Trans problems

[wil440]

been having problems recently with the trans in my truck (47re) sort of hanging in 2nd  first time was maybe a month ago after a rather fast pull off from a standstill but after it wouldn't change up from 2 to 3  I backed off a little and it changed up, was ok for days then happened again sometimes after accelerating.

This morning I accelerated at traffic lights to beat a real slow car oncoming, did over 5 miles in 2nd and no matter what I did it would not change to 3rd

Got to my workshop and checked the trans oil, brown but not burnt, time to change it but it's not done 20k

Had to use my truck today towing my mobile workshop, set off from my workshop to the site and after a mile or so it's ok, had a few hiccups in nearly 150miles but only after having to accelerate if I was steady on the throttle no problem, couldn't help it a few times to get the truck/trailer and 4 huge Cat batteries in the bed moving

Like I said trans fluid doesn't stink but it's brown, never overheated and does not slip at all, trans supposedly rebuilt just before I bought it so done somewhere between 40 to 50k mostly towing, no codes on my 2023 software S/On Triton

I've read the 2 page old post on how a 47re changes gear and pretty much decided to get the pan off, check the filter, check the 1 to 2 and 2 to 3 valves in the VB, and  adjust the bands, I fitted the 2 solenoids which are wired together (can't remember what they were for) about 18months ago seem to remember I still had one in the kit I bought still to fit IIRC

 

Am I missing anything ?????   

 

Unfortunatly it's just what I was dreading as a trans repair here in the UK is not recommended, don't think it;s electrical as no codes  

 

It has only got to last a few months as I've bought a AM General M50 6x6

[Great work!]

I'm assuming OD works once it upshifts. That's a good sign electrically. 

 

Check the control cable and return spring maybe sticking.

 

Next time it happens shift to neutral for a couple seconds and then back to drive. That usually makes it shift. If so that's probably sticky valve spools in the valve body.

[wil440]

Sorry been really busy

 

yes OD and lockup works fine

 

It has been fine for maybe 200miles but I've been careful, got 300 miles to do tomorrow and had to order the trans fluid which won't be here until wednesday at £124 for 20 litres

 

I'll try the neutral and see what happens

[Great work!]

Even here in the states that ATF is expensive. 

[wil440]

It was £50 here before covid and Putin 

[Mopar1973Man]

On 9/2/2023 at 7:57 PM, Great work! said:

Next time it happens shift to neutral for a couple seconds and then back to drive. That usually makes it shift. If so that's probably sticky valve spools in the valve body.

 

This is a problem in the 4th Gens. I've seen that the PRND selector valve will get wear from the deflection of pressure on the valve body and there is an updated RevMax valve body for the 4th Gens. As for the 47RE I would say you are on the right track. The information I learned from Dynamic from his time here you cal use compressed air to simulate the ATF and verify the valving is actually working correctly. 

[Great work!]

Some kits have an improved PRND valve with a hole drilled through it lengthwise.  The original shuts off converter cooling flow in park.

 

The valve body has to be disassembled and physically brushed and wiped clean. Soaking in solvent is not enough. The grit in there is tiny enough to make it through the filter.

[Mopar1973Man]

Totally agree. Transmission filters are not filtering as tight as a engine oil filter. Then most people assume that normal driving is fine but little do they know the trans temp light does come on till 295°F and by then the transmission took damage.

[wil440]

Dropped the pan 2 days ago, magnet covered in metal but nothing larger than paste. 

Used a Cometic pan gasket as I figured it was better than a cork one I had.... eeerrr wrong torqued to spec and it leaks right in the middle front where the bolt spacings are slightly wider

Doesn't matter as I need to drop it again and recheck the magnet.

Did the bands while I was in there..... what a pigs ear that is,put a hex on the one you CAN get to and a dumb square on the one you can't... well done

 

I've bought a AM General M50A2 so pretty sure the ram is going so once the AM is sorted out for mobile workshop I'll be figuring out the trans, I'm just sick of wondering when the trans is going to pop and the VP too

 

Great motor let down by utter rubbish

[Mopar1973Man]

2 hours ago, wil440 said:

Great motor let down by utter rubbish

Transmission wise usually weak because of poor final ratio that puts huge stress on bands and clutches.

