woodstove talk again....

[JAG1]

For 12 years I have been digging around trying to figure out why I'm getting excessive creosote build up. After trying all the right possibilities, A to Z, I finally got tired of it all.. as drastic situations require drastic solutions..... went on the roof and cut off that sheet metal band that they designed around the chimney cap opening. Sure the rain can go in a bit but, it had got to make it breath better. Straight piped ha ha.

I got to tell ya' man oh man does it ever burn correct now. I can even turn it down a lot more for some all night burns with no build up. Can't believe I put up with it for 12 years just fighting with every poss. change I could make. Itliterally drove me nuts with creosote leaking outside the pipe. I was just too afraid to play around with Gov't approved $h1t they put on there.

Edited December 17, 2014 by JAG1

[joecool911]

Should be less restrictive covers. One that rotates with the wind for instance. Burning Douglas fir, we go 2 years between cleanings. No ooze or goo, just flaky dry stuff in the chimney. A good woodstove that has secondary combustion is a help too. We have a morso and 2 Jotul stoves. But there are a few food american made stoves too. These zonal stoves allow us to heat the parts for house we desire and use less than 3 cords a year. Quadra fire stoves seem like a good one made in America. Straight up pipes draw best.

[JAG1]

I have the largest Quadrafire stove.

The creosote problems wouldn't quit till I made the chimney cap flow better. I'm so happy because I know how valuable a good set up is. Now I finely have one.

Thank God and he's blessed us with enough wood for two more coming years.

Edited December 17, 2014 by JAG1

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm also straight piped in the main house. But my problem is my chimney is so long from being a 2 story house that the tip of the chimney is known to build some creosote because of it's length. But What I do is run the stove good and hard twice a day and get the pyrometer up to 1,600 or so and then let it settle back down for the day or night.

[JAG1]

My chimney is about as high as yours probably. So do you also have the metal band cut out of yours?

What I mean is the chimney cap is still on top but the 1 1/4 band that went around the cap support legs has been removed, allowing more flow.

[Mopar1973Man]

No cap at all. Just straight pipe to the top of the brick liner.

[dorkweed]

Last year, I couldn't sweep my chimney until the burning season was over.  That wound up being almost 6 months last year.  When I did sweep, I only got about 5 cups of flaky, brown/black, coffee grounds looking soot/creosote.  I just swept my chimney after 2 months burning this burning season..................got just over 2 cups of the same looking stuff.  Would've been less I think;  but with the mild December, I was letting the stove go cold and doing a  lot of cold starts.   Last year and this year I'm burning wood that was CSS (cut, split, stacked) for AT LEAST 1 YEAR though.  If y'all aren't doing that................try it, you'll be amazed at the difference.

[hex0rz]

When i was doing firewood, i bought a moisture meter. Came in really handy

[dorkweed]

When i was doing firewood, i bought a moisture meter. Came in really handy

 

 

For the newer EPA stoves;  they recommend <20% moisture in your CSS'ed firewood.  

 

If'n you're buying firewood that was split only a month or two or less than from the date it was delivered.....................it's not ready to burn...........aka, "seasoned"!!!!!

[flagmanruss]

We built this house in 1990.  I built the outside chimney with instructions from a mason.  2 8" liners together inside a 4" U shaped block, alternated lng & short U's to stagger the joints.  We have a low "ranch type" roof & I extended the chimney untIl it was higher than the peak.  Drew like a Bastard. 

 

Inside we have an 1880's "King Circulator" antique stove with a bi-metal spring draft control in the door.  Our single pipe comes up one 3' section, an elbow, and 4 3' sections (horizontal sections all riveted together).  We took one section out from the pipe when we moved it up from the Management area caretaker's house.  (Wife's frst husband worked for DEM in Forestry Div.)  

 

The outside needed some age cracks fIxed so we had it done & had a brick finish layer applied...  the original footing had been made wide enough to include it.  The mason talked us into shortening the chimney at the same time...  He took 5-6 feet off the outside. 

 

Now it's a whole new deal.  The chimney doesn't draw so strongly.  Where we used to run with a damper half closed, now it doesn't draw enough if we do so.  Additionally, the outside chimney builds creasote badly.  I think the flue is too cold & condensing.  So we are relearning.  During the days, we're using a smaller fire but leaving the damper open.  Hopefully this will do the trick. 

