Is it worth adding 2-cycle oil to a P7100 truck?

[Cowboy]

I'm heavily considering getting a jug for the VP44's,  I don't visit Walmart often other wise I would have already.

On the P7100's....  It it was plain ulsd then I would be more worried.  But according to this, I should be fine.

http://www.house.mo.gov/content.aspx?info=/bills071/bills/SB204.htm

Couple other links I found interesting.

http://web.cals.uidaho.edu/biodiesel/files/2013/08/Applied-21_2_149.pdf

http://web.cals.uidaho.edu/biodiesel/files/2013/08/ASABE-036036.pdf

One is with a 96 P7100, the other was a 98 VP44.

[dripley]

13 minutes ago, Cowboy said:

I'm heavily considering getting a jug for the VP44's,  I don't visit Walmart often other wise I would have already.

On the P7100's....  It it was plain ulsd then I would be more worried.  But according to this, I should be fine.

http://www.house.mo.gov/content.aspx?info=/bills071/bills/SB204.htm

Couple other links I found interesting.

http://web.cals.uidaho.edu/biodiesel/files/2013/08/Applied-21_2_149.pdf

http://web.cals.uidaho.edu/biodiesel/files/2013/08/ASABE-036036.pdf

One is with a 96 P7100, the other was a 98 VP44.

In the first link you provided the 3rd paragraph of the bill summary states that if bio blend is more expensive than straight diesel then the distributor does not have  to buy it and can use straight diesel at no violation of the law. 

The thing that bugs me is there is no regulation that guarantees what you are getting. Many states allow up to 5% bio with no labeling on the pump. Anything over requires a label. So I think if you are counting on getting bio all the time, you just dont know. I have run alot of bio with good results in the past year. Got to where I was looking for it. I did cut down on the 2 stroke and ran some without it completely when using b 15. The engine ran just as quite with he higher percentages. I would just like to see decent labeling so you know what you are putting in the tank. 

[Cowboy]

I guess I'll have to look into this more.  I have a feeling if I ask my local station, they're just going to look at me sideways.

[The_Hammer]

Around here most of the pumps are labeled "may contain up to 5% bio". If it was a constant 5% bio everytime I filled up then I wouldn't worry about using 2-cycle oil. I seriously doubt we ever see anything other than straight ULSD around here though. 

[Cowboy]

I did a quick search for a more recent document, and found this.

http://house.mo.gov/content.aspx?info=/bills091/bilsum/intro/sHB1068I.htm

It does say that distributors can purchase straight ULSD, but must mix it with bio-diesel themselves.... If I'm reading that right.

Next time I get the farm tanks filled, I'll have to ask the guy.  From the conversations we've had in the past, he seems well versed in this stuff. 

[Me78569]

I have been noticing more and more %5 and %10 bio signs on the pumps.  If they are using that much we should be good again for our pumps......

 

 

I haven't used 2 stroke in a long time  I would rather spends another $1000 on a new vp44 a couple years from now that go to walmart 2 times a week.

[The_Hammer]

38 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

I have been noticing more and more %5 and %10 bio signs on the pumps.  If they are using that much we should be good again for our pumps......

 

 

I haven't used 2 stroke in a long time  I would rather spends another $1000 on a new vp44 a couple years from now that go to walmart 2 times a week.

You know that you can buy more than a gallon at a time right? It isn't 22 ammo, there's no limit on how many you can buy at a time 

[Me78569]

True,

 

I should just man up and go to walmart, ugh

 

[The_Hammer]

1 minute ago, Me78569 said:

True,

 

I should just man up and go to walmart, ugh

 

I've learned to embrace Walmart, somewhat. Being open 24 hours has saved my butt more than a few times so I can't complain too much. The people though......I....... um........ 

[Me78569]

I just don't find that I ever need something bad enough to require myself going to Walmart.  

 

I don't care if it is cheaper, or handy, or whatever.... I just don't like the place haha

[Cowboy]

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Super-Tech-TC-W3-Outboard-2-Cycle-Oil-1-Gallon/16795065

Buy 4 gallons get free shipping.

I don't like walmart either, I don't think I've been in one for at least a year now.

Edited January 21, 2016 by Cowboy

[alanack6795]

9 hours ago, The_Hammer said:

The Super Tech 2-cycle oil that Walmart sells is right at $13 a gallon out the door. A rebuilt P7100 is $1500+, not counting labor. $1500 will buy 115 gallons of 2-cycle oil, enough to treat 14,769 gallons of diesel, which (assuming an average of 15 mpg) is enough to travel 221,535 miles.

Would my pump require a rebuild/replacement in the next 200k miles if I didn't use 2-cycle oil? There's no way to know for sure. What I AM sure of is that ULS diesel does NOT meet Bosch's minimum lubricity requirements. Another thing that factors in (for me) is that it will take 15+ years to run up 200k miles on my truck, so overall I consider it cheap insurance.