 

VP44 I've never been plagued by VP44 issues as long as you do not pump out of the sender basket where all the hot fuel returns too. Then the W-T ground wire mod to deal with AC noise issues. Add a 128:1 ratio of 2 cycle oil to boost lubricity of the fuel which the Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel created the problem back in 2006. Then run quality 3um filter if you can to keep dirt out of the pump.

[wil440]

8 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Transmission wise usually weak because of poor final ratio that puts huge stress on bands and clutches.

 

VP44 I've never been plagued by VP44 issues as long as you do not pump out of the sender basket where all the hot fuel returns too. Then the W-T ground wire mod to deal with AC noise issues. Add a 128:1 ratio of 2 cycle oil to boost lubricity of the fuel which the Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel created the problem back in 2006. Then run quality 3um filter if you can to keep dirt out of the pump.

47RE is weak full stop but yes I do have 305 tyres BUT I only use OD downhill cruising, this puts my rpm at 60 at 2200  or so, more to do with the quad than tyres

My fuel NEVER gets hot highest is right at IAT and it still goes back to the basket even though i've got everything to change that just never saw the need, my FP is 6psi at idle and 21 psi at 2200 plus where it stays pegged at 21psi, my return is quite an amount and I'm sure it is enough to churn and mix the hot return fuel with the tank fuel so doesn't matter where it returns to.

I've done all the wt mods,  I live in the UK so fuel  is not a problem, it's always clean and is different to USA fuel, noticed recently a few things that lets say are different with how the engine starts sometimes.

It's just coming up to 196k and to be fair has done some mileage this past year or so all towing but the fuel bill is rediculous, I have an unlimited supply of hydraulic oil and other clean oils some new some used so it makes sense to buy the AM and yes that is running on hydraulic oil,  no road tax, no mot, dog cheap insurance and free fuel and there are quite a few here and europe and parts are easier to get here, I've been trying to get a 47re core for my truck and rebuild it..... utter waste of time here even looking, I could do with a right side fender.... over £600 to my door, long steering joint was nearly £300 the other month

[Tractorman]

So, is this what you bought to replace your 98.5 Dodge Cummins truck?  (Note that the photo is right side up)

 

- John

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Tractorman

[wil440]

Yes John but without the tank, going to drop my mobile workshop straight on the back and also build a demountable camper

Pic not dirty side up 

Oh and it's not firetruck red

[Tractorman]

So, what are the specs on the engine?  Bore, stroke, peak torque and peak torque rpm, peak horsepower and rpm, etc?  Does it come with a 5 spd manual transmission?  Is there an auxiliary gearbox or a two-speed axle?

 

I think you should at least put the Dodge Sport Headlights on it.

 

- John

 

 

[JAG1]

 

17 hours ago, wil440 said:

Yes John but without the tank, going to drop my mobile workshop straight on the back and also build a demountable camper

Pic not dirty side up 

Oh and it's not firetruck red

You have to post a pic when you get it done. That is a cool truck and I think it will be a great tool for your business. The mileage and tires are going to cost but, with an off loading camper that's going to save you a lot.

[wil440]

16 hours ago, Tractorman said:

So, what are the specs on the engine?  Bore, stroke, peak torque and peak torque rpm, peak horsepower and rpm, etc?  Does it come with a 5 spd manual transmission?  Is there an auxiliary gearbox or a two-speed axle?

 

I think you should at least put the Dodge Sport Headlights on it.

 

- John

 

 

It's 7.8 multifuel so petrol (GAS to you guys) mixed with oil or parrafin/kerosen/diesel/ engine oil/hydraulic oil/cooking oil, any flammable liquid really, apparently there is a viscosity adjustment on the injection pump, it's 5 speed manual with a granny 1st and seperate transfer box, 4 wheel drive on the rear with selectable front to become 6x6

Designed by REO and called the whistler just after the 2nd world war came into US army use in the early 50's and ran through to the 90's with various changes, was licensed to AM General and various other companies to be made bit like the Jeep.

