Let's talk about shocks.

[Tractorman]

6 hours ago, LiveOak said:

I didn't realize it until I called Bilstein today but the 4600 shocks come with a limited life time warranty.

 

I have 73,000 miles on four Bilstein 4600 shocks and they are still working vey well today. 

 

- John

[Stormin08]

the 4600 if i recall were lifetime....the 5100 is limited lifetime due to being considered an OFFROAD shock.

 

one in the same, but the 5100 offers longer lengths

[NIsaacs]

14 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

The only shock I would mention is the Monroe shocks are of low quality. I've got those on my 1996 Dodge Ram 1500 now and they are well too bouncy and don't dampen enough.  

 

Which Monroe's? The Magnums and gas Grande are lifetime warranty. I usually change mine out about every 100K, just because.... Like now, they seem fine but they are getting old, so I am looking at the Napa Reflex with lifetime warranty, again just because

I don't use the warranty because I really can't say they are bad, just get tired of looking at them. Just like my front brakes, after all my tire rotations and inspecting the pads, I usually get tired of looking at them and change them @ around 30%. I figure in an emergency more pad is better. Still on the original rotors and calipers.

[LiveOak]

2 hours ago, Stormin08 said:

the 4600 if i recall were lifetime....the 5100 is limited lifetime due to being considered an OFFROAD shock.

 

one in the same, but the 5100 offers longer lengths

The 5100's is limited lifetime warranty:

 

https://productdeskapi.cart.bilsteinus.com/media/products/bilstein/limitedlifetimewarranty.pdf

 

The 5160's come with a 90 day warranty:

 

https://productdeskapi.cart.bilsteinus.com/media/products/bilstein/limited90daywarranty.pdf

2 hours ago, NIsaacs said:

 

Which Monroe's? The Magnums and gas Grande are lifetime warranty. I usually change mine out about every 100K, just because.... Like now, they seem fine but they are getting old, so I am looking at the Napa Reflex with lifetime warranty, again just because

I don't use the warranty because I really can't say they are bad, just get tired of looking at them. Just like my front brakes, after all my tire rotations and inspecting the pads, I usually get tired of looking at them and change them @ around 30%. I figure in an emergency more pad is better. Still on the original rotors and calipers.

My brakes still had about 75% pad left on the original OEM pads but the pistons ceased up inside the caliper and the brakes were overheating on every trip.  I ended up replacing the rotors, calipers, pads, hoses, and brake fluid.  I think allowing the truck to set for long periods of time without use is about as bad as any other kind of abuse now.  If you don't use it, you lose it.  

[Mopar1973Man]

If you would have just changed out the brake fluid that would of all needed to be done. When the brake starts to absorb water from the air it starts to oxidize in the system causing the pistons to stick. So just changing brake fluid and disassembling the calipers and cleaning them out would have done way more good. The problem is all the debris is drop in the bottom of the caliper and the bleeder screw is on top. 

[LiveOak]

5 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

If you would have just changed out the brake fluid that would of all needed to be done. When the brake starts to absorb water from the air it starts to oxidize in the system causing the pistons to stick. So just changing brake fluid and disassembling the calipers and cleaning them out would have done way more good. The problem is all the debris is drop in the bottom of the caliper and the bleeder screw is on top. 

Changing the brake fluid was the first thing I did followed by freeing up the calipers but they heated up yet again in a test drive.  These brakes got so hot that smoke was just pouring out of the wheel wells on several occasions before I realized that this was not just a unusual instance of overheating.  At least 3 or 4 times on long trips.  There was no way to know it was happening until we stopped for at our destination or for a break that we noticed the smoke.  I was concerned that the seals and other components in the brake calipers were just fried so I replaced everything.  Still not bad after almost 17 years of reliable performance.  

[Mopar1973Man]

1 minute ago, LiveOak said:

followed by freeing up the calipers but they heated up yet again

 

When the calipers are removed and the pistons removed. Now remove the seal and test fit the piston back in the caliper. The piston should drop to the bottom without being PUSHED. If the piston is hanging up then you have to lightly sand off the caked up brake fluid or just replace the pistons. Just working the piston in and out doesn't remove the debris in the bottoms of the piston cylinders which will cause them to bind again. Like seen here the piston falls to the bottom easy without the seals in place. 