 

We've been able to use a flue brush (with the fire out on a warm day) from the bottom.  The blockage...  we did get a bad blockage last year...  is maybe 3 feet above the thimble from the down stairs stove.   Our flue has no cap.  Any rain or snow, evaporates or runs out the cleanout at the bottom. 

 

Most of our wood is well seasoned in short lengths.  We used to get from a source that didn't split until delivery & wasn't dry enough (or needed to order earlier).  New supplier is seasoned split for a year.  We have some of our own wood & some of that has been down for a year but not cut up & is not dry enough yet.   

 

We took down some big hard pines that were a danger to the house...  they are cut to lengths & we will burn them next year (hopefully).  Inlaws have a splitter we can borrow.   Some of the rounds are 24" Diameter. 

 

This is a work in progress...        

Edited December 31, 2014 by flagmanruss

[JAG1]

I've heard of that extended chimney will help with better draft. I also heard that the way the wind swirls off the ridge of a house can cause problems so an extension gets it above the swirl.

 

In my case it was too slow of draft causing build up so when I got the metal shears and cut off the band around the cap... wow! Major difference. I think it's confusing to tell what is causing slow draft and creosote build up because I used to think it was because the upper sections of pipe were too cold.... well, when you increase pipe flow rate it keeps the upper pipe warmer and helps stop creosote build up.

 

I just don't know it all because its easy to think, okay if I'd only gotten 8 inch pipe instead of 6 it would have been a whole lot better, but then with the 8 inch pipe the flow would have been slowed, allowing the upper sections to run cooler and building up creosote.

 

I'm so happy now because it was a major problem of creosote build up for years. I mean it was really bad that no amount of super dry wood took care of it until I cut off and put that band in the garbage.

Edited December 31, 2014 by JAG1

[dorkweed]

I've heard of that extended chimney will help with better draft. I also heard that the way the wind swirls off the ridge of a house can cause problems so an extension gets it above the swirl.

 

In my case it was too slow of draft causing build up so when I got the metal shears and cut off the band around the cap... wow! Major difference. I think it's confusing to tell what is causing slow draft and creosote build up because I used to think it was because the upper sections of pipe were too cold.... well, when you increase pipe flow rate it keeps the upper pipe warmer and helps stop creosote build up.

 

I just don't know it all because its easy to think, okay if I'd only gotten 8 inch pipe instead of 6 it would have been a whole lot better, but then with the 8 inch pipe the flow would have been slowed, allowing the upper sections to run cooler and building up creosote.

 

I'm so happy now because it was a major problem of creosote build up for years. I mean it was really bad that no amount of super dry wood took care of it until I cut off and put that band in the garbage.

 

 

All things being equal;  the only thing you've done it to remove the substrate that the creosote is collecting on.  

 

If you've had goopy, wet creosote running down your chimney; IMHO, you need to re-evaluate your burning practices!!!

 

Just saying...............

[rancherman]

Hey,  all this  talk  of   'stoves'... anyone  have  a  wood fired  add on 'furnace'??   Not an outdoor deal,  but  one that is inside, and  ducted through the existing  ducts.     I'm  looking at the  'Shelter' brand   250k btu   furnace.    Menards  sells  them.      I'm already set up with  8 inch chimney,   and   their largest  should really have  the 10 inch.

[hex0rz]

For the newer EPA stoves;  they recommend <20% moisture in your CSS'ed firewood.  

 

If'n you're buying firewood that was split only a month or two or less than from the date it was delivered.....................it's not ready to burn...........aka, "seasoned"!!!!!

 

When I was cutting mid-summer, by the end of August, the wood would already be checked out and the meter would read 12%!

 

Up here, it seems like the softwoods dry very quickly when it gets full sun exposure...

[flagmanruss]

We are having unusually cold weather now.  Not record breaking but rare.  11 overnight last night & 0 forcast tonight.  Not above freezing during the days  Yesterday high of 20 or so. 

 

Kept the fire going.  We'd kept a smaller day time fire with frequent feedinig but it backfired when one time I let it get too low & it didn't catch.  So I kept a bigger fire yesterday.  Wife was unhappy I kept a bigger fire, used more wood & had to part close one damper.  I added more wood before she came home (she's usually tending fire these days) & I'd had to half close both Flue dampers (we have 2, one above the other in the pipe above the stove).   I think it's because of the greater temperature/ pressure differences top to bottom.  My theory remains that the lower outside stack height doesn't draws as hard under normal conditions.  But as I said, this is not our "normal". 