It's not speedy by any means and 50mph it's pretty much all done but average vehicle speeds in the UK i'll bet is 30 to 35 anyway and Wales just this weekend has bought in a urban reduction from 30mph to 20mphthis will spread, also as it's 1959 it is Road Tax free and MOT free here and no special license requirement as historic vehicle.

Vehicle owners here are getting it from all sides with this climate rubbish even though we are a TINY island, petrol/Gas is £1.60 plus a LITRE, vehicle road tax rates are silly if the car is not emissions compliant, also cities are using ULEZ (Ultra Low Emission Zone ) to raise money by charging none compliant vehicles £12.50per day, London has just expanded it's ULEZ by a huge area,councils tried to fight it but didn't get anywhere,  more cities are jumping on this, the REO is exempt.

 

Yes there are some downfalls, isn't there always

1. No power steering, a kit is available and if I can't figure out how to do it well i'll hang my workboots up

2. Single circuit brakes, kits again are available with some parts from the later trucks,again i'll figure that out

3. Noise. the cab has no sound proofing of any kind, and the exhaust is straight through,  guess army guys were tougher then, thats the easiest bit to rectify

 

I always wanted a WW2 duece and a half, this is nearly the same but with a free to run (for me) engine instead of the straight 6 petrol in the WW2 and costs less, already got 1000litre of clean hydraulic oil and not even collected it yet

1 hour ago, JAG1 said:

 

You have to post a pic when you get it done. That is a cool truck and I think it will be a great tool for your business. The mileage and tires are going to cost but, with an off loading camper that's going to save you a lot.

See above,it should get 12 to 13mpg imperial but can carry 2.5ton off road and 5 ton on road but the amount of oil I can get makes it free, forgot I purchased 200litres of brand new axle oil on thursday for £1 a litre, that will either go straight in or go into a machine and the old filtered and thrown in 

It will either be great or rubbish, we'll see but it's cheap enough.

I checked on tyres and I can buy part worn good military take offs slightly bigger to assist with gearing for less than I can buy 305 Toyo's for the ram

Farm where my workshop is has an old shooting trailer with a ex army radio box on it and I'm pretty sure it's off of a whistler looking at other pics and sizes, and I got that for free 

[JAG1]

Wow! Best of all kinds of thoughts on that Wil. I think your on the right track going with this. Had no idea things are changing that fast for climate over there.

 

In the states many drivers make their own speed limit these days with no state troopers to be seen anywhere. I sure wish I had one of those trucks to make everyone slow down over here. LOL!

 

On edit: One day they'll be out of electricity and you'll be the only one rolling in town

Edited September 17, 2023 by JAG1

[Evan]

Your oil is brown youve neglected your transmission.  Theres nothing wrong with 305 tires

 

Service the tranny to include band adjustment. Probly should put a new tc solenoid and tranducer in it while your in there. 

 

The auto transmission seems to be the most neglected machine in the world dont be like that lol.

 

Id cry if my red transmission fluid was brown heck im about to cry because yours is

[wil440]

That's just it. Trans hasn't been neglected 

Done maybe 40k since previous owner rebuilt it,  had 2 oil changes during the 40k

Never got hot ,  never slipped according to the quad 

It had one 5 minute serious pull where I took the wrong turn on a tiny road with my travel trailer (not my 5th wheel the previous heavy thing)  Trans oil got a bit high maybe 200 but came down straight after  was about 1/2 mile or so in 1st and 2nd pulling a steep grade out of a valley, there was one point at a sharp corner where both rear tyres were howling 

[wil440]

spose I ought to have done bands earlier 

 

NOW the steering is going heavy after braking so an accumulator to add to the list, it's always steered like a dog so not bothered