Smarty s03 today :)

[pepsi71ocean]

2 hours ago, Evan said:

On tm4 t4 d3

 

Feels like its making more power also more smoke. Feels like sw6 all default settings. 

 

Is the smoke before or after the turbo lights(builds boost)

 

2 hours ago, Evan said:

Do you think tm4 t4 is safe towing.

 

I've not noticed any issues towing, it does help spool the turbo quicker though for me.

 

2 hours ago, Evan said:

Shifts are crisp but earlier than on SW default tm wich I think is 3

 

In my expierance the higher the TM# the shorter they are, TM2 for me it draggs the shifts out to 2,400rpm, on TM3 I seem to have about 1,800, and on TM6 it shifts around 1,500. But TV cable adjustment will also effect this.

 

2 hours ago, Evan said:

Smoke doesnt matter it's not horrible unless I get on it good.  Seems to smoke in all setting I have not ran the tm lower than3 i dont think.Think I'm going back to tm3 t4 and will try d3 there.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Evan said:

 

Still thinking sw# does not matter especially after you had me run tm4 .

Pretty damn sure sw6 is the only one running default tm 4 wich makes its fuel curve different.  And not paired with 7 wich is tm5

On d3 I didnt notice the dead spot that seemed to be in the middle of the power band.

I haven't ran the freeway to know if it surges but I'm pretty sure it does

 

 

I typically run TM3 with my truck, I haven't noticed any issues with Timing on 4, but timing locks later on 3 by % throttle. The dead spot you speak of I only experiences when I was running to much fueling on the duration. And that is because I think the VP-44 is over fueling the injectors and its screwing with the dynamic timing. There is a flat timing curve between 1,600 and 2,100 i believe, because regardless of RPM i seem to have the same pyrometers.
 

Quote

1. Duration should be increased based on the size of the injectors.

2. The Timing REVO doesn't change your timing at the top, the Smarty locks the timing at 18.02*.

3. The SW# and the REVO software work independently of one another, meaning that SW9 is not the same as TM6, T4 and D5.(REVO on max)

4. Your trucks internals make a difference, Turbo Size, transmission type, torque converter stall speed. All play a factor on your abilities to tune your truck here, and in finding you which settings work best.

5. The Smarty S03's performance bump is only good for use really between 1,200 and 2,400rpm's, but this is the area your truck is using the most.

6. The S03 locks timing at 18.02*, but the amount of throttle required to lock the timing at that ratio changes based on the Timing level. Example T4 locks the timing at say 60% throttle, rather-wise T3 is 70%, T2 is 80% etc.

7. The higher the SW level the faster you hit %100 duration in relation to throttle input.  SW3 wont hit %100 until WOT. SW5 will hit %100 duration at %50 throttle input / SW7 Will hit %100 duration at 40% throttle input. SW9 will hit %100 duration at 30% throttle input. In order for timing to lock at 18* you must have %100 duration AKA 4095 on the databus for a fueling command.   

8. Smoke control can also be controlled by mechanical means, ie raising injector pop pressure.

 

Sections 5, 6, and 7, give a base for understanding how the smarty hits hard down low, yes it changes the torque down low, but its how hard you go into the throttle. Some of Nick's testing on the Smarty and cANbus testing thread does back up my claims and theories in my article.

I believe if you always go to 70% of your pedal all of the time, then the SW settings will not matter as much, but they do matter since the revo settings still control the other side of the smarty. Reaching 100% fueling command is one thing, the other is the control of fueling according to boost, and the timing of the engine at the rpm's. TM effects pre turbo fueling, and too much causes surge, not enough can take to long to light the turbo, now timing does effect this, but not in the case people think. Its dynamic, meaning that smashing the pedal down is variable, choosing what you feel can be challenging at times.

For example with me my truck on SW9 with the timing on 4 locks timing as quickly as 25% of the available throttle, which is to low for me with my built automatic. But back the timing off to 2 and it runs like an ape. Even if i keep the TM at 6 which smokes like a train till it spools. Conversely backing the smarty down to SW5 I notice the turbo lighting, and the surging/egt's are all different between Timing on 2 and timing on 4, and this is because of how much available throttle is needed before the smarty locks up the timing.

