Fuel Gelling with 2-stroke oil

[Yankneck696]

Here in the US, yes, the VP44 was a stopgap. But, it was used much earlier in europe (Along with the VP37). Over there, it is considered a very dependable pump.So dependable that Dieselmechen (Sweedish pump master) got rid of his test bench for them, as it just sat there.

 

It's also MUCH cheaper than Cps & CR injectors....

 

Ed

[rancherman]

very true,  But    European  Diesel fuels  are   like  caviar  compared to our  slop..

[AH64ID]

Have you tried it since you've done all your "mods"?...................... and especially since you've had to essentially "re-build" your Cummins??!!!

 

Just asking.................not arguing!!

I haven't. I am not sure it would make a difference thou.

 

 

Get the exhaust hotter and burn it off Just kidding! 

 

 

Haha.. many of the miles were towing, that's hot enough.

[Ironforger]

I typically don't suggest mixing products. Because some products negate the abilities of other products. 

 

Like PS is cetane boost and 2 cycle is a cetane reducer.

 

Like PS is typically more of a injector cleaner / cetane booster and 2 cycle oil is more of lubricant.

 

So mixing products might yield results less than favorable at times. If you use one product then you guaranteed success. Like if you stick to PS for anti-gel then the product will work properly without fail. But mixing with 2 cycle might create other issues. Becuase of how your changing the chemistry of the fuel.

Michael, I recall you mentioned this once before & I want to make sure I'm using the correct products without mixing and risk of canceling each other out.  What do you use in winter? It get's mighty cold in your area right?  I use howes lubricator. Do you feel howes is sufficient as an all in one product for both anti-gel and lubricity?

 

Thanks!

Edited February 13, 2015 by Ironforger

[Mopar1973Man]

Strange thing is I don't worry about cetane levels nor do I worry about pour point level. I only worry about lubricity. Now in 13 years I've never gelled up once. I'm very picky of fuel suppliers. Even with all the minus temps we get up here I've never had a issue with gelling up yet. To this day the only thing I use is just the 2 cycle oil.

 

[AH64ID]

The only time I worry about gelling is elk season. It's too early for most stations to start winterizing and I am 65 miles of dirt from town and it can get quite cold at 6-9K feet in October.

That's also the only time of year I worry about cetane, and actually bump it by 3 points. I spend 7-10 days without going over 20-30% load and the cetane is great for that kind of use. It also helps it start faster, which isn't bad when in the boonies. Not that my truck starts slow, I just like the added insurance.

Now a couple years ago I was messing around with Cetane and a 7 point increase on a warm day would knock like a rod with a cold motor.

[rancherman]

Strange thing is I don't worry about cetane levels nor do I worry about pour point level. I only worry about lubricity. Now in 13 years I've never gelled up once. I'm very picky of fuel suppliers. Even with all the minus temps we get up here I've never had a issue with gelling up yet. To this day the only thing I use is just the 2 cycle oil.

 

 

 

 

I wonder if   by keeping the   fuel  totally clear,  (Howes, Ps, etc)   if  that is  what they call   'improved  lubricity'.     After all,      when  the  wax is  stuck to the  side of the filter,  it sure ain't going to the IP! 

 

I wonder if  Mikes  NON use of  additives   have helped with his  longevity too?     I know  for  years  that  as  soon as  we'd start blending #1   for  winter  use,   we knew we were  cutting our   pump life down.      #1  fuel,  kero,  all make  pretty dang good  parts  cleaners! 

[Ironforger]

Strange thing is I don't worry about cetane levels nor do I worry about pour point level. I only worry about lubricity. Now in 13 years I've never gelled up once. I'm very picky of fuel suppliers. Even with all the minus temps we get up here I've never had a issue with gelling up yet. To this day the only thing I use is just the 2 cycle oil.

 

Wow, that's freaking cold!  Without a doubt your fuel supplier must be adding an anti gel?

[Mopar1973Man]

Wow, that's freaking cold!  Without a doubt your fuel supplier must be adding an anti gel?

 

I've gone from store to store and did my own digging. That's how I got this picture of the barrels of anti-gel or called PPD (Pour Point Depressant) behind a local Cenex Station. Like I said I'm rather fussy about where I get fuel. Like just down the road from me is Pinehurst Trading Post at 3/4 miles. I won't even buy diesel there if was cheaper. I know the fuel is not properly treated, low volume of sales, pump isn't filtered. Etc. But I know the local Chevron has to meet a certain requirements of standards. Below is the weather camera near me and I can see what I got for weather.

 

South of me by 10 miles.

http://lb.511.idaho.gov/idlb/cameras/camera.jsf?id=27&view=state&text=m&textOnly=false

 

North of Me by 5 miles.

http://lb.511.idaho.gov/idlb/cameras/camera.jsf?id=142&view=state&text=m&textOnly=false

 

[dorkweed]

Like Mike, I've never had a gelling issue with my truck.  In temps as low as -18*F and not getting above 0*F for days straight.  My only additive has been 2 stroke oil in the cold months.