 

  My truck has the 160 pump that is prone to warping  barrel/plunger.  It is a 1994, It has 225,000 miles on it.  So if dumped 2 stroke oil in my truck since new I would have wasted my money.

Pretty sure my trucks P-Pump isn't going  to blow up tomorrow.  My truck has also seen some good hard use since it was new, Its had large, heavy 8ft  Fisher snow plow since new.  Judging by the conditions of my pick up box and hitch It was probably often overloaded.  I bought it off my friend that worked for a tree company, who said he bought it of the original owner, a farmer In upstate Massachusetts. 

   My Snap on guy does a strange "cocktail" of additives in his VP44 equipped ISB engine in his Snap on tool truck since new.  His VP44 still took a dump at ~180,000 miles.  That's all I know, I can't speak much for the Vp44 trucks because i don't own one

[dripley]

lost my first VP at 75k under warranty. this one ran on reg diesel before LSD. replaced the second with near 140k  on it and it ran mostly on LSD. this last one has 145k on it and hopefully still has a lot of life in it. it has ran mostly ULSD and 2 stroke. only time will tell.

That second pump kept spitting pretty colors for some reason. Maybe the LSD.

[dieseled]

I used to run twc3 all the time in mine , I haven't in a few years , thank for reminding me

I had it around to run because I tournament bass fished and hung out at boat shop that sold it in bulk out of 50 gal drums , like for 10.00 a gal , I`m sure its gone up , how much is it at Walmart ? If you have a boat shop  near you you might check with them , a lot of motors are now 4 strokes now but some , optimax and e-tecs still use oil

[notlimah]

On my current truck, I'm at 174k on the STOCK VP44! So as soon as I found out about the magic that is 2stroke, I starting adding it. It definitely did quiet things down, and so I can only hope it helps this thing continue to plug away!

[somethingnuw]

okay canadian coming in here late... i have a 2002 6 speed with the 24 valve... all sorts of things went wrong this year... truck has about 340 000 km on it... only changed the pump once about 50 000 miles ago...ripped off the lift pump and went to an in tank push pump... was told by ( Dodge) i'd never need a new pump again????

 i use to use all those adatives you find at truck stops for diesel trucks but have stopped... i had a chip from BD Diesel performance on there which i have since removed... my question my milage has really slipped in the last year  (nothing to do with the chip)... still have the power just truck is eating fuel like never before... i only tow an all aluminum charmac atv trailer with a rhino side by side on it... when i tow that thing my milage is crap... so much so im thinking it would be better to tow with my wife's f-150... total max weight 2000lbs

questions... what could be wrong... who should i bring the truck too?  Do you trust dodge dealerships to diagnose these things ?  If i do run 2 stroke engine oil... how much do i use to a tank... i don't do gallons so im not sure... but all our tanks are the same size... ii normally run them really low

 

Sorry for the rant!  

[Me78569]

Do you know what your fuel pressure is going into the vp44?  If not get a gauge and figure it out first thing.  2 stroke will not resolve your poor mileage issue.  

 

I would look to resolve the root of the issue.  The intank pump is junk also so I would highly recommend you get an aftermarket fuel system.

 

 

[Hawkez]

2 stroke will help a VP44 system and the ratio to add is 1 fl oz to 1 gallon of diesel. 

But like Me said, 2 cycle oil won't fix your problem.  You need to determine if your lift pump is working and if it is getting fuel to the IP.  How is your filter?  When was it last changed?  A dirty filter can cause a lot of problems.  It is best to figure out what is going on before you damage you IP, that is when it gets more expensive.  Determining fuel pressure from the lift pump will be the first place to start.

Maybe start a new thread with Somethingnuw's question so it doesn't' get lost and he gets help?

Edited March 21, 2016 by Hawkez

[CSM]

+1 to all of the above.  Also, are you estimating fuel mileage from the odometer and hand calculating it?  The overhead panel MPG calculator is not in any way reliable.  

[Mopar1973Man]

4 hours ago, somethingnuw said:

when i tow that thing my milage is crap... so much so im thinking it would be better to tow with my wife's f-150... total max weight 2000lbs

Towing my 8,000 pound, 31 foot long RV I get between 11-14 MPG.

4 hours ago, somethingnuw said:

what could be wrong...

Check a few things? What's your fuel pressure like? Do you have any error codes? Just because the light not on doesn't mean it clear of codes. It can still get error codes and not trip the light.

4 hours ago, somethingnuw said:

who should i bring the truck too?

I would love to do it but I'm sure you are way to far to drive here.

4 hours ago, somethingnuw said:

i use to use all those adatives you find at truck stops for diesel trucks but have stopped...

Most of those additives are junk anyway and do nothing but mask over the issue. You have to remember if you want a clean fuel system use a good quality filter (3 micron). Thing is most do get is you got a tank that is 4,480 ounces of fuel and dumping 8-16 ounces of any product in the tank is like pissin in a pond. More injector cleaner don't even clean an injector even if you soak it in 100% of the product. Most of these products increase cetane which mask the issue but also reduce the BTU's of the fuel.