Head Gasket Replacement

[Cummin Dodge]

Found oil in the coolant so I pulled the head off this weekend and will be dropping the head off at the machine shop tomorrow. I was wondering what everyone though the best head gasket was to use. I now have 100 horse scheid injectors. and will be adding a hx40, ats exhaust manifold, and arp studs at this time. Truck will be sled pulled and drag raced some but also daily driven. Thanks

[Wild and Free]

Stock gasket, Scheid under rates their injector quite a bit too, hx 40 may not be enough tubo long term for any competion use. I ran those injectors for a bit before selling my 02, they burn raw at idle versus the 155 bd injectors had before them but they did run smooth overall.

[Deafautotech]

are you sure it is head gasket?? maybe oil cooler behind of oil filter??

[Yankneck696]

When assembled, you will need to flush out all contaminants from the cooling system. Do the radiator now. For that, I would suggest numerous runs of Simple Green (Less corrosioin possibility than Purple Power on aluminum). Use it at a SLIGHTLY higher concentration than suggested, as it NEEDS the water to help the sufficant dilutte/break up the oil.

As stated before, have the cooler checked.

Good time to do side cover gasket & possibly change to 12 valve cover.

Good time to gasket match the head on the exhaust side for small gains in flow & efficiency (Hotly debatable sometimes).

You also will need to flush out the block of contaminants, as the oils will hinder heat transfer. For the block I would now suggest Purple Power at a slightly LOWER concentration, as it is pretty corrosive.

Depending on condition, replace all coolant hoses.

As for gasket, most suggest stock Cummins & shy from Cometic. (Again, sometimes, hotly debated)

Ed

[AH64ID]

For pulling and racing I would consider the marine gasket to drop the CR a little bit, but either way only Cummins stuff.

[Wild and Free]

The best overall product for flushing oil sludge from a cooling system and the only one recommended by most diesel engine manufacturers is Cascade dish washer soap, but NOT the LEMON or any Citrus soap as the citrus degrades rubber seals in the system.

 

As posted above it will take several flushes, fill with soap and water nd get it hot to operating temp then drop and repeat 2-3 times at minimum.

[Yankneck696]

Never heard of the Cascade trick. We used to do a lot of marine engines with dilute purple power. I just know it's corrosive to Aluminum.

Ed

[Wild and Free]

The trick is to mix the powder soap in a bucket of warm water before pouring it into the cooling system. It works really good, have used this method on many heavy duty diesels over the years. Have tried other products and they don't work as well. Just remember to stay away from citrus cleaners inside the engine, I have been involved in repairing all the leaks that formed after coolant systems were flushed with soaps with citrus in them. Cat did a study that showed this to be the cause of seals leaking afterwards.

[mopartechnician]

They use cascade when they get fuel or oil in the cooling system on a locomotive. Can you imagine how much they use to treat 400 gallons of water? I think they flush it twice and then fill it again with the cascade water and then load test the motor for an hour. Then they drain it and fill it with water.

[Cummin Dodge]

Thanks y'all got some bad news from the machine shop today, my head is cracked in the exhaust valve seats in to many places so they can't fix them.

[Cummin Dodge]

Stock gasket, Scheid under rates their injector quite a bit too, hx 40 may not be enough tubo long term for any competion use. I ran those injectors for a bit before selling my 02, they burn raw at idle versus the 155 bd injectors had before them but they did run smooth overall.

Thanks just ordered the gasket today.  The injectors are for sure underated.  I got the hx 40 for cheap and couldn't pass up the deal, if neccessary I will turn the comp box down to keep from tearing it up once i get it ready.  I will just be doing a few county fair pulls with it most of the time its runnin it has my trailer behind it.

[Dieselfuture]

Our local machine shop been using a lot of victor rienz gaskets, but I think cummins knows what they're doing.

[moostang]

Thanks y'all got some bad news from the machine shop today, my head is cracked in the exhaust valve seats in to many places so they can't fix them.

I had the same problem with cracks in the exhaust seats.  I found a machine shop that could get a complete head from Cummins for just a little more than a rebuilt one. It had a lot of metal shavings in it from machine work so make sure you clean it well what ever you get.

