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Greenlee

Fuel Tank Module Check Valve

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I'm having fuel pressure issues on the 1999 24v. The pressure drops and you have to readjust the Raptor lift pump to correct it. When I bought this truck the VP44 went out in the first 2 weeks. I removed the electric lift pump from the tank but never removed the check valve that is on the suction line side about 3/4s of the way down the module. I watched a YouTube video explaining that when you eliminate the lift pump in the tank you need to make modifications. The check valve is part of it and should be removed. Has anyone else ran into this or has had fuel pressure dropping and it has to be adjusted back up again? Any opinions on a G&R sump for the bottom of the tank and leaving the fuel module alone? Would I have to change out a fitting on the return side of the Tee to fit a 1/2" hose like the AN-8 fitting on the G&R sump? I can't crawl under the truck and look but I want to be able to pass it on to who ever is helping me work on it. Thank you all for any advice. 

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Forget the sump. Not worth it. If It started leaking or you drilled it wrong you will have a very hard tim finding a new tank. That 3 inch hole just looks like trouble. I too was planning this way but was steered away to a Fass or airdog system which I’m glad I did. It worth having believe me.

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I had to rebuild my module to install my AD. it came with a retrofit kit to remove the in tank pump. Works fine. AD might sell it by itself. Vulcan performance sells a modified basket that appears to be the same as Dodge put it mine for the in tank pump. They may as well have something also.

 

 I am also not a fan of drilling holes in the bottom of the tank. 

As far the fuel pressure, it could be the pump going out. Seems to me others here have experienced that with theirs. I will let them speak to that issue.

Edited by dripley

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10 minutes ago, Marcus2000monster said:

Forget the sump. Not worth it. If It started leaking or you drilled it wrong you will have a very hard tim finding a new tank. That 3 inch hole just looks like trouble. I too was planning this way but was steered away to a Fass or airdog system which I’m glad I did. It worth having believe me.

I appreciate the advice. I'll stick to removing the check valve in the fuel module, didn't want to spend any more than I need to in order to sell it.

6 minutes ago, dripley said:

I had to rebuild my module to install my AD. it came with a retrofit kit to remove the in tank pump. Works fine. AD might sell it by itself. Vulcan performance sells a modified basket that appears to be the same as Dodge put it mine for the in tank pump. They may as well have something also.

 

 I am also not a fan of drilling holes in the bottom of the tank. 

Again thank you. I saw the module kit from AD for $98.00 with a 1/2" suction line. I wouldn't need to do anything to the check valve if I used this kit.

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10 minutes ago, Greenlee said:

 

Again thank you. I saw the module kit from AD for $98.00 with a 1/2" suction line. I wouldn't need to do anything to the check valve if I used this kit.

That is a bit different than the one I got 9 years ago butdoes the same thing. My pickup is only 3/8". But it works fine and will drain the tank.

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9 minutes ago, dripley said:

That is a bit different than the one I got 9 years ago butdoes the same thing. My pickup is only 3/8". But it works fine and will drain the tank.

I agree, 3/8 should be plenty for a stock or slightly modified truck. I hate not being able to work on my truck but at least I can get answers here on this Forum. My son is going to pull the bed on the truck so I can get to the module and sit on a bucket. All I need is a welding whip in my hand to be at home.

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I'll do a sump again when I can control road debris on the roads.  

 

Couple bulk head fittings drilled into top of module and push on fittings for me.  PVC pipe from ace hardware to suck from and airtight line so air doesn't get inside fuel line or fuel out.   And some holes drilled around lower part  of module.  Harbor freight step drill, 2, 6 and 10 o'clock position.  (I dont know about valve you post about.  I'm airdog df 100 and carter pump as backup, under back seat. JIC fittings at pump, with shut off valves so easy change out if ever needed) 

Lots of ways to do it and several pics on here, somewhere.  

Good luck.

 

Edited by 015point9
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On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 5:48 PM, dripley said:

I had to rebuild my module to install my AD. it came with a retrofit kit to remove the in tank pump. Works fine. AD might sell it by itself. Vulcan performance sells a modified basket that appears to be the same as Dodge put it mine for the in tank pump. They may as well have something also. 

