Manual Trans Conversion - Seeking Advice/Tips/Issues/etc

[notlimah]

I'm excited to hear about your experience with this!

[NightHawk]

Well...I have decided to breakout my list of parts thru a few different vendors to save some cash & have a clutch question.  I need a flywheel (obviously) and am looking at the 13" "conversion" kit from valair.  I was going to get the "stock" hp clutch kit  NMU70279-5SCE but wanted to know some thoughts.  My truck will remain same hp combo as I am doing this conversion to make it more fun to drive for me (no necessarily faster).  I would like an exhaust brake in the future so that is the only reason I am considering the next kit up  NMU70279-01-5SCE  but its more aggressive which doesn't sound appealing (been there/done that with a muscle car).

 

[Mopar1973Man]

I know that some members will suggest you consider South bend clutch. Talk to @Dripley about his experience.

[TFaoro]

I would step up to this kit: http://www.southbendclutch.com/13-1.25.html

I am very biased with clutches and strongly prefer South Bend over Valair. I had a valair for a while and was not impressed. On the other hand I've watched the south bend hold significantly more power than its rated for, while not wearing out fast. The performance shop down by me won't even install Valair clutches anymore after he had to warrantee 3 of them.

 

As for the need, a stock one would probably hold, but any time you have a power bump (TS-MVP) it's a good idea to go with a stronger clutch.

[NightHawk]

The southbend clutches are very overpriced and there seems to be quite a bit of complaints over noise/driveability (too grabby).  

 

Could you explain why you did not like your Valair clutch?  I don't drive very miles a yr (last yr was 3800) so wear longevity is not a major concern of mine.

 

I Valair has major function problems will prob go with a Luk Pro Gold before a southbend.

[BBHD]

I also ran that same SB in my old 99' and loved it. It drove just like stock pretty much but held the added power. Just my 

[98whitelightnin]

I would go with a good organic Valair rated for a little more hp than you plan on making. I had a ceramic DD from Valair and although it was jumpy, it was a good clutch and didn't slip. I should have gone with an organic with mine but thought I was gonna make 600+ hp for some reason.?

Edited June 18, 2016 by 98whitelightnin

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm running a Southbend Con OFE and its holding close to 400 HP and 1000 FT/LBS. Very good street manner and not grabby at all. Sad part is the clutch holding up to the abuse but the main shaft of the transmission broke.

 

http://www.southbendclutch.com/13-1.25.html

 

Quote

This kit comes with a flywheel, re-drilled and refaced to accept the larger clutch and is rated to handle up to 400 horsepower & 800 ft. lbs. of torque.

 

 

Edited June 18, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[NightHawk]

I am trying to get some insight on the new floor opening for the shiftier.  Could a current manual trans owner provide some dimensions from the back of the block (start of bellhousing) to the trans shifter hole along with the width?

 

As of clutch, going with an organic style with a low hp rating to keep pedal effort/easy of use in the friendly area.  I should have explained more, but where I currently live the amount of weekend traffic with visitors has traffic sometimes stop/go for 3-5miles, which with a grabby/heavy pedal clutch is painful !

[Mopar1973Man]

At least my setup I'm still using stock hydros so the pedal effort is no different from stock to now. I can't speak for other clutch or people.

[leathermaneod]

I have a Valair that I am happy with so far. It's not grabby at all. I've only had it for about 8k though. It is a 13" upgrade and the one rated for 400hp and 900tq, I don't remember the model number. I Believe the reason @dripley had issues with his is because of all the heavy towing he does. I remeber talking to him about it and he had the same clutch as I got. It's not a towing clutch. Not to say you can't tow with it, but it's not meant for constant heavy towing. I talked to DAP about it and they like valair better than SB over there. Just my  btw please correct me if I'm wrong dripley 

[leathermaneod]

Forgot something else I wanted to mention. If you are doing all the work of a auto to manual swap, I would seriously consider either the NV5600 or, better yet, the G56.....

[TFaoro]

On ‎6‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 1:16 PM, NightHawk said:

The southbend clutches are very overpriced and there seems to be quite a bit of complaints over noise/driveability (too grabby).  

 

Could you explain why you did not like your Valair clutch?  I don't drive very miles a yr (last yr was 3800) so wear longevity is not a major concern of mine.

 

I Valair has major function problems will prob go with a Luk Pro Gold before a southbend.