 

I also believe that a lift pump that will put out some pressure helps keep fuel flowing.  Keep your VP44 and CP3 safe with a quality regulator and and make sure you get a pretty good supply and return flow/volume from whatever pump you use.  

[TFaoro]

I'm jealous of all of your fuel stations.... I can't find a manager here at a station that knows what the heck is going on with their fuel. All I get is "The tankers come and dump it in. We don't do anything to it that I know of."

[Ironforger]

I'm jealous of all of your fuel stations.... I can't find a manager here at a station that knows what the heck is going on with their fuel. All I get is "The tankers come and dump it in. We don't do anything to it that I know of."

Well at least you get a coherent response.  At my local station, they don't speak english and they don't know the diffference between gas and diesel. Here in NJ, it's illegal to pump your own fuel, the attendants must do it. Yet I pump my own no matter what, otherwise I would end up with a tank full of gasoline. Especially in my TDI diesel VW.

Edited February 13, 2015 by Ironforger

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm jealous of all of your fuel stations.... I can't find a manager here at a station that knows what the heck is going on with their fuel. All I get is "The tankers come and dump it in. We don't do anything to it that I know of."

 

I've got a few of those around here. But then we got a few that actual post up the pour point temps of the fuel too.

 

 

What shocks me more than anything its like Idaho is on it own planet for diesel fuel and all the other states just don't give a rats   about fuel quality.

[AH64ID]

Even under pressure the gelling will occur. It has happened to me once (B20 -8°F, long story)... but the first unheated filter inline is where is will plug. That can be a 2um or a 144um filter.

[Wild and Free]

Here in the US, yes, the VP44 was a stopgap. But, it was used much earlier in europe (Along with the VP37). Over there, it is considered a very dependable pump.So dependable that Dieselmechen (Sweedish pump master) got rid of his test bench for them, as it just sat there.

 

It's also MUCH cheaper than Cps & CR injectors....

 

Ed

Wifes 03 VW Jetta TDI has a VP pump on it and has about 280K on it as well as the injectors although it is about due for a set of nozzles "Holding off spending money on it now, want to be rid of it this summer / fall for something newer" and it has rarely seen any additives at all if any it has seen a few tanks a year of Amsoil diesel treat additive, no issues as of yet with it and regular 20K miles fuel filter changes as recommended by VW, been running Hastings oil and fuel filters since it had 30K on it when I bought it. There has been an occasional Wix thrown in about once a year depending on where I am when picking up parts.

[rancherman]

Well at least you get a coherent response.  At my local station, they don't speak english and they don't know the diffference between gas and diesel. Here in NJ, it's illegal to pump your own fuel, the attendants must do it. Yet I pump my own no matter what, otherwise I would end up with a tank full of gasoline. Especially in my TDI diesel VW.

LOL!

First time I filled my Jeep CRD,   little ol lady came bombing out of the store yelling  " MISTER, MISTER!!  YOU CAN'T PUT DIESEL  IN THAT CAR!!!"      It was a hoot!

[dorkweed]

Even under pressure the gelling will occur. It has happened to me once (B20 -8°F, long story)... but the first unheated filter inline is where is will plug. That can be a 2um or a 144um filter.

 

 

Is that in reference to my above post???

[Mopar1973Man]

AH64ID Sounds like you got a tank of fuel from over in Ontario if I'm not mistaken? I can't remember the B level Oregon mandated.

 

Well anyways the biodiesel is more prone to separate from the petroleum part and the bio settles to the bottom like old bacon grease. Typically solidifies sooner that petroleum diesel.

[klcammie]

X2 ^^^

 

Been doing it  with  several  brands..  howes,  PS to name  a couple.   

The only thing that makes me  'frown'  is  the  cost of  putting it in!!  LOL         Never seen any   'ill effects'... such as    the fuel turning into  manure..  

Try FPPF one 8 oz bottle treats 200 gal. and only cost 7.99 or 8.99. Been using it for 25 years no problems.

[rancherman]

AH64ID Sounds like you got a tank of fuel from over in Ontario if I'm not mistaken? I can't remember the B level Oregon mandated.

 

Well anyways the biodiesel is more prone to separate from the petroleum part and the bio settles to the bottom like old bacon grease. Typically solidifies sooner that petroleum diesel.

This is   part  of  me and my neighbors  problems  with our   winter woes.     We get fuel from  tank wagons  that have delivered  all types of  fuel  all summer.    And their  fuel is  stored in  12k  vertical  tanks.   No  tank is   designated  'bio only'    I gotta believe  when  a  transport comes in,     fuel goes  where  fuel fits!    I've  had more than one load of  French fry  smelling   fuel.     

Our  delivery guy  just  hates  the  stuff..     Cold  season  fuel it ain't!