I swapped a 02 Cummins into my F250. Mods are, fummins twin turbo kit, 125 DDP injectors, new springs, and arp studs. Also new VP 44 SO pump. Tunning is by quadzilla, but no custom tunes yet. The motor came out of a manual transmission truck, so I sent the ECM off to be reprogrammed for an automatic because of a massive lope.  When I got it back, the lope was cured and it idle ok. When I drive the truck, it will only get to 1850 RPM and no farther. Acts like it has a governor on it. I purchased an automatic apps sensor and did the relearn on it and no help. Any suggestions???

Edited September 3, 20177 yr by mossyoak71
Wording

  On 9/15/2017 at 2:37 PM, Me78569 said:

we need to get this into an article so it is not lost.  

 

Can you do me a favor and post, in one post, all the issues you had with specifiics and the resolution to the issue?  Think of it as a searchable issue and resolution.  

 Second that!

 

I swapped a 02 Cummins that was a manual into a f250 (08) automatic. As I was making the wire harness up, I noticed that the harness I had did not have the vss wire. It had a engine speed sensor.  When I got the truck running with the manual ECM it had a lope so bad that it would die as soon as you put it into gear. So I sent the ECM off to be reprogrammed for an automatic. When I received it back, I put it in and the lope issue was solved but the truck would not go over 1850 rpm's. So as stated before, there was no vss wire hooked to pin 43. So I pinned a wire and that did not help at all. So upon talking with other people, I decided to purchase a PCM and wire it in, because the ECM was not seeing the ground from pin 6  on the PCM, which tells it that it it not in park. So when I received it, I wired it up and now she runs like a dream. Thanks for all that helped and threw things at me to make me think harder!

24 Valve Neutral Safety Ground method.pdfUnavailable

24V PCM Schematic.pdf

Edited September 15, 20177 yr by mossyoak71
Clarify and add schematics

  On 9/15/2017 at 11:35 PM, mossyoak71 said:

because the ECM was not seeing the ground from pin 6 which tells it that it it not in park. So when I received it, I wired it up and now she runs like a dream.

 

Can you clarify,  Pin 6 of the ecm or pcm?  

  On 9/15/2017 at 11:37 PM, Me78569 said:

 

Can you clarify,  Pin 6 of the ecm or pcm?  

I edited my post and also put the schematics I used to wire it up in there too.

Sweet thanks a ton

Thanks for all the help

Ok so now I need some help with the tuning. It's an 02 Cummins with the following mods: DDP 125hp injectors,  ARP 425's,  billet oil squirters, SO VP44 pump with BD wire tap, 120# valve springs, DPS 62/65/12 Turbo with a Borg Warner S475 Turbo, FASS 150 titanium, mishimoto intercooler, straight 4" exhaust back to 2- 6.5" stacks. So I am not very familiar with the Cummins tuning, as I have always had Ford. The latest being a 6.oh no. But the Cummins resides in it's spot now. It is mated to a stage 5 automatic 5r110. Would like some help with a daily driver with good manners ( I live in Charleston SC, so stop go traffic). Also need a good Dyno tune for when I go to Rudys Fall Jam. Still learning. 

  On 9/21/2017 at 1:04 AM, mossyoak71 said:

Ok so now I need some help with the tuning.

 

Best bet is to look towards the Quadzilla Adrenaline. It will allow for your large injectors and be able to tune it to be smoke-free for the most part. Allow for custom timing curves for all your needs from daily driving, towing of all-out dyno runs. 

 

https://mopar1973man.com/forum/174-quadzilla-power/

 

 

I helped him load up v2 this afternoon. 

 

@mossyoak71 I hate to say it but DDP injectors are a really bad injector to start with.  @jlbayes can tell you what spec the nozzles are, but they are not right for truck application and they make tuning out smoke VERY tough.  

 

As a starting point I would try out my tunes.  They likely won't pull enough fuel to clean up the injectors, but it is a start.    Since you have good supporting mods you can run a fair bit of timing after 2k.  sub 2k our trucks seem to like less than 20* total when on the throttle.  Off the throttle some members such as @Mopar1973Man and @trreed say their trucks like 21-23* of timing at cruise state.  

all we really know is that each truck is a little different.   

What I have found for power is if you can tune your truck to just enough to go beyond haze into smoke then you will put down peak power.    I am not talking thick smoke, but just beyond haze.    I wouldn't say my truck is any more powerful with a starting % of 105 compared to ~94.  Torque comes on harder at 105, but that is not a good indicator of power.  the old butt dyno hasn't been calibrated recently so it is not trustworthy.  

If your butt dyno is calibrated I would find that odd.  

  On 9/21/2017 at 2:12 AM, Me78569 said:

and @trreed say their trucks like 21-23* of timing at cruise state.  

I'm running as high as 25* while cruising now.  Hopefully can fine tune with the mpg meter and see where it's happiest

  On 9/21/2017 at 4:11 AM, trreed said:

I'm running as high as 25* while cruising now.  Hopefully can fine tune with the mpg meter and see where it's happiest

 

What does your truck sound like at 25°? Must be rattling pretty good?