 

 

Hey Dripley, I'm looking at the AirDog fuel module kit that uses a 1/2" pickup tube to a 90* fitting on top of the module cap that is push lock to 1/2" line. I think on the Raptor 150 that attaches to the engine near the fuel filter has a push lock that mates with the factory fuel line coming from the tank. I haven't been able to get under the truck to look. To make this new 1/2" fuel line work would I only have to change out the fitting on the Raptor 150 to a new push lock that is 1/2"??? Your module didn't have a pick up tube modification in the package? Where is the best diesel parts store to get both the module upgrade kit and fittings? I haven't found a store that sells them both.

Thanks for the helpl

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2 minutes ago, Greenlee said:

Hey Dripley, I'm looking at the AirDog fuel module kit that uses a 1/2" pickup tube to a 90* fitting on top of the module cap that is push lock to 1/2" line. I think on the Raptor 150 that attaches to the engine near the fuel filter has a push lock that mates with the factory fuel line coming from the tank. I haven't been able to get under the truck to look. To make this new 1/2" fuel line work would I only have to change out the fitting on the Raptor 150 to a new push lock that is 1/2"??? Your module didn't have a pick up tube modification in the package? Where is the best diesel parts store to get both the module upgrade kit and fittings? I haven't found a store that sells them both.

Thanks for the helpl

I have never mssed with the raptor pumps before and did not know the 150's would mount where the oe pump went. I would recomend talking to Eric at Vulcan Performance. He sells AD pumps and should have any fuel fittings that you would need. I am thinking he could get the AD kit or set you up something that is just as good. Eric is a top notch vendor here.

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He's got a DDRP pump. Those really can't be relocated because of the port in the pump are too small for normal 1/2" Parker push lock fittings. There is actually 2 series of pumps... Raptor as a remote mount and the Raptor DDRP (Dodge Direct Replacement Pump) which goes in the stock location. Ports are different.

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9 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

He's got a DDRP pump. Those really can't be relocated because of the port in the pump are too small for normal 1/2" Parker push lock fittings. There is actually 2 series of pumps... Raptor as a remote mount and the Raptor DDRP (Dodge Direct Replacement Pump) which goes in the stock location. Ports are different.

Thats what I was thinking but I always thought the raptor 150's were remote mount. I did not think DDRP came in a 150gph pump???

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25 minutes ago, Greenlee said:

Hey Dripley, I haven't been able to get under the truck to look.

I mentioned this in the prior question. I got a flash light and could see the factory fuel hook up to the Raptor. It's 1/2" to the fuel filter. Let me ask you this, if I remove the check valve in the section side of the fuel module don't you think that it would be fine for suppling fuel to the lift pump? No need to add a new 1/2" pick up tube for fuel supply if the factory pick up tube is minus the check valve. I don't mind spending the $99 for the module and then the costs of 1/2" push lock fittings and a length of fuel line. But for a basically stock truck is it needed? I should have got a flashlight to begin with, sorry to bother you with so many questions.

 

17 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

He's got a DDRP pump. Those really can't be relocated because of the port in the pump are too small for normal 1/2" Parker push lock fittings. There is actually 2 series of pumps... Raptor as a remote mount and the Raptor DDRP (Dodge Direct Replacement Pump) which goes in the stock location. Ports are different.

That's what this Raptor is, a DDRP. Didn't know the terminology. So with that said removing the check valve should be good enough?

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10 minutes ago, Greenlee said:

I mentioned this in the prior question. I got a flash light and could see the factory fuel hook up to the Raptor. It's 1/2" to the fuel filter. Let me ask you this, if I remove the check valve in the section side of the fuel module don't you think that it would be fine for suppling fuel to the lift pump? No need to add a new 1/2" pick up tube for fuel supply if the factory pick up tube is minus the check valve. I don't mind spending the $99 for the module and then the costs of 1/2" push lock fittings and a length of fuel line. But for a basically stock truck is it needed? I should have got a flashlight to begin with, sorry to bother you with so many questions.

 

Where is your pump mounted? On the block, stock location?

Edited by dripley

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1 hour ago, Greenlee said:

I think on the Raptor 150 that attaches to the engine near the fuel filter has a push lock that mates with the factory fuel line coming from the tank. I haven't been able to get under the truck to look.