Now if you simply put your foot into the throttle say 60% of the way everywhere you go you won't see the differences as much as the controllability.

[Evan]

I rarely run hardly any throttle  

 

I'm still on SW5 tm4 t4 d3

 

I cant tell any difference in egt. I think with timing it is spoiling quicker under 10psi on freeway I saw some prett steady 5psi stretches but due th o wi d and rolling hills and some surging it would still almost hit 10psi.

 

Yes smokes before turbo lights. Leaving a stop light under light throttle it's a heavy haze then cleans up into light haze. 

 

I might email mads and see if theyl send they're fuel curve charts for sw settings. They gota give up more then they have.

 

I'm alittle Leary but I do want to try towing on this on sw5 with 4 timming..

 

It drags shifts out under lower tm because the trans is shifting with more TV pressure.  Changing settings is almost more or less like tightening and loosening the cable.

 

Theres si much to notice and feel tunning a auto truck compared to a manual.   And yes its hard to figure what to notice and feel. Very challenging. 

 

Thanks again 

Glad said you had a dead spot with high duration was starting to think it was just me.

[pepsi71ocean]

22 hours ago, Evan said:

I rarely run hardly any throttle  

 

I'm still on SW5 tm4 t4 d3

 

I cant tell any difference in egt. I think with timing it is spoiling quicker under 10psi on freeway I saw some prett steady 5psi stretches but due th o wi d and rolling hills and some surging it would still almost hit 10psi.

 

Yes smokes before turbo lights. Leaving a stop light under light throttle it's a heavy haze then cleans up into light haze. 

 

Two things here control that haze, TM setting and the pop pressure.

 

22 hours ago, Evan said:

I might email mads and see if theyl send they're fuel curve charts for sw settings. They gota give up more then they have.

 

good luck with that, I've tried and had no luck either.

 

22 hours ago, Evan said:

I'm alittle Leary but I do want to try towing on this on sw5 with 4 timming..

 

With a lower TM and a higher Timing on SW5 you will notice a huge change in spool up.

 

22 hours ago, Evan said:

It drags shifts out under lower tm because the trans is shifting with more TV pressure.  Changing settings is almost more or less like tightening and loosening the cable.

 

Honestly, I've never been able to understand why this is. But Its one of those things where the TM will effect the torque out of the motor, and for some reason the shifting. I've had the truck operate smoke free on TM2, but I had to spend a stupid amount of time adjusting my TV cable. So I found that TM3 is the best base to start from.

 

22 hours ago, Evan said:

Theres si much to notice and feel tunning a auto truck compared to a manual.   And yes its hard to figure what to notice and feel. Very challenging. 

 

Not to mention your running a HY-35 which also effects temperatures and spool up.

 

22 hours ago, Evan said:

Thanks again 

Glad said you had a dead spot with high duration was starting to think it was just me.

 

Yep, not a problem, but like I said I haven't a clue what causes it, I just know that turning the D down solved it, and the passing smoke as well.

 

[Evan]

Higher tm the truck moves down rd quicler with less throttle means the TV lever is moving less creating less pressure for speed wich shifts sooner.

 

Lower tm more throttle ti fo same speed moves TV cable more.

 

This just happened in that order rock kissed pumpkin bent fo control arm removed pump.

Going 5mph blind into the sun.

 

So far temps dont seem to be affected by tunning.  Same with or without timming 

 

I just got pump tigged jack up and it's still working. Drilled holes for the upper 2 bolts and drilled a few holes to use a welder spark plug cable to secure the bottom of the bracket 

[pepsi71ocean]

29 minutes ago, Evan said:

Higher tm the truck moves down rd quicler with less throttle means the TV lever is moving less creating less pressure for speed wich shifts sooner.

 

Lower tm more throttle ti fo same speed moves TV cable more.

 

This just happened in that order rock kissed pumpkin bent fo control arm removed pump.

Going 5mph blind into the sun.