@TFaoro had a setup similar to you and should be able to help with a tune. It likely won't matter what you do with those rv/marine nozzles to tune out smoke. Wide cone.

  On 9/21/2017 at 12:13 PM, kzimmer said:

 

What does your truck sound like at 25°? Must be rattling pretty good?

You can definitely hear the jump, but it's not super loud. 

ok, i know i should start a thread in the quad part, but don't want to bore anyone out there. I'm used to the ford 6.0 tuning and the vgt turbo. so that is all computer controlled. So now i have to put my less than smart hat (stupid for lack of better words) on. The following is what i have been playing around with. It is fairly clean running just takes a little bit to get the turbos to light. So my question is how do you get these turbos to light? I'm assuming that the more fuel you add the more they spool or is there some other way. sorry for the stupid question. I have seen 57lbs of boost so far. Thanks for the help.

Power Levels: 6

 

Timing

Fuel Load Timing: 1.5

Low PSI Timing Reduct: 2.5

Timing Reduct Scaling: 100

Light Throttle Timing Adv: 3

Light Throttle Timing Load Limit: 15

 

Timing vs rpm

1500:18

2000: 20

2500: 22

3000: 24

Timing Max: 26
 

Wiretap

Pump Stretch: 1800

TPS Pump max: 100

TPS Pump Min  20

Minimum Pump Tap Fueling Percentage: 5

Pump Low Boost Scale PSI: 10

 

Boost Scaling: 35

 

RPM Limit: 3500

 

Power Reduction:

 

0 PSI %: 77

1 PSI %: 78

2 PSI %: 79

3 PSI %: 80

4 PSI %: 81

5 PSI %: 82

6 PSI %: 83

7 PSI %: 84

8 PSI %: 86

9 PSI %: 88

10 PSI %: 90

11 PSI %: 92

12 PSI %: 94

13 PSI %: 97

14 PSI %: 100

15 PSI %: 103

16 PSI %: 106

18 PSI %: 110

20 PSI %: 114

22 PSI %: 118

24 PSI %: 122

26 PSI %: 126

28 PSI %: 130

30 PSI %: 134

  On 9/22/2017 at 1:08 AM, mossyoak71 said:

Power Levels: 6

 

Timing

Fuel Load Timing: 1.5

Low PSI Timing Reduct: 2.5

Timing Reduct Scaling: 100

Light Throttle Timing Adv: 3

Light Throttle Timing Load Limit: 15 Change to %5 over your cruise state load %

 

Timing vs rpm

1500:18 Change to 17*

2000: 20 

2500: 22 change to 23

3000: 24 change to 27

Timing Max: 26 change to 29
 

Wiretap

Pump Stretch: 1800

TPS Pump max: 100

TPS Pump Min  20

Minimum Pump Tap Fueling Percentage: 5

Pump Low Boost Scale PSI: 10

 

Boost Scaling: 35 Change 40, this gives more resolution to the map.  Using naything other than 40 should only be done on stock turbo and injector trucks looking ot make a ton of torque.

 

RPM Limit: 3500

 

Power Reduction:

 

0 PSI %: 77

1 PSI %: 78

2 PSI %: 79

3 PSI %: 80

4 PSI %: 81

5 PSI %: 82

6 PSI %: 83

7 PSI %: 84

8 PSI %: 86

9 PSI %: 88

10 PSI %: 90

11 PSI %: 92

12 PSI %: 94

13 PSI %: 97

14 PSI %: 100

15 PSI %: 103

16 PSI %: 106

18 PSI %: 110

20 PSI %: 114

22 PSI %: 118

24 PSI %: 122

26 PSI %: 126

28 PSI %: 130

30 PSI %: 134

Your canbus tuning starting point is VERY low.  I start at %85 with my 7 x .009's at 7000' altitude.   This is an indicator of your injectors being badly suited.  I would expect you to be able to run smoke free at %90 starting point with 125 hp injectors. 

 

As for getting the turbo to light, more fuel.  again the cone angle of the injectors is going to cause smoke issues the more you bring up fuel.   

Thanks, I will try that. As far as the injectors go, I never read anything bad on them, only they smoke. But hey, I went through a costly learning curve with the 6.0

they market well, but there are other builders out there that do better injectors for a fraction of the cost. 

 

DAP, DFI are both builders that have cost effective injectors. 

 

Money no object then Weston or some other guy I can't think of right now. 

 

 

Haley Speed Inc.

Well I'm tired of trying to get these DDP injectors to clean up I'm just getting a lot of smoke so I looked at the DAP injectors and was wondering what I was wondering what the difference is in the sac and a vco injectors. Which one should I get was looking at the 125 or the 150s thanks

It is just the design of the nozzle. In the size you are looking at there is little to no difference. I hate this bloody link as it is nothing but propaganda but it shows the difference. Keep in mind there are literally millions (probably close to 10s of millions) of vco nozzles in service.

 

http://www.engineered-diesel.com/blog/sac-nozzle-vs-vco-nozzle/