Help me understand this Taraf Business with China and others....

[JAG1]

We, the United States is putting a tax on goods coming in from China? Or are we putting a tax on goods going to China?

[wil440]

From China, and also from Europe and soon to be also from Mexico, I see the reason for it which is to try and lower the amount imported and manufacture more in the US but It may just mean you end up paying more for stuff as it's a tax on the end user really and china fixed there own tarrifs against the US so checkmate .... waste of time

[JAG1]

In the long run it might be just the thing to help balance trade. Of course I could be wrong, but I look at the market too.... it needs its wings clipped once in while to not fly so high that it flops from unsubstantiated prices.

[wil440]

To be fair I don't think trade will be rebalanced take emissions for one, all the wests new vehicles are aftertreatment, adblue, and getting worse and more costly, I work in heavy mining, costs us a fortune, we supply road building and construction materials which is right down at the bottom of the chain.... no roads no inforstructure, the west puts handcuffs on every business in the land making everything we produce way to expensive to compete against the countries that dont give a >>>> this is why china and india and the like win every time, I'm rambling here but bear with me..... GM camaro and corvette new models banned in europe from august because of emissions..... bet they will still be sold in china,  British Steel.... gone to the wall last week because the EU says our government can not give the company a loan as it's against EU competition rules.... EERR we are leaving so butt out but no.. company has gone bust because of cheap chinese steel which is state subsidised

[Mopar1973Man]

I hear ya. 

 

21 hours ago, wil440 said:

GM camaro and corvette new models banned in europe from august because of emissions.....

Just like the VW vehicle over there in the EU are illegal to be sold here in the US. You guy have vehicle with way better MPG's that US has. There was a thread here on M73M where guy went to the EU for vacation and wanted to buy the vehilce he was driving over there in the US but it can't be sold or brought to the US because its too efficient. Being all US highways are based from fuel taxes and overly efficient vehicles would hurt the highway tax dollars.

 

21 hours ago, wil440 said:

British Steel.... gone to the wall last week because the EU says our government can not give the company a loan as it's against EU competition rules.... EERR

China has the worst emissions and air quality in the world. I've done some study on that and very shocking to see all the different device people wear to just breathe clean filtered air because of all the manufacturing and cheap goods. USA is so crazy about making vehicle less efficient. Go figure...

 

 

[wil440]

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

I hear ya. 

 

Just like the VW vehicle over there in the EU are illegal to be sold here in the US. You guy have vehicle with way better MPG's that US has. There was a thread here on M73M where guy went to the EU for vacation and wanted to buy the vehilce he was driving over there in the US but it can't be sold or brought to the US because its too efficient. Being all US highways are based from fuel taxes and overly efficient vehicles would hurt the highway tax dollars.

 

China has the worst emissions and air quality in the world. I've done some study on that and very shocking to see all the different device people wear to just breathe clean filtered air because of all the manufacturing and cheap goods. USA is so crazy about making vehicle less efficient. Go figure...

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

I hear ya. 

 

Just like the VW vehicle over there in the EU are illegal to be sold here in the US. You guy have vehicle with way better MPG's that US has. There was a thread here on M73M where guy went to the EU for vacation and wanted to buy the vehilce he was driving over there in the US but it can't be sold or brought to the US because its too efficient. Being all US highways are based from fuel taxes and overly efficient vehicles would hurt the highway tax dollars.

 

China has the worst emissions and air quality in the world. I've done some study on that and very shocking to see all the different device people wear to just breathe clean filtered air because of all the manufacturing and cheap goods. USA is so crazy about making vehicle less efficient. Go figure...

 

 

You say the US has bad emissions, i've just last week took my ram for it's MOT test which is a yearly check for safety and emissions, they test for NOX I think, limit for 1998 is 0.03ppm  ram blasted it at 0.0067ppm, the tester guy was gobsmacked, but to be fair he was also gobsmacked the first time he tested my 3500 V8 5.9 back in 2004 and that was way under what the rest of the EU/Jap crap is/was for the year

there is a down side though.... all the euroboxes are pure garbage

[KATOOM]

Americans clearly suffer from short term memory loss...and why we're in the tariff position we're in now.

 

In short, America became globalized back in the early 90's (thanks to Clinton) and China started to grow at an unprecedented rate due to the overwhelmingly unfair advantages they were getting.  The same goes for most all other foreign countries who trade with the US too as we pay more money for their stuff to come here than they pay for our stuff to go there.  That is....."IF".....they even allow American products to be imported or used at all.  Its complete BS on many levels and has caused American businesses to take their manufacturing out of the country...only to bring it back in from foreign soil cheaper than if it was done here.  Again...its BS and over the past 30 years we've lost an immense amount of integrity, control, jobs, and infrastructure because of it!!!!!

 

Anyone who doesnt understand the dynamics of whats going on and how America was ONLY a great country because of our manufacturing and trade power...and how we're dangerously allowing the rest of the world to step all over us as they grow bigger and better on the backs of the money you and I make, needs to wake up.  Its CRAZY.....

 

And to think people are against the added tariffs on Mexico because we wont have avocados in December.  PATHETIC and embarrassing.  If Americans dont start making America what it was soon then you'll have way more to worry about in 20 years than avocados.

[JAG1]

Thanks Katoom, that's what I wanted was an affirmation of the way I thought it might be and explains why Trump said they have an unfair advantage over us

[dripley]

Well said. Politicians have talked about for a long but this the first big challenge to them. Should have happened many years ago.

