AC Replacement

[mmoyle]

Hi All,

 

I have an 02 2500 6sp diesel truck that has a bad AC compressor that I plan on replacing.  I decided to buy the kit from rock auto that contains the compressor, condenser, orifice tube, accumulator, and some seals.  I figured since the truck has the original components and the kit was not bad in price, I would just install the new kit.

 

This is the first time I am replacing items like and I want to make sure I do this properly and don't screw things up. Not willing to pay the prices to have others install these components.  I have been doing my research and I think I have everything I need, but I have a few questions I was hoping you guys could help with:

 

1. Pag Oil - Since I am replacing the compressor, condenser, accumulator, and orifice tube, it was a little unclear to me how much PAG Oil I should be adding to the components.  I found a section in the service manual that states the following:

 

Refrigerant Oil Capacities

A/C System  6.2oz
Accumulator  2oz
Condenser 1oz
Evaporator 2oz
Compressor- drain and measure the oil from the old compressor.

 

When an air conditioning system is assembled at the factory, all components except the compressor are refrigerant oil free. After the refrigerant system has been charged and operated, the  refrigerant oil in the compressor is dispersed throughout the refrigerant system. The accumulator, evaporator, condenser, and compressor will each retain a significant amount of the needed refrigerant oil.

 

1a. So, where I get confused is if I need to add oil to the accumulator and condenser separately or will the oil get dispersed throughout the system?

1b. When replacing the compressor, should I measure the amount of oil that comes out of the old compressor and only put that amount back into the new compressor?  What is there was some oil loss over time?  Not sure if that was the case, but just a question I had.

 

Once I replace all the components and vacuum test the system, I plan on taking it to a AC shop to have them recharge the system for me with the proper 1.87 lbs of refrigerant.

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Mike

 

 

[Ed ke6bnl]

you do not have to add to each component the oil is carried around with the refrigerant I would add what is needed for the accumulator condenser and measure what your can remove from the compressor. pressurize and check for leaks and evacuate and charge. You can add gas to get the pressure up  then you can add to the low side to charge you may have to jumper the low pressure switch to cycle it on. good luck.

[Bullet]

I used a vacuum pump and gauge set from one of the auto parts stores on the loaner program...saved a bunch of $.  Instead of pressuring the system I pulled a vacuum and let sit for 30 mins to check for leaks.  I would do what @Ed ke6bnlsaid fill the new accumulator and condenser to spec and measure what comes out of the compressor to match.  It's not a hard job just take your time and make sure all your connections are done right and you won't have any leaks.

[wil440]

Vac 100 times more than you think is good especially if it's not a brand new unfilled system, I used to work for Caterpillar. Large repairs on the backhoe line in the UK straight off of the line, which was taken away from Clayton (sorry not my deal) standard work was vac for 15 minutes, then when backhoes came back to PDI and repair A/C wouldn't reach temps, Vac for 15 fill back up and the same deal in 2 days, if vac is applied and the gas is removed then the drier (thats what it's called here) looks like a bomb gets covered in frost as the moisture in the system is boiled off and it takes heat from it's surroundings to boil in the lower pressures hence the frost, this pressure increase can and does look like a vac leak, gas is gone and pressure is at a minus, you're checking gauges looking for an increase to signify a vac leak and the pressure goes up....... system has to have a leak.... NO not until the drier is frost free this is the point when there is no more moisture in the system which as it boils is just a gas

not meaning to tell your granny how to suck eggs as you guys know more about A/C than us in the cold UK, although today it's been 38C here

[dripley]

1 hour ago, wil440 said:

Vac 100 times more than you think is good especially if it's not a brand new unfilled system, I used to work for Caterpillar. Large repairs on the backhoe line in the UK straight off of the line, which was taken away from Clayton (sorry not my deal) standard work was vac for 15 minutes, then when backhoes came back to PDI and repair A/C wouldn't reach temps, Vac for 15 fill back up and the same deal in 2 days, if vac is applied and the gas is removed then the drier (thats what it's called here) looks like a bomb gets covered in frost as the moisture in the system is boiled off and it takes heat from it's surroundings to boil in the lower pressures hence the frost, this pressure increase can and does look like a vac leak, gas is gone and pressure is at a minus, you're checking gauges looking for an increase to signify a vac leak and the pressure goes up....... system has to have a leak.... NO not until the drier is frost free this is the point when there is no more moisture in the system which as it boils is just a gas

not meaning to tell your granny how to suck eggs as you guys know more about A/C than us in the cold UK, although today it's been 38C here

From what I have read your getting a bit heat wave over there, 85f and about 50% humidity here in Georgia today. Right nice.

[wil440]

Yes 2nd hottest day ever recorded here hottest was in 2003, it was down to tenths of a degree though, we're usually seeing 70's tops  which is just right not 90's, its horrible but supposed to cool today

[Bullet]

You guys don't know how good you got it.  Only time we get below 90s here is when a hurricane is coming through...and our record temps are in the triple digits.  Mid 70's are the night time lows.  Humidity level is rarely below the temperature...even at night.  Heat and humidity is just part of life here on the TX gulf coast.  But the fishing sure is good though. 