 

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40 minutes ago, Greenlee said:

So with that said removing the check valve should be good enough?

 

Perosnally, I would get out of the stock sender. Install a draw straw of some sort. The stock in-tank pump is restrictive from the get-go. All the factory plumbing is too small measuring out at 6mm ID (.24 inch ID). Then pumps are not design to lift or suck fuel long distances. You'll need to get the other pump to relocate it on the frame back towards the tank. Then the DDRP pump directly plugs into the ECM so if anything electrically happens to the Raptor the ECM is going to fry. I've not had much to say positive about your setup I'm sorry...

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Okay..... my set up is exactly the may Moparman says to do it, but I want Greenlee to know that I had continual F/P problems even though set up the right way.

 

The other day MoparMan asked me to turn the regulator almost all the way down and then slowly all the way up to about 25 and see if that helped the fuel pressure swings. It did stop the problem and it's now a  steady 19 at idle. Wholey cow after a year of fighting it it was just the regulator all along.

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On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 6:33 PM, 015point9 said:

I'll do a sump again when I can control road debris on the roads.  

 

Couple bulk head fittings drilled into top of module and push on fittings for me.  PVC pipe from ace hardware to suck from and airtight line so air doesn't get inside fuel line or fuel out.   And some holes drilled around lower part  of module.  Harbor freight step drill, 2, 6 and 10 o'clock position.  (I dont know about valve you post about.  I'm airdog df 100 and carter pump as backup, under back seat. JIC fittings at pump, with shut off valves so easy change out if ever needed) 

Lots of ways to do it and several pics on here, somewhere.  

Good luck.

 

I missed your post and appreciate your input. There are a lot of ways to solve this. There is a small piece of plastic tubing that connects the return line to the pickup or suction line. One piece looks like a small top with a flip off cap. This is where the check valve is located, a black washer held down by a spring. Thoroughbred Diesel has a video on YouTube on modifying the fuel module both for Pureflow (AirDog) and FASS. This is where I saw the check valve and how to remove it. Apparently it can interfere with the flow of fuel and pressure, it's all second hand information I'm passing on. I had a Raptor 100 that fits on the engine and just before the warranty went out it went out. They replaced it with a Raptor 150 a few months ago but once again the fuel pressure dropped and had to be adjusted back up to 20psi. Before it was put on the banjo joint at the rear of the block for return fuel was replaced and the tee which was split on one of the threads under the cap. All new parts and no leaks at all. In the past 10 days or so we got a PO216 code but I added 2 stroke oil and ran it pretty hard and that code has not come back. When my son gets this bed off I'm going to take a few pictures of the check valve to put in this thread. Thanks for the great ideas.  

2 hours ago, dripley said:

Where is your pump mounted? On the block, srock location?

Yes sir on the block where the original factory lift pump was located before putting it in the tank.

2 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Perosnally, I would get out of the stock sender. Install a draw straw of some sort. The stock in-tank pump is restrictive from the get-go. All the factory plumbing is too small measuring out at 6mm ID (.24 inch ID). Then pumps are not design to lift or suck fuel long distances. You'll need to get the other pump to relocate it on the frame back towards the tank. Then the DDRP pump directly plugs into the ECM so if anything electrically happens to the Raptor the ECM is going to fry. I've not had much to say positive about your setup I'm sorry...

I've got that blank stare now. I removed the old electric lift pump when I put the first Raptor 100 DDRP and Blue Chip Special X VP44 3 years ago. I agree the lines used on the fuel module are too small. The AirDog Fuel Module Repair Kit adds a new draw straw but like you said it won't support a 1/2" fitting. I don't know if the Raptor 150 DDRP supports one either, I can tell you that the stock fuel line is used. I don't understand what you are saying about EMC frying. Wouldn't you have to extend the 12v line from the block to the frame? Is there another way to wire it in? I honestly don't know if I can physically fab a bracket for the frame. I'm trying to find a solution so I can sell this truck without screwing someone else over like I was. It has a lot of money in it and a pile of new parts. It runs strong when all is good. Give me some options and I'll try to make the right decision on how to fix this issue. I guess with the draw straw you are saying it's the best way to go. I have a brand new Raptor 150 that mounts to the frame but I don't have the brackets, wiring, fittings, or hose to hook it up. I can call Eric as suggested by dripley and he might have everything I need to relocate the lift pump

On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 6:07 PM, dripley said:

That is a bit different than the one I got 9 years ago butdoes the same thing. My pickup is only 3/8". But it works fine and will drain the tank.