 

 

The only time I've seen brake hoses come to play is when people run brake fluid like a lifetime time fluid. Now the fluid is BLACK and the rubber has degraded from the excessive amount of moisture in the fluid. Now this debris is typically settling in the bottom of everything and the calipers and there is no amount of bleeding going to remove that. You need to open all 4 calipers and clean and check everything.

[LiveOak]

5 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

When the calipers are removed and the pistons removed. Now remove the seal and test fit the piston back in the caliper. The piston should drop to the bottom without being PUSHED. If the piston is hanging up then you have to lightly sand off the caked up brake fluid or just replace the pistons. Just working the piston in and out doesn't remove the debris in the bottoms of the piston cylinders which will cause them to bind again. Like seen here the piston falls to the bottom easy without the seals in place. 

 

 

The only time I've seen brake hoses come to play is when people run brake fluid like a lifetime time fluid. Now the fluid is BLACK and the rubber has degraded from the excessive amount of moisture in the fluid. Now this debris is typically settling in the bottom of everything and the calipers and there is no amount of bleeding going to remove that. You need to open all 4 calipers and clean and check everything.

Guilty as charged!  LOL!  My life since buying the truck has been a roller coaster.  STILL NO excuse for not changing the brake fluid in almost 17 years.  Yet another I made the decision to just replace everything.  When I DID replace the brake fluid, it came out VERY dark and smelled like strong ammonia.  I cannot begin to imagine what the insides of the entire brake system must have looked like, especially the brake hoses.  I bought a set of speed bleeders to try out on the wife's truck so I can change the fluid without help.  I will be changing the fluid every 2 years from hear on out.  

[Mopar1973Man]

4 minutes ago, LiveOak said:

I will be changing the fluid every 2 years from hear on out.

 

30k miles or once a year would be best. Brake fluid is hygroscopic in other words absorbs moisture from the air. As the moisture level builds in the fluid the boiling point of the brake fluid goes down. Then the other side is more moisture the more oxidation it will do inside the plumbing.

 

Again you need to open up the system and inspect not just push the debris into the bottom of the calipers. This is why bleeding should only happen after the calipers are cleaned and the system is already empty. 

Edited November 20, 2018 by Mopar1973Man

[KATOOM]

I wouldnt run a set of KYB Monomax if you gave them to me...  Worst riding, stiffest, shocks I've ever had.

 

I've had these Rancho 9000's on my truck for the past 15 years or so.  The fronts have only been adjusted once but the backs get adjusted to setting 9 every time I hook up to my 5th wheel and back to 2 when I put it away.

 

That said, I cant speak for Rancho's quality today.  Cutting corners tends to be common in todays very competitive economic system...

[NIsaacs]

20 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

30k miles or once a year would be best. Brake fluid is hygroscopic in other words absorbs moisture from the air. As the moisture level builds in the fluid the boiling point of the brake fluid goes down. Then the other side is more moisture the more oxidation it will do inside the plumbing.

 

Again you need to open up the system and inspect not just push the debris into the bottom of the calipers. This is why bleeding should only happen after the calipers are cleaned and the system is already empty. 

 

Are you saying you change out your fluid every year and disassemble all components front and rear?

 

I change my fluid with a front brake pad job (twice) it is due now but the brakes last so dang long....I have never disassembled any part of my system and it is not likely that I ever will.

[Mopar1973Man]

4 hours ago, NIsaacs said:

Are you saying you change out your fluid every year and disassemble all components front and rear?

 

Yes sir. Typically I find that the piston start caking fluid from the hot days and heavy panic braking. Then I can re-tune the pistons to fit the caliper bodies. Seal kits are super cheap like $8 to rebuild a caliper yourself as long as there no pitting or rust forming. Being I started having fluid weeping on the rear calipers during MoparMom hospital time I just replaced the calipers on the rear and didn't bother with rebuilding also signs of rust damage too. 

 

I've still got my factory front calipers. No issues with them. Still got my factory rotors yet too. Only done 1 set of brake pads at 185k miles. I'm just about 177k miles on these brake pads. I've done the brake fluid flush last year but didn't tear down. I need to do it this year for sure very soon my brake fluid is already darkening. If a flush again now I'm sure all the debris will drop to the bottom of the calipers and bind up the pistons. Since most of the debris is heavier than brake fluid the only way to get it all out is pull the pistons and hose them out with brake cleaner. Sad but true. 

