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Sounds like EPA hype... :clap:

I've seen that one before. Being I'm over 200k miles on 2 cycle oil and no such injector fouling has occurred. No injection pump or injector failures. Their stated HFRR results are wrong too. When you do a search for any US manufactured diesel fuel you find ALL US fuels state they score 520 HFRR typically. Back to Bosch standards which is 450 HFRR or less. Now are playing ball in our own nation and US fuels do NOT meet the designed requirement of Bosch Injection Systems. But if you look at the study they are all over the map and vague. Let talk about US diesel fuel and US vehicle requirements and things change. But now go global and toss in the differences between EU and US in diesel fuel standards and vehicle requirements worlds of difference.

What US 520 HFRR Fuels can do.

bosch-testing.jpg.c546b5191f19f69cc5e042

80k miles on 2 cycle oil.

muzkaw.jpg

 

Edited by Mopar1973Man
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1 hour ago, Killer223 said:

seeings how the two other two stroke posts are locked i am starting this one.

http://www.fuelexpert.co.za/2strokeoilindiesel.php

http://www.fuelexpert.co.za/2-stroke-oil-in-diesel-technical-study.php

 

thoughts....

 

 

I've had more injectors in my truck than most will see in their life. All of them were run with 2-stroke. None of them were even remotely fowled. Valves get more oil on them from the valve seals being worn than "unburnt" 2-stroke ever could. (ask me how I know)

I did help a buddy out and pulled his injectors for him. He had been running the PS and had a hefty amount of carbon buildup at 120K. He's since switched to 2-stroke.

Looks like 2 stroke cleans more than it hurts.... Not my video so I can't really say though

 

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Absolutely. Very simple video but proves a good points. 2 Cycle oil leaves behind a lubricant for the engine to stay lubed up cylinder wise where cetane booster and other products tend possibly leave behind other soot debris.

Now take notice of the other thing in the video is time of burn. The 2 cycle oil burns slower and longer being it has way more BTU's per quantity vs most fuel additives. As cetane goes up the fuel goes down in BTU's. So 2 Cycle Oil will produce more work vs. high cetane boosted fuels. Take notice every winter when fuel cetane spikes high for the winter time everyone loses MPG's. Why? Simply put the BTUs went down and the working force of the fuel was lost. So now as summer comes and cetane lowers again MPG rises. 

http://www.fuelexpert.co.za/2strokeoilindiesel.php

As for the link site... :lmao2::lmao:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sasolburg,+South+Africa/@-31.4049951,26.4103857,5z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x1e945e71a359dc29:0xa333dd792f4638a6

Again... South Africa has different vehicle and fuel requirements and also fuel standards...



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Edited by Mopar1973Man

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6 hours ago, notlimah said:

How does 2-stroke effect lift pump filters say on the FASS or Airdog pumps? Or does it at all?

No effect at all. I'm changing both the AirDog and Stock fuel filters at 60k miles now. I've got roughly 47k miles on my current filters and fuel pressure is still strong.

Here is my last change at 30k miles.

2zeymj4.jpg

Edited by Mopar1973Man
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On ‎2‎/‎9‎/‎2016 at 9:20 PM, Killer223 said:

seeings how the two other two stroke posts are locked i am starting this one.

http://www.fuelexpert.co.za/2strokeoilindiesel.php

http://www.fuelexpert.co.za/2-stroke-oil-in-diesel-technical-study.php

 

thoughts....

 

 

That study seems to be, or is suggesting that 2 stroke suspended in unevaporated fuel has little or no lubrication properties, and I have a hard time buying that.

from any 2 stroke engine I have ever seen. A high percentage of the fuel/oil mixture is sucked into the crank shaft first, and the pressure created by the piston down stroke forces the mixture into the combustion chamber through separate intake ports. I`m sure part of the reason for this is cooling, but I don`t see any type of load bearing surviving without lubrication.  

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30 minutes ago, angus said:

That study seems to be, or is suggesting that 2 stroke suspended in unevaporated fuel has little or no lubrication properties, and I have a hard time buying that.

So am I. Being that HFRR score testing proved already that 2 cycle oil was a good improvement over straight diesel fuel. Beyond that at least in a 24V Cummins engine the fuel is sprayed in the cup of the piston. Should not make any contact with the cylinder walls. So beyond that there is no gain to the engine (piston / cylinder) but there is for sure a gain for the entire fuel system from lift pump, injection pump to injectors. Again US petroleum diesel fuels score at 520 HFRR typically unless biodiesel then its way down to 200's HFRR. Again EU fuel or other countries might have different standards for their fuel so comparing is not valid. 