I bet it will drain the tank and it's still better than the factory design.

 

My PC just locked up and I lost a lot I had commented on. More reply's than I thought. I'm trying to read them all. 

3 hours ago, dripley said:

Thats what I was thinking but I always thought the raptor 150's were remote mount. I did not think DDRP came in a 150gph pump???

I was looking on AirDog Web Page and my screen froze up it shows the Raptor in a 150 configuration for the 1998.5 to 2003 years. I'm not positive so I'll go look again. I could have sworn it was a 150 DDRP. The part numbers don't seem to explain what it is.

3 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Perosnally, I would get out of the stock sender. Install a draw straw of some sort. The stock in-tank pump is restrictive from the get-go. All the factory plumbing is too small measuring out at 6mm ID (.24 inch ID). Then pumps are not design to lift or suck fuel long distances. You'll need to get the other pump to relocate it on the frame back towards the tank. Then the DDRP pump directly plugs into the ECM so if anything electrically happens to the Raptor the ECM is going to fry. I've not had much to say positive about your setup I'm sorry...

 

1 hour ago, JAG1 said:

Okay..... my set up is exactly the may Moparman says to do it, but I want Greenlee to know that I had continual F/P problems even though set up the right way.

 

The other day MoparMan asked me to turn the regulator almost all the way down and then slowly all the way up to about 25 and see if that helped the fuel pressure swings. It did stop the problem and it's now a  steady 19 at idle. Wholey cow after a year of fighting it it was just the regulator all along.

I'm going to try this move tomorrow. I thought is was from the tank fuel module according to the video I watched on the module kit. I don't know if I will find another Dodge in this condition inside and out. I wish it was a 4x4 but it's not. Thanks for the advice everyone.

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4 hours ago, dripley said:

Thats what I was thinking but I always thought the raptor 150's were remote mount. I did not think DDRP came in a 150gph pump???

"Welcome to the Raptor™ FRRP Fuel Pump The Raptor™  FRRP-150  Fuel Pump is a Premium high output  replacement lift pump for the Dodge Cummins 24 Valve 5.9L diesel engine. A complete installation kit is included."

 

" MOUNTS IN THE SAME LOCATION AS THE OE TRANSFER PUMP"

 

This is what I saw on Pure Flow in the mounting instructions Factory Replacement Raptor Pump 
 

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1 hour ago, Greenlee said:

"Welcome to the Raptor™ FRRP Fuel Pump The Raptor™  FRRP-150  Fuel Pump is a Premium high output  replacement lift pump for the Dodge Cummins 24 Valve 5.9L diesel engine. A complete installation kit is included."

 

" MOUNTS IN THE SAME LOCATION AS THE OE TRANSFER PUMP"

 

This is what I saw on Pure Flow in the mounting instructions Factory Replacement Raptor Pump 
 

I am living and learning. I never looked at the FRRP's, I wanted something better.

 

The ECM can fry due to the 12v power for the pump coming thru the ECM. The full AD and FASS systems come with a wiring harness that uses the oe pigtail for a relay trigger and the 12v would come from battery or elswhere taking the load off of the ECM. It is a very good long term set up. 

 

My thoughts go two ways since you are wanting to sell the truck. One is get the fuel system in good working order how ever far you want to take it. Then

represent it as such to prospective buyers, a litle better than than the oe system. I dont mean just cobble something together thats going fall apart a month. A buyer in the know already knows what you have and one that doesnt let him know if he wants to soup it up or drive for a long time he should put a better fuel system on it.

 

Two, go all out on the fuel system and represent it that way and ask a little more for it. 

 

I could sleep well either way.

