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notlimah

Smarty/TST stack still relevant?

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So after just picking up a smarty, I got to wondering if I should just look into getting a TST and being done with it. 

 

I know quad is the go to tuner around here for its ability to tune out smoke and get any one setup to run great. But if someone doesn't want to test and tweak setting to get them just right, is the smarty stack still a good one?

 

Pros/cons?

Edited by notlimah

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What size injectors are you going to end up with?  that's going to determine the answer you get.

 

without being a butt I would like to point out the size of the thread for the revo settings... it is nearly as big as the Quadzilla thread lol.   Doesn't seem like guys running the s03 are really saving any time in the test and tune area.

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31 minutes ago, notlimah said:

So after just picking up a smarty, I got to wondering if I should just look into getting a TST and being done with it. 

 

I know quad is the go to tuner around here for its ability to tune out smoke and get any one setup to run great. But if someone doesn't want to test and tweak setting to get them just right, is the smarty stack still a good one?

 

Pros/cons?

 

If you find a TST used for a good price, its a box that fuels hard but can overfuel with the smarty.

 

21 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

What size injectors are you going to end up with?  that's going to determine the answer you get.

 

without being a butt I would like to point out the size of the thread for the revo settings... it is nearly as big as the Quadzilla thread lol.   Doesn't seem like guys running the s03 are really saving any time in the test and tune area.

 

Thread size = zero reference of customer database....what is the point of the quad/smarty jab?  Point of thread is tuner stacking effectiveness not which tuner is currently the "hip" one to own....  

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4 minutes ago, NightHawk said:

Thread size = zero reference of customer database....what is the point of the quad/smarty jab?  Point of thread is tuner stacking effectiveness not which tuner is currently the "hip" one to own....  

Simply stating that I would not classify the Smarty s03 as set it and forget it from what I am seeing in your guys testing.  there is a lot of testing that goes into it as well.   thats it, not to say the smarty isnt up to the job.

The stack question needs more input in terms of goals.

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5 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

Simply stating that I would not classify the Smarty s03 as set it and forget it from what I am seeing in your guys testing.  there is a lot of testing that goes into it as well.   thats it, not to say the smarty isnt up to the job.

The stack question needs more input in terms of goals.

 

Oh i agree 100%, in fact in every tuned truck (ford/GM/dodge), the aftermarket tunes seem to always take several rounds to get in "just" right.   The quad is a great platform offering customers with endless options, the smarty with revo is an attempt on customization of canned programming which makes it hard to compare the platforms fairly.  I was just trying to highlight that we (tinkers on the form) should just respect what each platform offers, not which one someone should own. I am into education of what each can offer vs. trying to sway someone to head one way or another, because well ultimately its their $$ you know?

 

However  in an effort to not divert the topic, the canned platform when paired with another canned platform while works, it isn't the most user friendly way to go.  The stack creates a internal struggle for fueling control which can either work or hurt depending on how nicely everything fits together.  While its what people did in the "day", doesn't mean what has been learned since the "day" should be counted out....case in point quad custom tuning, UDC pro (for vp) etc.

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I'm not suggesting that it'd be a set and forget, but simply that there's less features to tune with that stack then there are on the quad, therefore making things 'easier' in that regard, but I fully understand tweaking is neccesary regardless of tuner.

 

I think my main reason for even entertaining it is because I already have a smarty which I like for the speedo fix, code reader and helping friends if needed. Would rather not have another screen up on the dash as a 'gauge' of sorts. Also from what I've read, the smarty/tst stack was the most powerful stack. 

 

As as far as injectors, I'm sort of thinking 7x.009's possibly?? But was planning on going through infinite performance and was going to sorta trust their judgment on what size would work. Overall power goals I'm not looking to have more then 450-500, even low 400 would be fine. 

 

Can this stack be tuned to low smoke?

Can it tow?

Is it a decent daily tune?

 

Didnt @TFaoro run this setup for a while?

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It wanted to surge when I had it. It has been a long time so my memory is a bit fuzzy. Using cruise was not fun.

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7 hours ago, notlimah said:

I'm not suggesting that it'd be a set and forget, but simply that there's less features to tune with that stack then there are on the quad, therefore making things 'easier' in that regard, but I fully understand tweaking is neccesary regardless of tuner.

 

I think my main reason for even entertaining it is because I already have a smarty which I like for the speedo fix, code reader and helping friends if needed. Would rather not have another screen up on the dash as a 'gauge' of sorts. Also from what I've read, the smarty/tst stack was the most powerful stack. 