[LiveOak]

To hopefully simplify the task of brake fluid changing I have ordered a set of Dorman 12701 Quick Bleeders.  Probably very similar to speed bleeders.  

 

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/rnb-12701

 

I have a pressure bleeder but it will not pressure bleed the front brakes due to the valving in the system with the ABS without either holding a relief valve open or pumping the brakes.  I just hook up the entire pressure bleed system to the truck and fill up the reservoir to the maximum level with brake fluid, pressurize, and then open each bleeder port.  The rears pressure bleed "OK" but very slowly the Quick Bleeders will hopefully allow me to aid & speed up the process.  Being able to push out old brake fluid with a LOT more pressure and volume helps to push out a lot of deposits and trash that builds up in the brake system over time.  At least, that is what I am shooting for.  I will post my results using them when I have changed the fluid on the wife's truck. 

[LiveOak]

Just wanted to follow up on the shock install.  I went with the Bilstein 4600 shocks.  I had some lengthy discussion with the tech support guys at Bilstein and they were VERY animated in their position that I would NOT be happy with the 5100's or the 5160's as they were designed for trucks that have been lifted and have a notably softer damping rate than the 4600's that were designed for stock trucks with stock suspensions.  

 

I am soooooooooooooooo glad that I listened to them.  I cannot begin to describe the difference and improvement in the ride of the wife's truck!  I still cannot believe that shocks could have that much influence on how the truck rides but they DO.  It is like driving a totally different truck and reminds me of how it drove when it was new only it is just a bit firmer ride which is fine with me.  My back is sooooooooooooooooo much happier riding around in the truck now.  I guess I didn't realize how bad the ride had become over the years.  The ONLY benefit of the way these truck rode before changing out the shocks was that they helped to dislodge kidney stones and help me to pass them faster. LOL!  

 

So, here is a case in which buying the most expensive item was not the best choice.  The cheapest shocks turned out to be the best although I can't actually judge how the 5100 and 5160 shocks would have performed since I did not actually install and try them out.  

 

I am real happy with the Bilstein 4600's.  

[AH64ID]

Pretty much exactly how I feel about the 5100’s! I wished I had installed them sooner. 

 

I would not call the 5100’s soft by any means, they are firmer than stock, and I wouldn’t want them any firmer. They are perfect from 8K GVW thru 12K GVW. 

 

Maybe my 1” lift qualifies me as lifted? Thou I run stock springs at all 4 corners, plus the airbags. 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2018 by AH64ID

[notlimah]

12 hours ago, AH64ID said:

Maybe my 1” lift qualifies me as lifted? Thou I run stock springs at all 4 corners, plus the airbags. 

 

Yea I was wondering the same for mine as I have a 1in spacer but all stock springs. I may need to get ahold of bilstein and see what they’d suggest.

[AH64ID]

1 minute ago, notlimah said:

 

Yea I was wondering the same for mine as I have a 1in spacer but all stock springs. I may need to get ahold of bilstein and see what they’d suggest.

 

I'd be curious what they tell you. 

[Mopar1973Man]

I'm pleased with the KYB's I've installed on my truck nice ride and handling quite well. 

[notlimah]

3 hours ago, AH64ID said:

 

I'd be curious what they tell you. 

 

I'll keep you posted with anything I hear.

[dave110]

On 11/19/2018 at 7:01 PM, dave110 said:

I'm going through this right now too to replace my Rancho's. Like @AH64ID I will never buy them again. I bought them to replace whatever was on due to a bounce issue and they were no better than what I took off. I should have sent them back. And the finish was terrible. After 3-4 years  they are rusted worse than the rest of the 20 year old truck. Not impressed at all. So after thoroughly confusing myself with the many choices on Rock Auto I narrowed it down to KYB and Gabriel Max controls. I went with the Gabriel because it looked like a better shock for the money IMHO. Time will tell how they work out.

FWIW to everyone I put the Gabriels on and have a few hundred miles on them. The difference was immediately evident. WOW! As of now I am very happy and would recommend them. Time will tell how they hold up.