[wil440]

29 minutes ago, Bullet said:

You guys don't know how good you got it.  Only time we get below 90s here is when a hurricane is coming through...and our record temps are in the triple digits.  Mid 70's are the night time lows.  Humidity level is rarely below the temperature...even at night.  Heat and humidity is just part of life here on the TX gulf coast.  But the fishing sure is good though. 

But you are geared up for it..... A/C everywhere. I spent a month in Waco about 7 or 8 years ago, I'm baking but the guys I'm working with who live in Waco had their coats on. And said it was too cold to put the Big *** Fans on in the roof,they actually had the building heating on in the mornings ?This was at a caterpillar distribution warehouse. Thing is here in the UK we get temperate so not hot and not cold..... just nice.. when we do get outside the norm either up or down country justs stops working right ☺

[Bullet]

From what I understand the UK has had troubles working right during any temperature?  But it sounds like things will be improving soon though...with the recent election. 

 

Yes A/C is mandatory here.  And it is everywhere that women assimilate...otherwise the complaining would be unbearable.  It's already bad enough with the A/C.  But real men still do without on many jobs and activities.  Things only shut down here during hurricanes.

 

Those guys at the Caterpillar warehouse sound like softer men...which is dangerously close to being a woman.  But that seems to be a trend these days. 

[dripley]

4 hours ago, Bullet said:

You guys don't know how good you got it.  Only time we get below 90s here is when a hurricane is coming through...and our record temps are in the triple digits.  Mid 70's are the night time lows.  Humidity level is rarely below the temperature...even at night.  Heat and humidity is just part of life here on the TX gulf coast.  But the fishing sure is good though. 

Trust me I know how good it is right now. It has been in the mid 90's and high humidity since June. Just a little cool weather we lucked out on. Its not going to last long. Heat and hunidity is just part living in the SE.

[Mopar1973Man]

Back to the OP. @mmoyle

 

I would normally just fill the compressor with the amount of oil  through the fill plug in the side of the body. Being your replacing so much just fill the compressor and then install. Replace the seals as you go makes sure to put a bit of oil and all fresh seals. Then pull a vacuum and test for leaks. If it holds exactly the same amount of vacuum for over 5 to 10 minutes I typically just start charging the system. I typically just put the full 3 cans (12 ozs) to a 2nd Gen Dodge. That will get just about right a bit over charged but no harm typically.

 

 

[CUMMINSDIESELPWR]

i need to replace the stuff on mine, compressor wont engage at all even when hooked directly to the battery (solenoid coil open) let us know how the rock auto stuff works as ill be going this route too

[dripley]

I rebuilt mine soley with parts off of RA. Compressor, lines, drier, and condenser. It has been holding up fine for the past 2 years. Got the evaporator from RA 6 years ago maybe.

[Gregturley]

Something I haven't seen mentioned: when replacing a compressor it is ALWAYS recommend to spin the hub (not pulley) around by hand before starting the engine. This will prevent compressor from hydro locking in the event of too much oil in the compressor. I do 8-10 turns. Some people will add total system oil capacity to the compressor during install. By doing that the compressor has way too much oil inside of it. Also when installing a new clutch cycle the AC on and off at idle 10 or so times to seat the clutch. 

[Leaky88]

On 7/26/2019 at 8:36 AM, Mopar1973Man said:

Back to the OP. @mmoyle

 

I would normally just fill the compressor with the amount of oil  through the fill plug in the side of the body. Being your replacing so much just fill the compressor and then install. Replace the seals as you go makes sure to put a bit of oil and all fresh seals. Then pull a vacuum and test for leaks. If it holds exactly the same amount of vacuum for over 5 to 10 minutes I typically just start charging the system. I typically just put the full 3 cans (12 ozs) to a 2nd Gen Dodge. That will get just about right a bit over charged but no harm typically.

 

 

Hi,

The heat is back, and of course, the AC is not working.  Nothing but hot air.  My compressor is leaking around front seal, evidenced by dye on compressor and ground. I purchased a compressor kit with Compressor, Dryer, Orifice, seals, oil etc. and also have a new Condenser.  Destructions talk about flushing the lines, and Evaporator to remove oil, contaminants, etc.  Any recommendations on flushing it would be appreciated.  How  much of this flushing agent is required? Thanks Leaky

[IBMobile]

 It's good that you're replacing the condenser, it gets full of crud,  the metering orifice, crud also, and the accumulator.  The metering orifice is crimped in the A/C pipe that goes between the condenser and accumulator, behind the right battery, so the whole pipe has to be replaced..  That leaves only the evaporator and 2 hoses to back flush.  You can get a loaner A/C flush kit from AutoZone and buy a quart of flushing solvent.  Go easy with the solvent, you can blow through it fast, and just put into the container the amount you want to use to flush that particular part.

 

https://www.autozone.com/tools-and-equipment/loan-a-tools/air-conditioning-loaner-rental-tools   

 

 

[Leaky88]

Thanks IBMobile. Do you happen to know a source for the replacement pipe?
And how is that rebuilt Transmission doing BTW?

