Anyone dyno with and without BHAF ?

[97turbo]

Anyone have any problems running the BHAF without an Outerwares ? I'm concerned about rain/snow. Mainly rain right now, we get some bad storms with high winds here.

[dripley]

I am currently running no outerwear with no apparent issues. I have never seen it wet.

[Mopar1973Man]

Head towards 8-9 years of BHAF usage without Outerwears. I had one for a short time but got tired of it really quick. The fact it rubbed holes in it in less than 3-4 months and was a PITA to keep pulling off and washing all the time. I still get 100K miles without a outwears on it.

[97turbo]

Head towards 8-9 years of BHAF usage without Outerwears. I had one for a short time but got tired of it really quick. The fact it rubbed holes in it in less than 3-4 months and was a PITA to keep pulling off and washing all the time. I still get 100K miles without a outwears on it.

Cool, Thanks.

[AH64ID]

I did some towing at around 18K GCW a few days ago. Temps were as high as 101°, grades up to 9%, and elevation up to just over 7K feet, and a lot of it at 10-30 mph in 97-99° weather. The IAT's were VERY HOT, 115-125° pre-turbo. That's with a sealed box pulling fresh air from the fender and under the wheel well. I could not imagine how hot those temps would have been pulling air from the engine bay, especially without manifold blankets. Someone with a BHAF should put a little thermometer on the outside of the filter, I bet you would be shocked when you are working the truck. There are 2 things to consider, air filtering ability (why K&N sucks) and air source (why I think BHAF sucks).

[Mopar1973Man]

I'll have to agree to disagree with the BHAF...

[97turbo]

I'll have to agree to disagree with the BHAF...

BHAF is good !

[AH64ID]

I'll have to agree to disagree with the BHAF...

You got rid of the rest of your post... But like we have discussed the IAT readings do not appear to be very accurate on the VP trucks based on the IAT location. If you were to read them like a 3rd gen you would see the big difference, the air temp and base airflow are just too similar. But without extra sensors you will never know, just realize how hot that engine bay and inlet air are, and the effects that has on compressor efficiency.

[Mopar1973Man]

You got rid of the rest of your post...

Err... Umm.. Open mouth insert foot. I know I crunched numbers with ISX on this before but for the life of me couldn't remember all the number differences. From what he math'ed out one night on the phone was a very small difference he calculated down to the last mole (atom). So what out having the facts... I dumped the post. But as for the IAT sensor and temp change from stock air box to BHAF there is none that I've found. The only thing I found between BHAF & Stock box is the filter don't seal good and leak dust bad. Stock Air Filter are too small and restrictive. Even playing with the turbo temp calculator there is such a small rise in manifold temp from a rise in intake temp. From 80-130*F intake to may 5-10*F manifold roughly speaking. Once again without all the fact of measurements but plugging numbers and playing. http://www.stealth316.com/2-turbotemp.htm

[AH64ID]

The air at the front of my engine bay just outside the air box was upwards of 150° with manifold blankets, it's going to be a lot hotter than that at the location where the BHAF is on a 2nd gen without manifold blankets and a 1200° exhaust manifold, 200° is not going to be a stretch when towing up a grade. Make the grade steep on a hot day and at 35mph and I bet that number could come close to doubling. Consider the following. 4000 feet30 psi of boostAmbient temp of 80°Sealed Airbox turbo inlet temp 100°BHAF turbo inlet temp 200° (I would guess that is on the low side for a tow up a grade)70% compressor efficiencySealed compressor outlet temp 428°, plenum 150° BHAF compressor outlet temp 586°, plenum 181°As you noted the plenum temp is not all that different. That will be around 50° more EGT's for the BHAF than the sealed box. The biggest thing is compressor efficiency, more compressor rpms than is necessary.The other thing to consider is the intercooler is in front of the radiator, so now that you are pumping 158° hotter air into the IC, the heat rejection is warming the air to the radiator an additional 127° over the sealed box. That means either higher coolant temps, or more heat rejection to the engine bay, which increases the turbo inlet temp even more... and the cylce continues. There is a lot more to turbo inlet temps than just plenum temp.For people that run empty most the time then the BHAF may not have that much of a difference, but if you tow heavy I just don't see it paying off. At the very least get a exhaust manifold/turbine blanket.