Edited June 2, 2019 by dripley

[Mopar1973Man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

7

2 hours ago, KATOOM said:

Americans clearly suffer from short term memory loss...and why we're in the tariff position we're in now.

 

In short, America became globalized back in the early 90's (thanks to Clinton) and China started to grow at an unprecedented rate due to the overwhelmingly unfair advantages they were getting.  The same goes for most all other foreign countries who trade with the US too as we pay more money for their stuff to come here than they pay for our stuff to go there.  That is....."IF".....they even allow American products to be imported or used at all.  Its complete BS on many levels and has caused American businesses to take their manufacturing out of the country...only to bring it back in from foreign soil cheaper than if it was done here.  Again...its BS and over the past 30 years we've lost an immense amount of integrity, control, jobs, and infrastructure because of it!!!!!

 

Anyone who doesnt understand the dynamics of whats going on and how America was ONLY a great country because of our manufacturing and trade power...and how we're dangerously allowing the rest of the world to step all over us as they grow bigger and better on the backs of the money you and I make, needs to wake up.  Its CRAZY.....

 

And to think people are against the added tariffs on Mexico because we wont have avocados in December.  PATHETIC and embarrassing.  If Americans dont start making America what it was soon then you'll have way more to worry about in 20 years than avocados.

 

Kind of like Moog Ball Joints, Assassin Mechanical Fuel Pumps, and Smarty Tuners are all China made. Just a few off the top of my head.

 

[KATOOM]

I just find it ironically hypocritical how people view such topics...  They complain that everything is low quality hecho en China but they dont want to pay a few more bucks for something made in America.  They complain that there's no good jobs in America but they're afraid to pay a few more bucks for something made in America.  When it comes right down to it, they dont want to give up anything for sake that it might disrupt their complacent little lives.  Except that they've completely overlooked how much quality of life they've given up in such a short amount of time because they keep accepting less.  Sad...

[Mopar1973Man]

Like locally everyone wants everyone to buy locally. That's fine but when local prices are out of control. Example a metric set of Crows Feet. They want $50 bucks for a simple set of crows feet. Then check Harbor Freight... (Mostly China made stuff). It's $11 dollars for the Crows Feet set. I still bought the set locally and paid the high price but I should have just waited till I went back down to Ontario, OR and got the set for cheaper. Comparing prices between the two local set was 555% higher than Harbor Freight. What sucks I've never owned a set of Crows Feet for all these years and only needed them for this one job. So was the investment of the $50 buck for a one time use a wise investment? Most likely not would be better to buy China made Harbor Freight.

 

@KATOOM you do have a point. I've got no problem with buying American Made stuff as long as the price is competitive not like what I was dealing with and paying 555% mark up for a locally supplied tool. That complete BS and unfair. Now if the selection was the USA made Crows feet for $20 buck and the Harbor Freight is $11 I would have jumped for the USA made for the $20 for sure.

 

Just being made in America doesn't make it right to mark up 555% for the same product. 

 

Kind of like Dodge, Ford and Chevy truck prices are now gone out of sight. Then Toyota, Kia, etc are cheaper priced. 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Mopar1973Man

[JAG1]

I hear the Toyota truck owners aren't too happy with the quality either.

 

The trend of everyone wanting cheaper isn't necessarily the main culprit. It's the manufacturers trying to keep costs down and profits up against taxation and regulation. Even farmers are forced to grow fast growing quick response GMO crops. I just took a bite of the most beautiful looking plum I ever saw. It tastes like water and fell apart in the sink. It's garbage. Last week same thing with cherries we bought.... garbage.

 

I think there are a lot of aspects today removing the quality of life in general.

Edited June 2, 2019 by JAG1

[KATOOM]

You guys are both right...and both examples are a DIRECT result of America dealing with the backlash of unfair trade.  Imagine if growing crops in American farmers didnt have to compete with the cheap crops pouring in from other countries.  Imagine what tools would cost in America if American tooling companies didnt have to compete with low quality / low price garbage from other countries.

 

Yes, there are American companies/businesses who are charging too much for their stuff...but thats capitalism and they wont survive for long unless they change their ways.  And there are also American companies who are simply trying to stay ahead of inflation which has been severely compromised by the unfair trade America has been allowing for decades.

 

Point being is if Americans want to be "global" then they also have to understand that EVERYTHING global affects EVERYONE globally.  Meaning, what happens in China, Iran, Japan, Germany, Mexico, Canada, etc, etc...affects us in America and the exact opposite.  Meaning what happens in America should also affect those countries too.  But thats not how the politicians beat their political propagated drums.  Rather there's this completely misguided and misunderstood idea spread by politicians and media that America has an endless bank account and we should be paying for the rest of the worlds issues.  And were does the American money come from???  It comes from "manufacturing and trade"...

[Mopar1973Man]

Since this thread is growing pretty good I'm going to move this to the Gov't Forum. 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

[JAG1]

Amazing Mike, did the happen to you in the picture?

[KATOOM]

24 minutes ago, JAG1 said:

Amazing Mike, did the happen to you in the picture?

 

I certainly hope not because its no fun breaking tools since it usually results in getting hurt somehow... Mikes a good guy.

 

I cant express enough how much I find it offensive that American companies can have some factory in China make their product and ship it back to America...and its still cheaper than making it here.   Whats wrong with our legislators who think this is good for you and me and our kids.

Edited June 4, 2019 by KATOOM

[Mopar1973Man]

No. Just happen to find that on FB right after this post started. I figured I'd share. My example is the Crows Feet.