....

 

But I have to say dripley that your statement below makes my head hurt trying to understand what you're trying to say.  And whether or not you're an English Composition major genius or just had a too many beers before typing this out.....

 

12 hours ago, dripley said:

On a side note to ME. When I say ME I mean you. When I say me in my text I mean me it is not you. So ME, this aint helping the head ache I get whenever we talk about ball joints.

 

Edited May 27, 2016 by KATOOM

[Me78569]

Katoom,

 

after I swore off Moog I started using Rayebesto pro stuff and have been happy.  MY wifes truck has it on her's and it is holding up nice. 

 

Whatever that's worth.  

 

AC Delco pro  = Rayebesto pro as far as i can tell.

[dripley]

42 minutes ago, KATOOM said:

I appreciate all the input guys.  Yeah, I'll admit that I've become completely stumped on what to do simply because the more people I talk to and the more kits I look up the more confusing this whole adventure gets.

I really just dont understand how ball joint quality can vary so widely.  I mean if OE has lasted me over 100k miles then how bad could any aftermarket ones be?  But yet so many people say that their aftermarket front-end parts only last 10k-20k miles is just CRAZY to me.  Are improper installs to blame or are parts these day really just made out of play-doh and Super Glue?

And you'd think being able to shoot a little grease in them every now and again would be a benefit since they're only pre-packed with whatever grease they come with.....and thats it.  So technically they could be fairly dry of lubricant off the shelf.

 

None of that even addresses the track bar or the tie-rod either.....

 

But I have to say dripley that your statement below makes my head hurt trying to understand what you're trying to say.  And whether or not you're an English Composition major genius or just had a too many beers before typing this out.....

 

 

That was my poor stab at Whos on First with Abbott and Costello if you remember them. Interacting with Me gets a little comical  to me sometimes.

 

39 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

Katoom,

 

after I swore off Moog I started using Rayebesto pro stuff and have been happy.  MY wifes truck has it on her's and it is holding up nice. 

 

Whatever that's worth.  

 

AC Delco pro  = Rayebesto pro as far as i can tell.

Are you using these on your 2000?

[Me78569]

Right now on the 2000 I have

 

Spicer ball joints, that seem to be doing good after 15 ish k dennydriveshaft ones

 

Acdelco pro steering T setup, with a no name pitman arm that I need to replace.  

[notlimah]

To me, track bar should be DOR's or DT pro fab since they're practically the same, but they're the only kit designed specifically for the 2nd gen. Not a 3rd gen modded to fit the 2nd gen. Same goes for either synergys soon to be release steering kit for 2nd gens or DORs which are both drop in kits.