All sorts of problems w/quad download

[dieseldon]

I haven't owned this truck for a year yet, but as far as I know it doesn't have an OEM one,

Haven't seen any secret switches or?

[Me78569]

it's programmed into the ecm and automatically trips on if it is cold out.   

 

Here is the TSB that covers it.  What you are describing sounds like oem high idle might be trying to kick on and the quadzilla is fighting with it's own high idle.

 

 

 

 

[dieseldon]

Thanks, I can tell you that I've started it plenty of times in the cold ( purchased last Feb.) and never had a high idle kick in, so probably safe to say it doesn't.

[dieseldon]

Do I need to actually know for sure if it ever had it OEM? By VIN? Does it even matter since it's obviously not activating on its own? And P.O. disabled it for some reason?  Can't imagine why he would do that.

  Sure seems as if quad is messing with ECM/ idle somehow?

[Mopar1973Man]

2 minutes ago, dieseldon said:

Do I need to actually know for sure if it ever had it OEM?

 

All 98.5 to 2002 Dodge Cummins ISB engines have the software already. If anyone has ever used a Smarty tuner on that truck it automatically enables the software. The only way to turn it off again is a visit to the Dodge Dealer and have a dealer tech reverse that article above and turn it back off. 

 

Another thing the temperatures are based on IAT temperatures. When you start the truck the grid heaters are running so the manifold temperature has to fall below 32*F for 6 cylinder high idle, then 15*F for high idle 3 cylinder. This is where the high idle kit into place because now it give you control over the software to allow it be automatic or manual force the 3 CYL or 6 CYL modes. 

 

If you want to ditch the Cummins software high idle you'll have to visit a Dodge Dealer and have it turned off. 

 

The Quadzilla high idle work pretty good and good for light winter stuff. It provides good 6 cylinder high idle based on ECT temp what you have set and the delay of second before it kick back in. No 3 cylinder mode provided by Quadzilla. 

 

Either way 6 cylinder high idle doesn't generate much heat. This only creates about 300 to 400*F EGT's and warm up time is long. Now enable 3 CYL mode of the Cummins software and also use your exhaust brake. I've seen warm up times from -20*F to 170*F engine temp in under 15 minutes. 3 cylinder mode and an exhaust brake can produce nearly 1,000*F EGT's and warm up a cold Cummins in a quick amount of time. Even without a exhaust brake 3 CYL can produce a good solid 600*F EGT's and still warm up fairly fast. 

14 minutes ago, dieseldon said:

Sure seems as if quad is messing with ECM/ idle somehow?

 

It can depending on the settings for warm pu and delay for high idle listed in the setting page. 

[dieseldon]

Thanks for the info!

I didn't realize second gen had a 3cyl.mode

 But I can't help thinking even though I have the high idle in quad settings off at the moment, somehow it's still messing with it?

(This morning) until I turned it off and re-loaded it.

 The only way to make dang sure there's no software incompatibility is a trip to the dealership? Nooooo!

 I'll just have to see how it goes the next day or so?

[Mopar1973Man]

Ok simple. 

 

The only way for Quadzilla to activate the high idle is if you have the warm up mode set ON. If the warm up mode is set for OFF it should not start high idle.

 

High idle on the ECM has no way to disable. It will activate any time the conditions are TRUE. 

• IAT <32*F (6 CYL) or IAT <15*F (3 CYL)
• ECT <140*F

Those two conditions are true then the ECM will start high idle.

 

For ECM to cancel high idle...

• Brake Pedal Pressed
• Throttle Pedal Pressed
• Automatic place into gear
• Road speed > 0 MPH
• Engine Coolant > 169*F

[Dieselfuture]

Have you tried bypassing quad and putting all wires back to factory. if you do that and it works fine then there is an issue with the quad. You could try reflashing v2 software on it if you dear. It's actually not that bad once you figure it out.

[dieseldon]

Mopa1973man, it shouldn't and yet that seems to be exactly what happened this morning, wasn't that cold either, 45* maybe?

 

I wouldn't dare try to re flash under warranty.

 

 Like I said, I'll keep an eye on it, play with some different settings and try to find out what's tripping it.

Me and Murphy are old buddies... but why?!!

[Mopar1973Man]

Ok... To verify sensors. Setup your iQuad app and have ready in the morning. On the display have coolant and IAT right next to each other. Now when your turn the key on for the wait to start just done start it. Leave it. Now look at the IAT and coolant temps they should be both the same. If not then you'll have to have IR temp gun and measure the best you can between the coolant and IAT locations. Verify the sensors are displaying correctly. The one that is off on the measurement and what is displayed is the one to replace. 

