Dreaded P0216 code, help/advice

[Doubletrouble]

 So on my way to work this morning I noticed my pedal was for the most part dead. No acceleration and the engine was "missing" for lack of a better term.

 Made it to work, truck idled smooth like any other day but if revved a few times it would begin to miss again.

 Had the OBD scanner in the truck so plugged in and saw the P0216 code. That was the only code present.

 I know this is the VP death code but before I drop big $$$ on a pump, is there anything else I need to look at? I want to properly diagnose this and not just throw money at it. Can't afford that rout right now.

 Thanks in advance......

[Mopar1973Man]

Nope. The timing piston isn't responding in a timely fashion because it's partially or fully seized up. The only thing you can do is replace. P0216 code is typically caused by low lubricity fuels. Be aware a lot of fuel additivesdont make the grade for lubricity.

[Doubletrouble]

The only thing I've added was 2 cycle oil since I've had it. When I got the truck it had 138k on the clock. No telling what was or wasn't done before I got it. 

[JAG1]

I still think good fuel pressure helps the timing piston to float on more lubrication in a sense. I would try running around for awhile on heavy doses to 2 stroke oil. I had 0216 code for 2-3 years running long distances on heavy doses. Also the Walmart stuff seems to be thinner grade like its more watery so I always went for Pennzoil 2 stroke oil or other long standing brands. It cost more but it didn't soak thru my throw away cardboard funnels so readily. I had to use funnels because of the difficulty in filling a flatbed with the fill spout built in the bed rail.

[Mopar1973Man]

Fuel pressure helps with cooling keeping the overflow valve open.

 

But if a owner is dumping in excessive amounts of cetane booster and injector cleaners then the fuel will be most likely lower in lubricity being most all products out there failed the lubricity test. Hence why I don't use any additives no anti-gel, cetane booster, or injector cleaners. The only ones that score good for lubricity is 2 cycle oil, Opti-Lube or 2% bio-diesel. Beyond that all others more or less failed or too little of gain ot be worth it price wise. Yes I see plenty of people adding more ot the fuel every time they hit the pumps in the winter time. Do your study of the fuels you use and find out. Like I did this years ago and found out my local fuel is like 48 to 50 Cetane. Don't need cetane additive. As for pour point its down to -20*F, well I don't need a anti-gel product, injector cleaners won't work anyways which I've proved years ago. So there is no reason to add any products for me. Even though this winter we seen minus weather here already. But my fuel temp never was below +20*F so I'm not worried one bit. 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by Mopar1973Man

[Doubletrouble]

 Again, the only thing I add is the 2 cycle oil. I have learned this here on the forum and have stuck to it.

 I retrieved my truck today. Noticed when I turned the key forward I did NOT hear the lift pump come on. I started it long enough to creep it up on the trailer then shut it down.

 I'll check for power at the pump to be sure it isn't an ecm issue but if there is 12v there I'll be ordering a new LP from dap. I'd like to get an air dog but just not in the budget at this point so it will be a Fass DDRP which it what just failed. It's been on there since I got the truck (30k miles/2 years ago) but don't know for sure how long it's been in service.

 Once the LP is replaced I'll give her a try and see what happens. I'm sure the injection pump has sustained some wear or damage but if it will keep her on the road for a while til I can save for the IP that would be great. If not then I guess I'll pop for the pump. No way around it. 

[JAG1]

1 hour ago, Doubletrouble said:

 Again, the only thing I add is the 2 cycle oil. I have learned this here on the forum and have stuck to it.

 I retrieved my truck today. Noticed when I turned the key forward I did NOT hear the lift pump come on. I started it long enough to creep it up on the trailer then shut it down.

 I'll check for power at the pump to be sure it isn't an ecm issue but if there is 12v there I'll be ordering a new LP from dap. I'd like to get an air dog but just not in the budget at this point so it will be a Fass DDRP which it what just failed. It's been on there since I got the truck (30k miles/2 years ago) but don't know for sure how long it's been in service.

 Once the LP is replaced I'll give her a try and see what happens. I'm sure the injection pump has sustained some wear or damage but if it will keep her on the road for a while til I can save for the IP that would be great. If not then I guess I'll pop for the pump. No way around it. 

Make sure you get the wire harness to run off the batteries thereby protecting the ECM. Ecm is used only to trigger the relay, with a protection diode, so there is no reverse load, no AC ripple going upstream to the ECM. I really like my Raptor 150's for both trucks. I think Raptor sells their with the wire harness.

