Knocking noise in bell housing

[YeaImDylan]

Hey all, back again with another problem 🙃 so I have a weird knocking that sounds like it’s coming from the bell housing directly under where the clutch is.. it’s an 01 6 speed with (supposedly) a South Bend Dual Disk. Noise stays even with clutch pedal pressed in, I just don’t hear the discs rattling any more. The noise is proportional with engine rpm. I’m praying to god it’s the flywheel bolts or maybe it’s the original 300k flywheel and the P/O just slapped a new clutch in, which is definitely possible due to other things done on the truck... maybe dual mass flywheel? Clutch spring hitting? Clutch component broken and is stuck in there? I’m almost certain it isn’t injector knock since it did that noise before I swapped with my buddy and he had pretty damn fresh injectors too. YouTube video attached as well.

 

https://youtu.be/WjidpvDkmus

 

you can hear the sound more towards the end when the phone is right under where I’m assuming the clutch assembly is. Hoping the clutch is just on its way out or was installed improperly (not good but better than a rod or bearing)

 

[IBMobile]

Have you tried to listen to the noise with a long screwdriver or a mechanic stethoscope.  If the noise is in the bellhousing then get ready to pull the transmission.

[YeaImDylan]

40 minutes ago, IBMobile said:

Have you tried to listen to the noise with a long screwdriver or a mechanic stethoscope.  If the noise is in the bellhousing then get ready to pull the transmission.

I have not. Never done this before with a vehicle, with a noise this apparent, would it be hard to tell where it's coming from or will it be a definite difference say between bellhousing ( if it's hitting in there) rather than the bottom of the engine or side with the possibility of it being a rod?

[Dieselfuture]

Not easy to tell from video but to me it sounds like a loose rocker arm. If the noise is definitely coming from the bottom I would guess it's more in the bell housing than the engine, it seems that more noises in that area are associated with clutches vs engines. Although @TFaoro had a knock he couldn't figure it out and ended up rebuilding his engine. I don't think he ever found out what the cause of the knock was. 

[Mopar1973Man]

Just got done with @Jthor Ford 7.3L with a dual mass flywheel he managed to break all the spring in the flywheel. It rattled bad. After pulling the transmission every was clearly visible what need to be done. Now I know this is Ford but still diesel. Like on his the clutch was good but the throw out bearing was worn, friction disc and pressure plate are good. The dual mass flywheel was done. Ended up upgrading  to a 13 inch flywheel and clutch. 

 

Like on my last clutch the pilot bearing fell out on to the input shaft then proceeded to eat the input shaft bearing and the tip of the mainshaft. I learned if there is any weird noises in the transmission just pull and look it only takes me 2 hours to pull a NV450, NV5600, or G56 transmission. I don't have a transmission jack nor a two post lift. The result of this last transmission and the bad pilot bearing helped 5th gear to rip teeth out at 80 MPH.

 

 

Even my stock OEM clutch started to shift funny and make weird noises. The friction plate came apart. 

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by Mopar1973Man

[YeaImDylan]

Thanks for the input Mopar Man! And wow, only 2 hours!? I would assume it’d take much longer. Did you happen to watch the video and if you did, could you hear the clacking noise that seems to not be natural to these noisy motors? My uncle who’s really into trucks and what not said he had a spring get stuck once on his Tacoma and it made a hitting noise. 
 

Let my buddy borrow the truck to pickup furniture and he said the clutch seems to be fine and what not and he’s really into cars and knows them well. Not necessarily heavy duty clutches like ours so I’m not sure if he would be able to tell if it was grabbing bad or anything of that nature. Debating on just sending it to a tranny shop or at least bringing it in and having them listen. I’d assume a shop that’s been around for 10+ years would know what noise is what due to location and sound. Just hard to work on my vehicle here since we’re not supposed to in the barracks parking lot and none of my buddy’s here have an abundance of tools so even working at their house isn’t too feasible at times. Been wanting to make a post here seeing if anyone is within an hour or 2 and would be willing to lend a hand doing some of these repairs I wanna do and has a lot of tools for various jobs.

[dripley]

I am not disputing what @Mopar1973Man can do in 2 hours. But if you have never pulled the tranny on your Dodge I would budget more time. I could not pull my 6 speed in 2 hours unless some one held a gun to my head. It is not overly complicated but can be a chore. It all depends on your level of experience. Watch some videos or better yet go spend the night at a Holiday Inn Express, I hear that wonders on the brain.

[Dieselfuture]

My transmission rattles like crazy when it warms up, when I first bought my truck I've taken it to the train and shop and the guy told me it was normal with aftermarket clutches. I believe you said because some of them don't have springs for dampening the noise and it rolls over into the transmission. Mine been rattling for the last 10 some years with no problems. PO told me he put in a dual disk in, I just don't remember what brand. All I know it's a very grabby clutch, almost no friction zone, it's either on or off. Someday I'll find out what I have, just hope it's not too soon.

Also make sure you overfill your fluid by at least a quart, this is a whole other debate.

