Dana 80 pinion seal leak

[Concreter]

Replaced the seal on my truck while the driveline was being rebuilt, was pretty meticulous about prepping the surface and using rtv to try and seal everything. Got the driveline back installed and took it for a drive and is leaking worse than before. I used an impact to remove and re install the pinion nut and used a new nut. I’m wondering if maybe I got the wrong seal? Through my reading I think there is a flanged and non flanged yoke, and I thought mine was non flanged. Also wondering the removal process for the breather tube as thinking that could be part of the problem. Thanks 

Also I used a speed sleeve on the yoke to repair the pinion sleeve and this is the seal that I used mopar 5015618AB from rock auto 

[Dieselfuture]

When mine started to leak it wasn't from the rubber part of the seal, the metal rusted through because it's a double wall, outer wall for road debris. Stuff gets trapped between and rusts. I used a 3/4 impact to take it of and put it on, reused the nut and it went about 1/4 farther than before. I didn't use the sleeve as it only had a small grove on the yoke. Next time I'll buy a new yoke, may even get a bigger size one and have a local shop build an aluminum driveshaft. 

[Towrigdually]

Do you have a disc or drum 80? I can check mine, it’s disc, and see which type of seal. 

As for breather tube, just pull straight up. Should come off easily. 

 

[Evan]

My dana 80 pinion nut came loose and took the seal out. This also allowed the pinion the walk in and out of the ring gear.

 

Ever since it wont hold a seal and is dieing a slow death as chunks of metal and sludge are always in the oil.  

 

Its been eating itself for about 100k. I exspect it to lock up on me any day but the damn thing just keeps going.

 

I do have a grooved yoke but reinstalled just off it. Id assume vibrations are keep it from sealing more than anything. I think ive done the seal twice but have done alot of piniin seals in the last few years so im not sure

 

Im watching for a dana70 or disc 80 but may have to deal with drumbs or a american axle whatever those are.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Evan

[Haggar]

Evan,

Just rebuild it.   IF you can't find a complete rear, just yank it apart and rebuild.  It goes easy.  just heavy. The only special tool is a good case spreader (and a dial indicator and magnetic stand but everyone should have those).  (you can do it without a case spreader, but you do not get the proper pre-load on the carrier bearings so they will fail sooner but it will be years).

 

Purchase one extra set of bearings (or just the cones really).  Use a flap wheel to open up the ID of the bearings so they slip on.  This way you can easily slide the bearings on and off to move shims around to get clearances and contact pattern exactly correct.

 

If you know what you are doing it will take a Saturday.  If you are unsure and need to double check everything and think about it a lot and are unsure it will take a weekend and a week of evenings.  It still takes me a week of evenings....

 

Next time I do it I will drop the axle out of the truck.  I think I would overall be faster.  The differential at full suspension droop has the carrier rolling out the back of the housing making it harder to get that heavy sucker in.

 

HTH
Hag

[Mopar1973Man]

That is something I would love to learn someday. Never done any axle work ever. 

[Evan]

I just did 4.88 gears in my jeep. Lucky me i got to do 2 sets in the rear.

I made set up bearings and have all the tools now to do it.

 

Gear and bearing set for dana 80 is 800-1000 bucks.  I thought about doing 4.10 do the front at same time.

[Mopar1973Man]

Yeah but I've got no clue how to set all that up. How to torque it etc. Last article here mentions torque on the pinion nut being quite high and needing a torque multiplier. I know the article is gone but I never done any axle work before. I've always had shops do the repair. If you have the knowledge on this it would be great to have an new article made... 

[Evan]

I haven't looked at dana 80 specs or 70 tourge is probly rotating of 12-20inchlbs that puts actual nut tourge way up there.

 

Its all easy when axcess to proper tools knowing how to use tools and hit numbers that are provided.

 

I say easy but i still was lucky enough to smoke my first set of rear gears. I think due to a combination of things one of the biggest not setting pinion bearings or i guess seating is the word im after.  

I i hit the numbers correctly but the pinion loosend as bearings eventually seated themselves throwing gear mesh aswell as preload way off.

 

No corners can be cut with gears. There is a ball park backlash aswell as pre load. Even printed gear pattern but this ball park is fairly small.

 

As particular as you are about stuff youd for sure be a good gear guy. Could charge anywhere from 750-1500 just labor to set up a single set of gears.

 

For me just dana 80 parts are exspensive so doing it twice would be a huge expense. So ill wait run it till it dies maybe gain some more gear installs before i tackle it.

 

Edit

Dana80 pinion pre load is 25-40 in lbs actual nut tourge is high but doesnt necessarily affect turning preload due to pre load be setvwith shims

Edited September 17, 2021 by Evan

[Haggar]

Exactly.

The 70u and 80 set actual clearances for pinion (no "crush sleeve" bs).  pinion nut torque just needs to be high to prevent loosening.  or lock tite hint hint.