[Doubletrouble]

53 minutes ago, JAG1 said:

Make sure you get the wire harness to run off the batteries thereby protecting the ECM. Ecm is used only to trigger the relay, with a protection diode, so there is no reverse load, no AC ripple going upstream to the ECM. I really like my Raptor 150's for both trucks. I think Raptor sells their with the wire harness.

 Raptor has a factory replacement? I'll have to look. I was intending on doing the LP relay mod. Just seems to make sense to me. Don't know why the factory didn't do that in the first place.

[IBMobile]

1 hour ago, Doubletrouble said:

Don't know why the factory didn't do that in the first place.

Why most business do anything, profit.  A few dollars in extra cost saved per unit adds up to thousands over the run of that model.   If it makes it out of the warranty period before failures start to happen then all the better.

[Doubletrouble]

@IBMobile I knew that but it still irritates me. Lol 

[LorenS]

My DDRP is on the frame behind the transfer case, with a spin-on screen ahead of it (see my signature), draw straw and 3/8" fuel lines (1/2" wasn't popular when I did the change over). I'm very happy with my fuel pressure at the VP, but I don't pull heavy so can't speak to that. Fed with appropriate relay triggered by the stock wires.

[Tractorman]

On 1/14/2022 at 5:06 PM, Doubletrouble said:

When I got the truck it had 138k on the clock.

 

5 hours ago, Doubletrouble said:

so it will be a Fass DDRP which it what just failed. It's been on there since I got the truck (30k miles/2 years ago)

 

If I am understanding correctly, you have about 168,000 miles on your truck?  It is possible that you are running the original VP44.  If that is the case, there are many inferior components inside that pump - including the timing piston assembly.  My VP44 failed at 67,000 miles in 2004 with the 0216 code.  I drove it that way for 20,000 more miles.  Then Dodge replaced the VP44 and installed in-tank lift pump under warranty.  Interestingly, Dodge provided a relay for the lift pump.  

 

I don't use any 2-stroke oil, but Oregon mandates 5% biodiesel.  So far, my replacement VP44 has logged over 270,000 miles.

 

Get your lift pump working properly and give your truck a test drive to see if you continue to go into limp mode with the 0216 code.  It is possible that when your lift pump failed, the fuel path may have been severely restricted which would not allow the VP44's internal vane pump to do its job.  One of its many duties is to supply fuel flow and to regulate fuel pressure for the timing piston assembly.

 

- John

 

[Doubletrouble]

@Tractorman, the actual milage now is about 163,500. I belive the injection pump may have been replaced at some point just by looking at it. Hard to explain but it looks "newer" than it should if that makes sense.

[JAG1]

1 hour ago, Tractorman said:

 

 

If I am understanding correctly, you have about 168,000 miles on your truck?  It is possible that you are running the original VP44.  If that is the case, there are many inferior components inside that pump - including the timing piston assembly.  My VP44 failed at 67,000 miles in 2004 with the 0216 code.  I drove it that way for 20,000 more miles.  Then Dodge replaced the VP44 and installed in-tank lift pump under warranty.  Interestingly, Dodge provided a relay for the lift pump.  

 

I don't use any 2-stroke oil, but Oregon mandates 5% biodiesel.  So far, my replacement VP44 has logged over 270,000 miles.

 

Get your lift pump working properly and give your truck a test drive to see if you continue to go into limp mode with the 0216 code.  It is possible that when your lift pump failed, the fuel path may have been severely restricted which would not allow the VP44's internal vane pump to do its job.  One of its many duties is to supply fuel flow and to regulate fuel pressure for the timing piston assembly.

 

- John

 

Yep and there's screens in the tank that cause restriction when they collect sediment and growth making the pump run hotter. Just do frame mounted Pump with 1/2'' lines. The kit from Vulcan Performance is a really good conversion kit. I like my Raptor 150's as they are showing signs that they are durable. The 100 started showing weakness at about 60,000 miles. Had to keep turning up the pressure adjustment once a year or so. So I went for the 150's and they been real steady for me. Good to have a sediment 30 micron water separating filter before the lift pump to stop the water from mixing with fuel. It it mixes and emulsify with the fuel, then the factory filter can't do a good job of water separation.

[Doubletrouble]

7 hours ago, JAG1 said:

Yep and there's screens in the tank that cause restriction when they collect sediment and growth making the pump run hotter. Just do frame mounted Pump with 1/2'' lines. The kit from Vulcan Performance is a really good conversion kit. I like my Raptor 150's as they are showing signs that they are durable. The 100 started showing weakness at about 60,000 miles. Had to keep turning up the pressure adjustment once a year or so. So I went for the 150's and they been real steady for me. Good to have a sediment 30 micron water separating filter before the lift pump to stop the water from mixing with fuel. It it mixes and emulsify with the fuel, then the factory filter can't do a good job of water separation.