Edited by dripley

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Greenlee, You should get someone to watch the gauge while your turning down fuel pressure. I went down to ten and then slowly turned it up to 28 I believe and then put it in the proper range of 19 and my problem for a year is now gone. I wouldn't run the truck without getting the relay on there first and get 1/2 inch lines. Otherwise, even tho you put it at 19 at idle those tiny fuel lines will let it drop below 14 when going up hill or accelerating and thats bad. 10 is okay momentarily at idle, but not when running down the road  and the injection pump is hot.

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On ‎9‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 10:40 PM, dripley said:

I am living and learning. I never looked at the FRRP's, I wanted something better.

 

The ECM can fry due to the 12v power for the pump coming thru the ECM. The full AD and FASS systems come with a wiring harness that uses the oe pigtail for a relay trigger and the 12v would come from battery or elswhere taking the load off of the ECM. It is a very good long term set up. 

 

My thoughts go two ways since you are wanting to sell the truck. One is get the fuel system in good working order how ever far you want to take it. Then

represent it as such to prospective buyers, a litle better than than the oe system. I dont mean just cobble something together thats going fall apart a month. A buyer in the know already knows what you have and one that doesnt let him know if he wants to soup it up or drive for a long time he should put a better fuel system on it.

 

Two, go all out on the fuel system and represent it that way and ask a little more for it. 

 

I could sleep well either way.

I couldn't see Wednesday from having my eyes dilated, must have been a double dose, and yesterday I talked with Eric at Vulcan as suggested by several members. I explained the situation and Eric came up with a solution. He's making up a draw straw with the Draw Straw 5 at the top of the Fuel Basket and a Universal set up at the bottom. We went with 3/8" ID to the FRRP 150 located on the engine. Eric got all the connectors and hose in addition to complete the over haul. Early next week it will all be here. Excellent folks to speak with at Vulcan. I really appreciate you all suggesting I call him. I have a Raptor 150 that is set up to go on the frame but no hard ware including brackets, wiring, connectors or instructions to make it work. I didn't ask Eric if he had the parts separate to make this work because simply I can't afford it right now. If I sell the 98 12v and decide to keep the 24v then I will invest in a better fuel system. I don't know if the other new Raptor that mounts on the frame is good or not as far as being reliable compared to other lift pumps. It looks almost exactly like the Raptor on the engine but the mounting holes are different. There is always something to deal with regardless if it's a 12v or a 24v. The transmission if its automatic for either one and the lift pump and VP44 for the 24v. I hate I can't work on the projects I always thought I would to do when retired but that's life. I'm still blessed even if I'm a little slow moving and thinking. I don't feel guilty any more trying to express my thoughts because I can always find the answers I need and advice I need when I can't remember all the details. I will keep you all posted on how this turns out. I wonder if I can get a wiring harness from Eric like JAG1 pointed on Frying the ECM? If not the Raptor on the frame what would you all suggest. Can't go mechanical because my brother put a Fluidampener on the front of the engine. No way to fit a mechanical pump there any more. Have a blessed day.

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On ‎9‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 11:47 PM, JAG1 said:

Greenlee, You should get someone to watch the gauge while your turning down fuel pressure. I went down to ten and then slowly turned it up to 28 I believe and then put it in the proper range of 19 and my problem for a year is now gone. I wouldn't run the truck without getting the relay on there first and get 1/2 inch lines. Otherwise, even tho you put it at 19 at idle those tiny fuel lines will let it drop below 14 when going up hill or accelerating and thats bad. 10 is okay momentarily at idle, but not when running down the road  and the injection pump is hot.

I mentioned this bit of advice to Eric at Vulcan because it has been an on going ordeal with pressure. I only have a fuel pressure gauge on top of the fuel filter. I told my brother 3 years ago to put gauges on it especially one for fuel. I have a set for the 12v that I never put on it so depending if I keep the 99 or not I'll have to see the new way to put the fuel gauge on since it's not recommended to come off the VP44 port from what I've read. Thanks for explaining this to me. I guess this is the answer when the pressure changes.

On ‎9‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 7:15 AM, Mopar1973Man said:

Can relocate the pump. That particular pump has a small discharge port designed to use a banjo bolt. He would need a normal Raptor first.

Maybe it's a different port for the Raptor 150. What are you running on your frame mount?

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