 

So far temps dont seem to be affected by tunning.  Same with or without timming 

 

I just got pump tigged jack up and it's still working. Drilled holes for the upper 2 bolts and drilled a few holes to use a welder spark plug cable to secure the bottom of the bracket 

 

That sucks. Glad i stay in PA/NJ and deal with non-dirt roads.

[Evan]

Dead spot in the power band is definitely gone. Pulls noticably harder from 1500to 2000.

Swapped my 33s off for my good 35s surge on freeway is much better and psi is a pretty solid 6is woth 33s needle was bouncing from 5-10ish.

Pulled horses and she still smoke on heavy side taking off from a stop under normal to light throttle  then hazed through to 1900 cruising.  I think slight haze st 1900

[Evan]

Towed 9k at 1900 rpm plenty of power to spare can stand on it roaling coal and be doing 85 in fast lane to jump ahead of the acasional truck or grandpa going slower than me.

 

Still smoking plenty off idle with a trailer I can see cars behind me going through my cloud across they're windshield.

 

I almost think it started smoking more in the last couple days and I haven't changed any settings.  Still sw5 tm4 t4 d3.

Might drop d to 2.

 

Does the factory computer learn the driver I think it does learn driving characteristics of the driver adjust or adapt whatever you call it. Am I crazy thinking that? If it does does it still do that with the smarty tune going? What about the quad?

Maybe I read something about adaptive parameters and my mind just moved it over to the truck 

[Me78569]

the ecm doesn't "learn"

 

its just the smarty being smokey

[pepsi71ocean]

15 hours ago, Evan said:

Towed 9k at 1900 rpm plenty of power to spare can stand on it roaling coal and be doing 85 in fast lane to jump ahead of the acasional truck or grandpa going slower than me.

 

Still smoking plenty off idle with a trailer I can see cars behind me going through my cloud across they're windshield.

 

I almost think it started smoking more in the last couple days and I haven't changed any settings.  Still sw5 tm4 t4 d3.

Might drop d to 2.

 

Does the factory computer learn the driver I think it does learn driving characteristics of the driver adjust or adapt whatever you call it. Am I crazy thinking that? If it does does it still do that with the smarty tune going? What about the quad?

Maybe I read something about adaptive parameters and my mind just moved it over to the truck 

 

Back your TM to #3 and see how the off idle smoke is. 

 

Do you think it has more power now with it on Revo then before when you left the Revo settings on the SW#

 

1 hour ago, Me78569 said:

the ecm doesn't "learn"

 

its just the smarty being smokey

 

Yes indeed, but that I think too deals with injector pop pressure.

[Me78569]

3 minutes ago, pepsi71ocean said:

 

Yes indeed, but that I think too deals with injector pop pressure.

Pop has way less to do with it than duration command does.

[Evan]

Yes it has more power because revo is set at tm 4 sw5 tm default is 3 sw6 tm default is 4 feels the same as it.

 

Not sure I believe the sw# brings different fuel curves. I still think only tm# does sw is nothing more than a default set of revo settings. Only thing changing with sw# is the tm# and that's what changes the curve the tm # not sw. Lol I make no sence and am probly wrong just what it feels like to me.

 

I like how tm4 feels off idle compared to 3 I'll deal with the smoke I have messed with it but I'll put duration down a number. Was going to change tire size earlier but even that I'm not sure works. I have speed limiter set at 85 and can easily smoke way passed it. I think I have 32" tire plugged in so not a huge difference to 33" anyways

 

 

[pepsi71ocean]

On 7/1/2019 at 4:23 PM, Me78569 said:

Pop has way less to do with it than duration command does.

 

It did for me. My smokes issues went away at 322bar. And the settings weren't changed at all. Not only that but the trucks response was more aggressive. Aggressive to the point on sw9 I can actually break the tires lose on the highway. 

 

I think the pop pressure helps by changing the injection point and the duration is shortened as a result. 

 

But with the smarty locking timing, it's effects are so significant to me that it made a difference.