[ISX]

Yeah I've done just that.. Zip tied the thermocouple right to the BHAF.. The most I EVER saw was 25F over ambient on a 95F day pulling our trailer up this steep long hill passing everyone. Most of the time it was 10-15F over. Without the trailer its more like 5-10F tops. When it is cold outside (<32F) it is 0-5F. I've watched it for months..

[AH64ID]

Yeah I've done just that.. Zip tied the thermocouple right to the BHAF.. The most I EVER saw was 25F over ambient on a 95F day pulling our trailer up this steep long hill passing everyone. Most of the time it was 10-15F over. Without the trailer its more like 5-10F tops. When it is cold outside (<32F) it is 0-5F. I've watched it for months..

Those numbers don't even come close to what I have seen doing the same thing (well to the outside of my OEM box). I don't recall the exact numbers, but I was seeing numbers closer to +100° on the outside of the airbox vs the inside.

[ISX]

It goes up a lot when I stop... You have no airflow under your hood. I think I've seen 160F under there when I let it idle for 5 minutes. I have no fan so yeah it just started to get hot. But with no fan or shroud or batteries I have nothing but airflow under there. Your conclusions prove it cause I know you have a tonnn of stuff under the hood.

[AH64ID]

I forgot how you were setup without a fan and shroud, I bet that makes a big difference. I can get nearly 150° inside the box on a hot day (95°+) sitting at a stop light with a heat soaked engine bay from towing.

[97turbo]

How can ya run without a fan ?

[AH64ID]

How can ya run without a fan ?

I am surprised how well the cooling system works with very little fan operation. Even at +100 rwhp over stock and towing at 18K GCW it takes a HOT HOT day to get much action out of my fan, and most of that is based on IAT's (one of the ECM's logics) and A/C and not coolant temp. I rarely hear my fan on a grade, even with ECT's of 215°.

[97turbo]

I am surprised how well the cooling system works with very little fan operation. Even at +100 rwhp over stock and towing at 18K GCW it takes a HOT HOT day to get much action out of my fan, and most of that is based on IAT's (one of the ECM's logics) and A/C and not coolant temp. I rarely hear my fan on a grade, even with ECT's of 215°.

Very interesting.

[ISX]

I forgot how you were setup without a fan and shroud, I bet that makes a big difference. I can get nearly 150° inside the box on a hot day (95°+) sitting at a stop light with a heat soaked engine bay from towing.

I actually think I had a drop in EGT from ditching the shroud. Since the shroud blocks off everything but the fan, I think you lose a lot of potential airflow. I have heard the shroud is needed to make the fan work effectively but if the fan isn't on I think it works against you. And yeah I have never needed the fan except for <10mph operation which I have just been turning the heater on full blast with the windows down and that keeps it under 210. The A/C also gets hot at stoplights. In the future I would like to get just 1 little low profile electric fan and throw it in the middle of the radiator that blows towards the grill and I think it would solve all the low speed issues. It really seems to only take 10-15mph to get it back to cooling effectively. Radiators are just huge on these things.

[AH64ID]

As good as it works for you without it, and how little I hear mine kick on 100%, I am not sure I would run without one. I have a feeling that it operates at less than 100% more than I think, and I just cannot hear it. I have plenty of roads that are steep and slow, and things just get hot under the hood and the fan has to help even if it's not at 100%.

[ISX]

It's kind of an insurance thing. I was pulling our trailer around a dirt road dirt bike thing with lots of hills at 5-10mph and the heater wasn't doing it's job being 100F outside already and I saw 215F. So there are circumstances which call for it and thats where the piece of mind of having it comes in. Plus having the heater on isn't exactly fun That's why I think just a little pusher fan would take care of it all for the 1% of the time that you need it. I've also thought about just having a little misting system spray it since I love doing things different Would also be good to use with water injection. My EGT gauge actually has relays in it that I can set to whatever temp I want for it to energize and deenergize so it has water injection written all over it. If you have a TT over 5000lbs or over 10,000lbs of dead weight (no billboard effect) then I would say a fan is mandatory since we all have seen the temps climb pulling loads like that on interstates up longgg steep hills and I would hate to be at the misfortune of not having a fan to take care of it. Our trailer is maybe 4000lbs and even doing 70 up 7% 2 mile long grades on a 100F day I only get to 205ish with the trailer and no fan or heater on, I think the a/c was on as well.