You get what you pay for.... South Bend is high quality.

The grabby clutches are the dual discs and ceramics. They are made to hold big power, and that's just the nature of them.

 

That said, I dropped a Luk 13" upgrade in a 98 12v last week and was impressed. The clutch looked good and felt good driving around. It would probably be just fine with a small programmer.

 

My old transmission is laying on the floor, so I can give you those dimensions. It'll be from the front of the bell housing (where it bolts to the adapter) front and rear of the shifter. If I have time, I can pull the plastic and measure the actual hole in the floor.

[leathermaneod]

35 minutes ago, TFaoro said:

You get what you pay for.... South Bend is high quality.

The grabby clutches are the dual discs and ceramics. They are made to hold big power, and that's just the nature of them.

 

That said, I dropped a Luk 13" upgrade in a 98 12v last week and was impressed. The clutch looked good and felt good driving around. It would probably be just fine with a small programmer.

 

My old transmission is laying on the floor, so I can give you those dimensions. It'll be from the front of the bell housing (where it bolts to the adapter) front and rear of the shifter. If I have time, I can pull the plastic and measure the actual hole in the floor.

I certainly agree that in many instances you get what you pay for, but sb's prices seem a little over the top to me. Plus I think the "upgraded hydros" are pretty much nonsense. All they are is the 94-97 master and slave with a stainless steel line, and they are twice the price of a set from autozone. Time will tell how well my valair holds up. Fred at DAP even told me he prefers to sell Valair because he likes dealing with them better for warrant issues. I don't have any first hand experience to back this up, other than the short amount of time I've had my valair, but it just seems crazy to me to pay SB prices unless maybe you are sled pulling or hauling heavy non stop with your rig. Then we also have Katoom's example of the throw out bearing that came with his SB clutch failing at 5k miles. Again I don't mean to put SB down necessarily, just seems they are way over priced for most guys applications. Honestly if I had it to do over I probably would put a LUK 13" in mine just because it would have been cheaper lol. I say that because the clutch that came out of my truck was a LUK and I know had been used hard and it wasn't even worn out, pilot bearing was bad though. Again, these are all just my opinions and what I've observed going though the research for myself with this stuff. 

[NightHawk]

The main thing i am looking for is a good solid clutch and flywheel combo that matches my trucks power.  I dont want to under clutch or worse over clutch the truck. What's the part number for the Luk's kit or do you have a link?

 

I am prob 300hp at the crank with the TSmvp turned all the way up but I don't drive the truck hard or tow heavy. I am deciding between the Valair and a Phoenix Friction as they have nice kits that meet the trucks power.

[leathermaneod]

I do not have any info on the LUK kit, but I'm sure you can find everything online or by talking to Napa. I pretty much looked between Valair and SB and decided on Valair. The only thing that was kinda weird about Valair, and I believe I've seen the same thing with SB in pictures, is that while the clutch material has a larger outer diameter(13" upgrade), it also has a larger inner diameter so it gives the illusion of having less clutch material. But I don't think that's actually the case. I hope that makes sense?

[TFaoro]

Here's what I dropped in the other day: http://www.napaonline.com/napa/en/p/NCF1105178/NCF1105178_0208984976

Looked like a quality kit and felt good when I did some driving with it.

[joecool911]

I'd recommend upgrading the throw out bearing. Just to avoid removal again if it fails...anything with bearings...go USA made.

[dripley]

I did have the same Valair clutch that Leathermaneod has and was not satisfied with it at all. Very grabby and the throw out bearing went at 70k requiring replacement. Maybe a bad install but i think not. I now have a SB and am very happy with it. I did tow with the Valair maybe 3k miles a year. I move my 5th wheel 4 or 5 times a year from one job to another.

 

That being said I also towed the same 5th wheel on the oe clutch for about 6 years. This was with the Banks stinger plus system that was rated at an additional 75 rwhp. Never knew what to make that and had no issues with it the whole time it was on there. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[joecool911]

Even if you tow...a lot depends on your driving habits. Going 65 mph up a 15% slope with a 5th wheel is different than getting down in a lower gear and keeping your rpms up. And going 45. Keep her at 2,200 rpms. Not lugging in overdrive. When I tow my heaviest loads I gear down and run at 2,200 or so. 

Edited June 22, 2016 by joecool911