[Dieselfuture]

I thought these engines were supposed to be one of the best, why so many problems with heads? Is there a way to tell if head is going bad without pulling it off? Aside from oil in coolant what else can you do to find out, and what can a guy do to prevent this from happening? Is this only if you're trying to get every last bit of power out of it? Or does it just happen with time.

[rancherman]

I thought these engines were supposed to be one of the best, why so many problems with heads? Is there a way to tell if head is going bad without pulling it off? Aside from oil in coolant what else can you do to find out, and what can a guy do to prevent this from happening? Is this only if you're trying to get every last bit of power out of it? Or does it just happen with time.

I'll try answering..       

'as designed'..  cummins is  top notch.....  It's  when  the  human element is  added  is  when  any engine  will  show  weaknesses... But still,  Cummins  is  easily  modded  without  enormous  collateral  damage/expense to  increase durability   It's amazing  what  is  getting  produced out of  these  without a thing being done to the  lower end!...    duramax and  powerstrokes  need   a  buttload of  cash just to keep the bottom end  intact.

You could  annually   check your   antifreeze  for  PH..   or  send a sample in to  be analyzed  for   change in PH  and/or  exhaust contamination      Early detection  won't make it live any longer,  but it may help you   prevent a  catastrophic  failure..   The  damage will already  be done  by then however...

When  I  see or hear about  exhaust seat/pocket   cracks or  deterioration,   one  thing  I  usually  think of is  improper  heat up/cool down.. especially in   competition  running...   or  too late fuel  injection....  improper/too late  water/meth  injection..   the list  can go on and on..

 

Cascade is  a  base..   it's very similar to the   detergent we used to use  in  milking pipelines.    Since  our   cooling systems  tend to run a  tad on the acid side,   going the  'other way'  with the ph  makes  a  great  scum remover... 

 

to answer you last  part,  yes..  it  can  happen to any engine  given enough time.

Edited April 14, 2014 by rancherman

[Cummin Dodge]

I thought these engines were supposed to be one of the best, why so many problems with heads? Is there a way to tell if head is going bad without pulling it off? Aside from oil in coolant what else can you do to find out, and what can a guy do to prevent this from happening? Is this only if you're trying to get every last bit of power out of it? Or does it just happen with time.

Sometimes the exhaust valve seats crack big enough the get into the cooling system passages on the head and it will use some coolant. Mine has used a little between oil changes but not much. Bottled stayed between full and add between oil changes or every 3k miles. Best thing to prevent is to keep your exhaust temps down.

Edited April 22, 2014 by Cummin Dodge

[Cummin Dodge]

The trick is to mix the powder soap in a bucket of warm water before pouring it into the cooling system. It works really good, have used this method on many heavy duty diesels over the years. Have tried other products and they don't work as well. Just remember to stay away from citrus cleaners inside the engine, I have been involved in repairing all the leaks that formed after coolant systems were flushed with soaps with citrus in them. Cat did a study that showed this to be the cause of seals leaking afterwards.

What rate of soap did you use for a gallon of water.  Simple green isn't cutting it.

[Wild and Free]

For our small cummins I would dilute about  a quarter or half a box of cascade at most, Most of our mine engines have a coolant capacity of 50-150 gallons, We just dissolve a full box full of cascade in a 5 gallon bucket of warm water and then pour it in and run the engine up to operating temp for about 10 minutes or even driver it a few miles to get it good and hot and then dump and flush and do this several times. We just went through this on a 24M Cat motor grader a few weeks ago due to a failed engine oil cooler and we had to flush it about a dozen times to get most of the oil out, we hooked a hose to the lower drain port and forced the oil residue out the top of the radiator tank as it floats on top anyhow versus letting it drain out the bottom and coat everything on the way down again.

Some times it helps to remove the t-stat during the initial few flushes.

 

If you have access to a hot water pressure washer use that first to blow as much oil out of things before starting the flush sequence.

[Mopar1973Man]

my head is cracked in the exhaust valve seats in to many places so they can't fix them.

 

 

what can a guy do to prevent this from happening?

 

Watch your EGT's keep them down below 1,200*F which is best.