[Evan]

I put D to 2 and holy crap seems to pull harder all the way through. I think I'll go down to one or whatever factory is.

 

D2 made it crisper quicker revving very noticable even under light throttle. Still smokes but manageable. If I have to dive in traffic from a stop I'll leave a black cloud.

[Me78569]

10 hours ago, pepsi71ocean said:

 

It did for me. My smokes issues went away at 322bar. And the settings weren't changed at all. Not only that but the trucks response was more aggressive. Aggressive to the point on sw9 I can actually break the tires lose on the highway. 

 

I think the pop pressure helps by changing the injection point and the duration is shortened as a result. 

 

But with the smarty locking timing, it's effects are so significant to me that it made a difference.

Gotta remember i tested pop pressure back to back running the same tunes.   Going from stock pop to 350 bar resulted in being able to throw ~%5 more duration command to the truck before smoke appeared.  I was still having to pull %30 duration offidle to keep the smoke from occuring. 

 

The run are on youtube. If you want to compare what pop pressure did for smoke output.

[Mopar1973Man]

@Me78569 is 100% correct. Your at you limits with Smarty S-03.

[Evan]

I wont be doing injectors or a quad till tax time if then.  Happy with the power fuel mileage the smarty is getting.

 

My truck smokes with the factory tune and boost fooler so it very well could be injectors.

 

Also need to do steering and swap ro all soft transmission lines. And my turbo has more oil residue and some shady play. It may decide to be priority 

[pepsi71ocean]

On 7/4/2019 at 10:15 AM, Me78569 said:

Gotta remember i tested pop pressure back to back running the same tunes.   Going from stock pop to 350 bar resulted in being able to throw ~%5 more duration command to the truck before smoke appeared.  I was still having to pull %30 duration offidle to keep the smoke from occuring. 

 

The run are on youtube. If you want to compare what pop pressure did for smoke output.

 

Yes, but you weren't running a smarty at the time either if I remember correctly. 

 

I really think that resisting the pop offsets the smoke production.

 

I'm just saying that for me going from 280 bar to 322 bar solved allot of my smoke issues. I can pass a SNAP test with a smarty. That's unheard of. 

[wil440]

On 7/6/2019 at 2:19 AM, pepsi71ocean said:

 

Yes, but you weren't running a smarty at the time either if I remember correctly. 

 

I really think that resisting the pop offsets the smoke production.

 

I'm just saying that for me going from 280 bar to 322 bar solved allot of my smoke issues. I can pass a SNAP test with a smarty. That's unheard of. 

280 to 322 bar is a 622.8 psi increase in injection pressure this will atomize the fuel better therefore the rate of burn will be faster and more complete hence why bad injectors dribbling cause a lot of smoke the flame cannot move fast enough across the cylinder to complete the burn before exhaust valve opens. 

[Mopar1973Man]

293 bar is the lower limit for injectors. Below this the spray is not as good and larger drops and less fine mist.

[wil440]

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

293 bar is the lower limit for injectors. Below this the spray is not as good and larger drops and less fine mist.

every injected engine has a low limit even petrol/gas and they do vary, usually the smaller the holes the lower the pressure can be as it's going to atomize through smaller holes at lower pressures than larger holes and note the word atomize... this is not mist and can quite easily penetrate skin, flesh and bones and cause at best blood poisoning and at worst death, if an injector is outside the cylinder for a pressure test you get mist right at the edge of the fuel cloud when most of the energy has dissippated, at the nozzle it becomes dangerous as 322 bar is 5000psi give or take, over here in the uk it is illegal for the old fashioned injector testers which were high pressure mechanical pumps which were supposed to be full of a fluid that mimicked diesel and didn't burn but they never were, the injector was fitted to an old injector pipe of the same thread and away you go, now they have to be tested in a cabinet with the correct fluid with no way of getting any part of body inside the cabinet while it's tested. Even cracked injector lines are dangerous if the injection pressure is generated at the pump like a P pump I suppose, best to crack them a lot and never just a gnats, most everything I see now are unit injectors and thats take em out and change them usually in Cat C32, C18, C13,C9 and C7