[YeaImDylan]

2 hours ago, Dieselfuture said:

My transmission rattles like crazy when it warms up, when I first bought my truck I've taken it to the train and shop and the guy told me it was normal with aftermarket clutches. I believe you said because some of them don't have springs for dampening the noise and it rolls over into the transmission. Mine been rattling for the last 10 some years with no problems. PO told me he put in a dual disk in, I just don't remember what brand. All I know it's a very grabby clutch, almost no friction zone, it's either on or off. Someday I'll find out what I have, just hope it's not too soon.

Also make sure you overfill your fluid by at least a quart, this is a whole other debate.

See I do hear that rattle of the dual disc but that goes away when I press the pedal down.. I still hear the revolutionary knocking or hitting noise. I’m almost certain it wasn’t there when I had bought the truck. I honestly should just plan a weekend and drop it all but I’ve never done any clutch work in my life. Seems a bit tedious doing the bolts and what not when you look at the manuals for these clutches. I wouldn’t mind having someone who is knowledgeable with them by my side to make sure everything goes smooth.
 

I did watch a video that made the damn near same noise but it was a cracked and/or loose flex plate... obviously there are some similarities between these two parts but they’re also vastly different at the same time lol both are used to turn the engine over and I believe both have the same 8 bolts holding them on. I’ve also heard of those bolts being loose on both flex plates and flywheels and they cause a knocking noise as well.

[dripley]

Unless you have the clutch alignment tool that comes with a new clutch dont unbolt the the pressure to look inside. You will have a ****** of time getting it back together. I am sure you can get one on line, they are just plastic but hold the friction disc in place so you can bolt the pressure plate on. If it is not aligned the tranny will not mate back to the motor. That is unless someone here has another method, which might not surprise me.

I am not trying to scare you off of this project just hate for you to see it aint going back together on Sunday and you need the truck Monday. I spent last weekend installing a new steering gear only to see the replacement was not the right part. Had to put all the old stuff back so I could drive it on Monday.

[YeaImDylan]

I definitely understand your point!! Also along with **** getting stripped or broken, there’s definitely a lot of entities at play here of what could go wrong and leave you without a vehicle much longer than anticipated! I’d probably just have a new clutch on standby and they come with the tool from SB I believe. Once I’m out of the field I’ll be going to a few transmission shops and seeing if they even think the noise is in that area and not an internal engine problem god forbid lol

[dripley]

See if your buddies know any shops. Some are just after you money. Got 3 grandsons in the Army and their downfall is car dealerships. They seem to have learned quick but usually after one bad experience. I wish you luck.

 On a different note my old man spent time down your way back in 42. Paris island and short stint at Lejune before moving on to more training. Thanks for what you are doing for the country.

[Doubletrouble]

 I don't know if camp lejune has them but some military bases have garages you can rent with tools and equipment available to use. 

 My son was in the navy in san Diego, they had a shop like that. Came in handy for him.

[Mopar1973Man]

You can open it up without a alignment tool. Ha! I have skills in this.

 

I was just teaching @Jthor on his 7.3L Ford how to align a clutch without a tool complete by hand. Basically when you taking it apart look at the position of the friction disc vs. the pressure plate. Most are cut equal to the pressure plate.. What I do is using my finger measure all four opens and push the friction disc to be flush to the edge. This done while there is a little of plate pressure to keep position of the friction disc.Once you find the center go for it. I've used that method since 1986... Back then you didn't get a nice plastic tool even back then it was a wooden dowel that didn't even have the splines. 

 

Yeah if you have the tool for alignment use it but one note double check some of them droop a bit and you'll notice the friction disc slightly sticking out of the bottom do the same trick and I can about promise a good easy stab. Like yesterday I stabbed a Ford 5 speed back together and slid in easy as pie. BAM! No two post lift, no special transmission jack. Floor jack and a transmission. It's all in the way I ratchet strap the transmission to the jack. Won't fall or move while strapped to the jack. 

 

I know this is Ford 7.3L but @Jthor had a dual mass flywheel. It spit out a spring and drug it around in between the block and flywheel. I order a NAPA flywheel and clutch kit about $400 for it. Upgraded to 13 inch flywheel. Ditched the dual mass. Now the clutch is butter smooth and upgraded. My biggest battle was changing the rear main seal on the crank. I will admit Ford did good but that dang speedy sleeve is a royal PITA to get of the crank stub. Doable but not fun.

Edited April 8, 2021 by Mopar1973Man

[Silverwolf2691]

@YeaImDylan, just be aware that since you have the nv5600, its extremely heavy. Its 300+ lbs without the transfer case if I remember correctly from when I had to ship mine out to be rebuilt. Just factor that in if you want to do this yourself... You cannot manhandle this tranny as easily as you can some others. 

 

No dual mass flywheels on second gen dodges. And definitely not with a dual disk.

[Great work!]

Ratchet straps are great to change tranny. Better than a jack allows easy movement for aligning bolts. The front driveshaft is a pain you'll  want an impact gun and long extensions 15 mm IRRC its clocked too only lines up one way. A 3 foot extension  with a wobble socket makes things easier. The top nuts for the transfer case are a pain too a curved or cut off wrench helps. The cross member has to go UP then back to come out . Leave the 4x4 lever in the boot. Just unbolt from tranny. Us a small crow foot pry bar to pop out the linkage. Be careful not to pinch wires in bell housing when installing. 

[Jthor]

Ya the the new clutch that went in to my 7.3 is great the new injectors are also super nice thanks Mike !!!!