 

As as far as injectors, I'm sort of thinking 7x.009's possibly?? But was planning on going through infinite performance and was going to sorta trust their judgment on what size would work. Overall power goals I'm not looking to have more then 450-500, even low 400 would be fine. 

 

Can this stack be tuned to low smoke?

Can it tow?

Is it a decent daily tune?

 

Didnt @TFaoro run this setup for a while?

I have lots of experience with the smarty and smarty / tst.

Smarty alone with 7x.009 was a great towing setup Plenty of power and stayed pretty cool egt wise with the stock turbo. My issue with it was the smoke. If you didn't drive like you had a cracked egg shell under your foot it was a smoke machine. Getting moving quickly while in traffic doesn't happen unless you want to black out 2 lanes.

Onto the stack - tons of power and smoke. I honestly left the TST off most of the time, but when I did flip it on it drove hard.

My TST Comp liked to surge, so I wouldn't  go that route. The PM3 was fine surge wise.

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At this point I am a much bigger fan of bigger injectors and less aggressive tuning.  If we can see what the revo settings are doing and you can manage with the smarty only and some bigger injectors.  

 

I don't feel like the smarty / tst really fight each other so in terms of the stack it is fine, but will it support your goals, I am not sure.  I would jump up 1 size of injector rather than do the tst.    Bigger injectors are just more meaty in the power band.

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I should list what I had at the time. Tst pm3, Smarty w/revo, 7x.010s, he351cw. No matter what I did with the smarty it would surge but cruise was the worst.

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The biggest thing people call me for is attempting to clean the smoke up at the same time wishing to get the most from there larger injectors. That's a tough call to do with a Smarty S-03. Ive worked with several people that are pretty firm about keeping the Smarty because of their larger tires and need speedo tweaking. Smarty typically works well with stockish injectors but more the person modifies the truck improperly the harder it is to clean up.

Edited by Mopar1973Man

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Fact is that the CANBus fuel value is from 0 to 4095. All the stack does is fool the TPS or APPS signal to 4095 sooner with less APPS signal. Like @Me78569 shown with data logs of just the Smarty alone it can reach full fuel signal below 50% APPS signal. I really doubt the stack will make any more power.

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To be fair the TST smarty stack does not stack canbus as the tst is a wiretap only box.     The smarty by itself can command max fuel at less than %30 tps input but that is the catcher settings by themselves lol.  

 

 

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Yea I understand the limitations of canbus tuners and it's pretty reasonable to say that no one tuner or stack will gain a TON more power then the other, possibly slightly more one way or another but nothing largely notable. 

 

I was just just looking for more info into seeing if it was even worth entertaining. 

 

I will definitely keep the smarty but  will probably look into some slightly larger injectors and a quad in the future, as was my plan all along lol.

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If you are sticking in the sub 425 hp area  i dont see any issues with the s03, above that I would consider another route.   

 

I would still recommend bigger injectors and no tst over a smaller injector truck with tst smarty stack. It's hard to explain, but a 400 hp truck with smaller injectors and an aggressive tuning setup is not nearly as nice to drive as a big injector truck with mild tuning.  

 

If that makes sense.

Edited by Me78569

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11 hours ago, Me78569 said:

If you are sticking in the sub 425 hp area  i dont see any issues with the s03, above that I would consider another route.   

 

I would still recommend bigger injectors and no tst over a smaller injector truck with tst smarty stack. It's hard to explain, but a 400 hp truck with smaller injectors and an aggressive tuning setup is not nearly as nice to drive as a big injector truck with mild tuning.  

 

If that makes sense.

 

Been trying to get y'all to understand this for YEARS lol.

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1 hour ago, jlbayes said:

 

Been trying to get y'all to understand this for YEARS lol.

Hey!! Be nice some of us slow. I know I am. 

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1 hour ago, jlbayes said:

 

Been trying to get y'all to understand this for YEARS lol.

there was nearly 0 proof puddling :) no data logs no videos nadda.  Just the word of a U.Per :shifty: 

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1 hour ago, jlbayes said:

 

Been trying to get y'all to understand this for YEARS lol.

Still trying to gain back my high MPG number like with my old stockish injectors and dirty Edge Comp. So far I'm still about 3 to 4 MPG lower with my current setup.

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:)  different pumps man.  I would highly suggest running around on the edge for a bit and see what happens.  The "baseline" mpg number you are going off of is really not comparable to what you have now.  

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