  

Anyrate, burning hotter seems to be greatly reducing the creasote buildup for the modified chimney. 

[Mopar1973Man]

Like again this morning build a fire in the main house room temperature is about 65*F inside and about 32*F outside. Built the fire come up stairs set the timer for 5-6 minutes. Then enjoy a bit of morning tea and the computer. DING! Go back down stairs and the stack pyrometer is about 1,400 to 1,600*F. Now close it down. Enjoy the rest of my morning. Now when I get done with my shower I step over to the stove and spin the air vents wide open again. While I'm getting dressed and finished up I'm monitoring the pyrometer to reach 1,600 again. Then shut it down. This method give the stack a good heating to get started. Then allow the entire stack to heat up and then cook it the second time. Sometimes I open it up again in the evenings and cook it once more before bedtime.

 

Bad part is even with all this I still end up plugging the top of the chimney in Jan or Feb. This year I might make it.

[MnTom]

32*?!?! Must be nice. It was 51* COLDER than that here when I got up at 6AM...... Never did get above zero today.

[JAG1]

All things being equal;  the only thing you've done it to remove the substrate that the creosote is collecting on.  

 

If you've had goopy, wet creosote running down your chimney; IMHO, you need to re-evaluate your burning practices!!!

 

Just saying...............

It used to be like that. It would run down outside the pipe even though the piping had the joints going the right way so goop stayed inside the piping as it ran down. I had no idea how it getting on the outside of the pipe    but, then bad creosote smell/ smoke in side the house. It was bad.

 

Burns good now and no problems.

 

 

32 degrees outside here too for the low. The coldest we ever had, was -5 and that was way out of our being used to it temps as it was so unusual for us.

Edited January 8, 2015 by JAG1

[joecool911]

Our largest woodstove is in and the basement. We have no central heating system to move air throughout the house. The stairs are only about 8' from the stove, but the heat really doesn't go upstairs very well. My only solution is to put a grate in the floor right above the stove. Not sure if a fan would be necessary too? Any other ideas? Maybe a second grate for return air in the other side of the room?

Edited January 9, 2015 by joecool911

[rancherman]

Our largest woodstove is in and the basement. We have no central heating system to move air throughout the house. The stairs are only about 8' from the stove, but the heat really doesn't go upstairs very well. My only solution is to put a grate in the floor right above the stove. Not sure if a fan would be necessary too? Any other ideas? Maybe a second grate for return air in the other side of the room?

My old farm house has an old Lennox wood furnace, circa 1930. It was strictly a gravity type ducted heating system. When we first moved on the place in 1982, it hadn't been fired for several years, and I really had no idea if it would work. Well, soon found out there was several expansion joints in the heat exchanger, which probably had a asbestos type rope jammed in. I used a similar type gasket for wood stoves, and took a chisel and pounded the new stuff into the joints.

This thing is pretty much solid boiler plate, riveted and bolted together... and it's surrounded by a sheetmetal duct. Hot air goes out the top into 6 ducts running thorough the house, and one huge duct bringing the cold air back. This air goes in the bottom of the sheetmetal... to be reheated and distributed.

When that thing first fired up, I was amazed at how much air was moving! it would actually 'blow your hair back'.. when standing over the in-floor grates!

That old house didn't have an ounce of insulation, but I could easily keep it 90 degrees in there on the coldest day... It just took wood like a herd of beavers..

Point being, Joe, with a little ingenuity, you could rig up a way to keep your lower/cold air from upstairs separate from the rising hot air.. and have a heck of a gravity system.

If you could use the stair well for your cold-downward moving air, and get the hot air rising and not mixing with the air coming down your stairs.. ( you'd probably need more than just cutting a hole in the floor, probably some sort of 'bonnet' over the stove to capture most of the rising heat, and then ducted/ funneled up into the house.

It's a snap to make this work when most of the heat is needed vertically.. you'll need fans upstairs to get it moved to further rooms.

My old house had it's hot air going up through the center of the house, and the cold air returns was along the outside walls. It did a fine job mixing the heat pretty evenly on it's own.