 

during set up you just shim to get zero axial movement on the pinion to get backlash and pattern right.  When those are correct, you remove the proper amount of shim and tighten till you can tighten no more.  or tighten reasonably with red locktite.  (yes use the first set of bearings to make sure the bearing cups are seated fully....  sucks to get that far then it all moves just a bit)

 

Other than case spreading, the 80 is the easiest I set up except for an early dana 60 that had the adjustable carrier bearing holders....  (it was in a 70's plymouth)  you just turned these parts and it moved the carrier left and right.  after pattern was set, you turned each a  (half turn?) tight to get preload....it was awesome.  If you had the pinion depth tools, you could set that rear end up in one pass.  no putting together, checking, disassembling, moving shims, putting together, rinse repeat ad nauseum.   

Hag

 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

I wish I could watch one of you doing all this then understand better. Yup never done any gear work ever.

[Dieselfuture]

I've always used air gun if need more torque then I use 3/4 one, with crush sleeves and without like Dana 80, never had an issue as long as you're paying attention and kinda know what you doing. 

[Evan]

I got stuck under a 6ft bar as i tried to loosen a pinion nut. With my shear body power.

The truck lifted nut did not loosen then bar set back down on my chest. Then i nearly freaked out being pinned down.

 

I dont think ill ever invest in pinion depth tools though the depth is marked on all pinion gears.

 

I dont mind running some patterns. Ive been meaing to fab a pinion yoke that doesnt press on the splines. Is just there to get pinion snug with no play for set up.

 

Set up bearings everywhere there are shims under the bearing is a must.

 

Did we take this topic off topic.

 

Doing gears has opened up a hole knew world were now everything is possible.

 

I do realize there will probly be more failures learning from them is key.

 

The axle i smoke uses a crush sleeve. I used the old sleeve for the 500 attempts at propper pinion depth then on final assembly crushed the new sleeve at the correct rotating pinion pre load.

 

Rotating pre load is read with a beam tourque wrench. Im sure there are other ways. The beam is easy simple and cheap.

 

Damn you guys got me all excited to do another set of gwars.

[Mopar1973Man]

I'd love to learn for sure. Only thing I've done is lube changes. Never had an axle fail yet in all my years. Love reading all this just wish I could see how it was done. All the stuff about backlash and heel toe settings I'm not sure on.

[Dieselfuture]

@Concreter you may have a wrong seal. 

My truck takes this one 

https://www.danaaftermarket.com/spicer-automotive/automotive-axle/seals/part/differential-pinion-seal/50563?cat1=312&cat2=386&cp=0&catalog=PIMS_NA&partType=PART

 

Spicer 50563

[Evan]

Theres lots of videos of very good techs setting up gears on youtube. Ive watched hours and hours read specs watched more vids did more reading bought tools figuredvout what tools i could do without.

Then go out in the garage and truly fubar **** up then go watch more videos do more reading , ohhh ok maybe i better buy that tool. I think i get it now. I never truly get it its a constant learning process that never ends.

 

Thats the great thing about the internet if ones willing to learn a person can teach themselvs how to do anything

[Mopar1973Man]

That's why I was asking about learning here. I really trust you guys for info but randomly watching YouTube can be risky like watching a YouTube about tightening a 5th gear nut with chisel and hammer. I know that information is incorrect and will not work at all. That way all you can confirm info and then we all learn together with correct info. Once the forum thread is gathered up info the create an article for everyone.

Edited September 18, 2021 by Mopar1973Man

[Evan]

I beleive you to have common sense,  youl be just fine

[Evan]

I did watch about 40 minutes of this new vid that popped up in my feed.

 

Guy does a very good job of explaining what hes doing and why. And the wrench to remove carrier.  Why didnt i think if that.

 

 

Not a how to but a interesting vid on a dana living the sled pull life.

 

The offroad world i feel is driving axle advancement big rear ends are being turned it to frontvends and 47vspline 🤪

Ok back on topick

 

Wait ill take all dana 80s and versions of 70s.

 

 

Edited September 20, 2021 by Evan

[Silverwolf2691]

Most of the rock bouncers are running the 47 spline stuff. 1000-1200+hp LS motors doing 20-30mph up a rocky 45-70° slope. I'm not sure how they can even see anything doing what they do...

 

I've looked into the 47 spline stuff for my truck for the sled pulls. Ready to install rear axle, brake disk to brake disk, is 10k for a dana 80 from crane axle... But its either open axle or spool for 47 spline. Go down to 40 spline and there's a spool, open ,or an ARB air locker.

 

Front axles are 12k if memory serves. But, no more ball joints. Kingpin type bearings both top and bottom and you can fit Rockwell size RCV axles in them..

 

In case anyone is curious.  https://craneaxle.com/default/products/axle-assemblies.html

 

In the pulling world, the 2.6 class is actually trying to go open driveline so that they can upgrade to f106 and SQHD rear ends or similar because they are making so much power that anything factory based just cant hold up. 1200hp out of a single 66mm turbo is a lot. That's around what Lucas Pro Pulling League trucks are making.