[IBMobile]

I bought one last month at 1-800-Radiator & A/C  part number H-6317 for $30.00. or 

https://www.autozone.com/cooling-heating-and-climate-control/a-c-hose-assembly/four-seasons-a-c-orifice-tube-56828/901879_621250_2051

 

18 minutes ago, Leaky88 said:

And how is that rebuilt Transmission doing BTW?

It's doing great.  Good firm shifts up and down even with torque convertor locked up. 

 @Mopar1973Man said " I've rode in @IBMobile truck with 4:10 gears and 245s tires that is a quick truck. Then with @Dynamic built transmission very impressive power." 

[Leaky88]

Many thanks.  
 

I ordered the Orifice Pipe from AZ, some place I got the Sanden Kit from. 

 

FYI, I have replicated all of your MOD’s on my truck, to include a Rear Camera and they are working great.  
 

Glad to hear your “Dynamic” Transmission is doing all it was advertised to do.  If I ever get to Utah, I have plans of turning my eyes from the Credit Card Machine and getting mine done.  What Package did John do on yours?
 

I’ve been away due to that “day” job thing. Still slotted to move to Utah for work, but like everything else, COVID 19 is in the plans. I’ll be 66 in a few days, and I heed CDC’s warnings.  Fortunately, my work does too.
 

Cant complain about the Trucks AC. Guy I bought it from said he was adding every year.  That is always a red flag with any closed system.  Firestone, where I’ve been buying tires for years serviced it 2 years ago, it was good until last year 2019.  They graciously  looked at it, found a Schrader Valve “packed” with debris, charged it up and it worked until now.  This is not a job I wanted/need with everything else going on, but a shop talked about only doing a KIT and no Condenser or as you pointed out, the needed Orifice Line. It was not the price that turned me away as I know the unseen overhead any automotive business has, rather it was fact  I have a place and those tools my wife surely looks at with question.   

 

Again, many thanks.

[IBMobile]

I'm glad to hear those mods are working for you.  I have a couple more I've been thinking about but haven't written them up yet.

 

24 minutes ago, Leaky88 said:

What Package did John do on yours?

A stage two.

 

Below is an excerpt from an article  I wrote about the Ram Second Gen.  

 

Repairing A/C system

 

I am not going to tell you how to change a part but give some helpful hints to avoid the pitfalls.

• Have all the parts and tools on hand ready to go.  The faster you open and close the system the less of a moisture problem.

   

• If you have to purge the refrigerant from the system and it can’t be captured, crack open the low and high side valves.  If the valves are opened to much refrigerant oil will be forced out by the escaping 134A.  You won’t know how much is lost and it makes a mess.

 

• If you are replacing the compressor due to a catastrophic failure replace the orifice tube, accumulator and also the condenser.  A lot of debris can get stuck in the tubes of the condenser and flushing may not clear it out.  The cost of an aftermarket one is cheap and you are not worried “did I get it all out”.  You will need to drain the oil out of the old compressor into the measuring cup and make note of the amount. Discard old oil.  Now, drain the oil out of the new compressor then add the amount, in fresh oil, that was drained from the old compressor plus 2oz for the new accumulator and 1oz for the new condenser to the new compressor.

   

• Always replace the o-rings when working on an open system.  They are a possible point of future leakage, and it’s cheap and easy to do.  All O-rings need to be coated with A/C mineral oil NOT PAG oil.  PAG oil is hydroscopic and will cause corrosion on the outside of the hose fittings and O-rings.

 

• When evacuating the system let the vacuum pump run for at least an hour, the longer the better.  This is turning any liquid water into a vapor by causing water to boil.  Water will boil at 70°F when the vacuum is at or greater than 29.18inHg.  The vapor has to make its way out of the system to the low and high side ports.  This is why it takes so long to evacuate the system.  When done evacuating the system close the valves on the A/C gauge manifold and wait.  If the gauges move then there is still a large leak in the system.  A small leak cannot be found this way because only 15psi is being exerted inward when the system normally runs with a static pressure of 80+psi and a running high side pressure of 170+psi pushing out.  

 

• When first adding 134A to the system from a single use 12oz can the low side pressure will jump up to 60+psi and then come down, depending how much refrigerant is in the system, to 20-45psi.  The can will also become cold due to the pressure drop in the can and the refrigerant boiling.  When the can is no longer cool or cold there is no more refrigerant in the can or going into the system.   

 

• To expedite the charging time jumper the plug for the low pressure switch this will keep the compressor clutch from cycling off.  The refrigerant will enter the system faster when the can of 134A is placed in a container of warm water.  The 134A turns to a gas in the can faster due to the heat of the warm water.   Only 134A in its gas state should enter the system, adding liquid 134A before the compressor can destroy it.  

 

• The A/C system requires 32oz of 134A for a full charge.  When using a single use 12oz can you’ll need 3 cans.  After adding 2 cans (which is 24oz) weigh the third can on the kitchen scale and make note of the weight.  When adding the remaining 8oz (2/3 of the can) check the weight of the can occasionally.  When the can is 8oz lighter you’re done.