[dieseldon]

Thanks, makes sense.

I'm getting ready to go to cascade for a couple of days tomorrow, not sure if I'm going to have time to fiddle with? I'm guessing it's not going to hurt anything to drive as is?

[Mopar1973Man]

As long as you don't leave it idle... Then it will drive as normal but leave it sit and idle excessively then the high idle software kicks in.

[dieseldon]

Hi all, just an update after three days of mountain drive and towing approx. 9k. Lab's

(My first real test with new Iquad)

 First off, tow tune was AMAZING! That's the way dodge should have sold them new!, or at least offered a power option ?

 

  Now, back to the issues at hand. I had no random surging, no check engine lights, and no high idle, as long as I check off option on quad, so.. I can't use that feature??

Coolant and IAT temps were within a degree of each other at first startup, however coolant gauge was being a little glitchy at times, might just replace that sensor and see if it helps.

 

  The other issue, and haven't heard if anyone else has or has ever had hard starting when engine is warm? I stopped to empty my trailer on the way home tonight and literally didn't think it was going to start back up, don't think my batteries or starter is going to last much longer at this rate. Truck has ALWAYS fired up with just a bump of the key. Acts like air in line? Am I supposed to return to stock everytime I start? Not liking this one. (Haven't tried that yet, but might tell me something?)

 

  Thanks for any ideas/help!

[Mopar1973Man]

Quad has nothing to do with start up. It ignored at start up.

 

Watch your fuel pressure gauge if you have a mechanical gauge. If the gauge falls out there is a air bubble going up the line. Air is compressible so the pressure typically sinks for a bit and pops back up. Check suction lines they typically will not leak out but continue to suck air in.

[hdpwipmonkey]

Trouble starting when it's hot?  I hope its not the PSG starting to give you problems. 

[Mopar1973Man]

1 minute ago, hdpwipmonkey said:

Trouble starting when it's hot?  I hope its not the PSG starting to give you problems. 

 

Typically hot start issue is high cranking fuel pressure and/or possibly P0216 code. Like the last one I dealt with you could start the engine cold but after it warmed up it would not start again. It had a P0216 code. After VP44 replacement the hard start was gone. This was cause by a stuck timing piston and it was stuck advanced.

 

Needless to say that job managed to down me for one month while my left hand ring finger healed up. Yup. Trying to get the pump gear off with my puller and punched the fan. Should of had stitches but I dealt with it myself being I didn't want to deal with the BS COVID-19 test and hospital policies. 

[dieseldon]

Don't have a mechanical gauge.

 

What's PSG?

 

How would one go about checking lines sucking air if no visible leak?

 

I've read a little bit about too much fuel pressure while cranking? Pull lift pump fuse and see if starts, if it does, then install a relay switch. I've seen your schematic moparman, but I'm no electrician and may need step by step pictures with crayons, lol.

And maybe something about the fuel return valve?

 

I did notice the LP running longer than normal with ignition on a couple times.

 

Again, all this is just strange coincidences immediately after installing iquad? ? Guess I'm having a hard time grasping that.

 

Quickly running out of patience and money with this truck.

 

      Thanks again!

[Mopar1973Man]

PSG is the electronic module controlling the vp44.

 

Fuel pressure during cranking should be 7 to 12 bouncing. This is normal being the ECM is 50% duty cycle on the lift pump.

 

Use a shop vacuum on blow and pressurize the fuel tank and have a second person look over the suction lines. Crossover tubes have o-ring seals and might weep air back in. 

 

Overflow valve can be tested by using compressed air set to 10 PSI the valve should stay closed. Then at 14 PSI it should be open. Disregard the bleed hole it doesn't count.

[dieseldon]

So... Finally got around to fiddling with truck again, couldn't find any leaks while pressuring tank, tested overflow valve and couldn't get it to open till reaching 40 psi. Then it seemed to operate normally, stuck?? Just ordered one from Amazon, now just hoping there's not much difference between the $19 one I ordered and the $50 - $100 ones I saw online!

I guess I'll find out in a day or two if that helps?

 Thanks again for the help!

Correction, now seems to be stuck open.

[dieseldon]

So, I got my new "Wang Chung" valve today,

I noticed it doesn't have a weep hole, can anyone tell me if I should be concerned?

  Evidently people are using them, at least according to Amazon.

 

    Thanks!