 That is what I'd like to do is the 1/2" line kit but, as for now its cold here. My truck don't fit in my garage so I think I'll just replace the pump and leave the lines. When it warms up I'd like to do a draw straw with 1/2" lines. 

 Will a Raptor 150 be ok on a stock truck? Is there a such a thing as to much fuel to the VP? I'm looking at the Raptor 150 at DAP as it also comes with the 1/2" line from filter to VP.

 It says it mount on the factory bracket on the motor. (Fine for now, change it later to frame mount)

 Also, in regards to the possibility of the in tank screens being full of goo, should I maybe blow a little compressed air through the line into the tank to clear it? 

[LorenS]

50 minutes ago, Doubletrouble said:

blow a little compressed air through the line into the tank to clear it

As long as your pressure is reasonable it can't hurt anything and I'd certainly try it.  As goopy as the stuff was around my screen (imagine wet coffee grounds, but much finer), it may not "clear it" like make it disperse all throughout the tank, but it should move a little.

 

Whatever pump you put on that isn't a stock unit really "must" be on a relay to protect your ECM. And stock units "should" be on a relay. They tend to draw quite a few amps.

This screenshot of Airdog's listing shows all the things needed to mount this unit on the frame, but I don't believe most of it is included. I'd call and ask.

Even if you don't install it in the frame right now, it'd be nice to have on hand the materials to do so, and would give you the relay wiring.

[JAG1]

3 hours ago, Doubletrouble said:

 That is what I'd like to do is the 1/2" line kit but, as for now its cold here. My truck don't fit in my garage so I think I'll just replace the pump and leave the lines. When it warms up I'd like to do a draw straw with 1/2" lines. 

 Will a Raptor 150 be ok on a stock truck? Is there a such a thing as to much fuel to the VP? I'm looking at the Raptor 150 at DAP as it also comes with the 1/2" line from filter to VP.

 It says it mount on the factory bracket on the motor. (Fine for now, change it later to frame mount)

 Also, in regards to the possibility of the in tank screens being full of goo, should I maybe blow a little compressed air through the line into the tank to clear it? 

Raptor 150 is a good one and is a notch up from the least expensive Raptor 100. Raptor has adjustable fuel pressure regulator. When you first get it running you have to break in or seat the regulator by turning fuel pressure up to 27 then down to 6/7 keep doing that for about 3-4 times and it steadies up the pressure real nice. Is it possible you can find a friends garage to set it up right? There's drawbacks to not getting everything at once. I don't see how a 150 will mount to the factory (pain in the arse) factory engine mount bracket. I would plan on doing everything it needs because you can damage the new lift pump not clearing out and getting rid of the in tank screens. It may be starving the VP as is.

[Doubletrouble]

 Good point @JAG1, just sucks things like this only seem to happen when it's cold out. Lol

 The pump that's in it must have just given up suddenly. I checked pressure at idle about 2 weeks ago. It idled at 17psi. Now it's not even turning on. Gonna check for power at the plug in a bit. Waiting for my son to come over to BP the starter while I'm under the truck. 25 seconds isnt enough to get my butt under there to check. Lol

[wil440]

I'm not crowing here one bit but I'm really glad I went mechanical lift pump, no doubt fuel shops here know VP's inside out but whether they know the specs required for a Ram I don't know and I'd say £1500 + to get one from the USA

 

I really hope you get this sorted out and don't have to do a VP

[JAG1]

1 hour ago, Doubletrouble said:

 Good point @JAG1, just sucks things like this only seem to happen when it's cold out. Lol

 The pump that's in it must have just given up suddenly. I checked pressure at idle about 2 weeks ago. It idled at 17psi. Now it's not even turning on. Gonna check for power at the plug in a bit. Waiting for my son to come over to BP the starter while I'm under the truck. 25 seconds isnt enough to get my butt under there to check. Lol

Don't mess with trying to start that now as you may further damage the ECM in a big hurry doing that. Just get rid of that whole damaging set up and do it right. When I bought my trucks I wouldn't even drive them for a short run with that crazy factory set-up. Use a credit card if your young like me once and had barely anything to start with. Me old and have money I turned into a real squeaky tight wad. Ask Mopar Man, he knows!

 

You could hot wire the lift pump for a test so it wouldn't hurt the ECM.

 

Can you rent a heated storage unit big enough get the truck inside? For a month or two? I would look on Craigs for renting short term some sort of garage with heat.

Edited January 16, 2022 by JAG1