Still between the independent lab test, and Bosch's requirement numbers I tend to still hold to. Of commercial products will always have test results that will sell their product even through it could be nothing more that kerosene in a bottle. (Yes, there is a product out there that is just that...)

Edited by Mopar1973Man
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I believe the statement about the buildup or residual film left behind after combustion to be a true statement. The benefits to a "CR" injection system may only be marginal, but rings, upper cylinder walls, and exhaust valves should all benefit.. but then again my Ph.D. is leaning against the wall out in the barn.

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CR injection is a different story being its go that pilot injection event. 

22 minutes ago, angus said:

I believe the statement about the buildup or residual film left behind after combustion to be a true statement.

The only residual film should be oil. There is no ash in quality US made 2 cycle oils today. I seriously doubt there is anything left after the burn process occurs the remaining should be burned off as part of the fuel. Now back in the days of WEO usage that was very very true. The high amount of carbon and ash in the used oil would absolutely build up debris. 

Ash deposits from ATF or WEO.

ashed-injectors.jpg.c32967b70b8e3a57d749

Again... Ash deposits.

dirty-inj.jpg.886a165c1d5174d3dbcbd1a84b

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Where did my post go? You delete it Mike? :-)

 

If anything CR will have a better burn of the 2 stroke due to the pilot and average injection pressure. 

 

Anyhow, I don't buy the 2 stroke hype. I did at one point and I got a sticky residue in my exhaust and a sticky butterfly valve on my exhaust brake (only noticeable with a backpressure gauge). 

When ULSD first came out it was new and steps were missed getting it from refinery fuel to market fuel and it was noticeable in the high rate of VP-44 failures. This is no longer an issue. Nearly all VP owners don't use 2 stroke or any additive and most of them have OEM lift pump and VP-44's aren't dropping like flies. 

 

This article seems like it was done better than the original HFRR article, just my 0.02. 

 

2 stroke was designed to lubricate in aresol form in a much higher percentage, I honestly don't see much good coming of it in low dosage in diesel fuel. 

 

I see the current 2-stroke in your fuel crowd as being the next ATF in your fuel crowd. :poke:

Edited by AH64ID

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When I first starting using 2 stroke i did notice the engine idled quieter than before using it. Right now mine is idleing even quieter than ever. I am thinking that it is bio in the diesel fuel. Most states I am driving in allow up to 5% with no labeling on the pumps. Anything over 5% has to be labeled. I did a few months back start seeking the bio diesel and thats when it quieted down even more than with the 2 stroke. I am still adding the 2 stroke except when they are labeled B-15 or B-20. I believe the the B-5 should be good with out it or at a reduced rate. I am not always sure what I am getting when I fill up these days.

The Love's I am building mixes there own bio here on site. They have 3 tanks with straight #2 and one tank of pure bio. It appears to me to be mixed on demand and not in the holding tanks. I will have to ask my fuel guy to see if I am reading the prints right. I am not familiar with the petroleum end of things. 

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I googled it and followed their lead. I dont remember exactly where. There are no nationwide rules on it right now and it seems to be a hodge podge of state regulations. 

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15 minutes ago, dripley said:

I googled it and followed their lead. I dont remember exactly where. There are no nationwide rules on it right now and it seems to be a hodge podge of state regulations. 

Just like there was no law stating if they had to label ULSD or LSD at the pump either. There is still pump to the day claiming LSD. I really doubt it being LSD is no longer produced for highway use.

Just like there is no law stating to label for cetane value.

Edited by Mopar1973Man

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I am almost positive that pumps are required to post if its ULSD or LSD. Bad things happen if you put LSD in a ULSD truck. 

Edited by AH64ID

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On 2/9/2016 at 7:04 AM, Mopar1973Man said:

 

No effect at all. I'm changing both the AirDog and Stock fuel filters at 60k miles now. I've got roughly 47k miles on my current filters and fuel pressure is still strong.

Here is my last change at 30k miles.

2zeymj4.jpg

Why do they say to change every so many miles or every year, which ever comes first. Is it like groceries and can go bad. Or is it like plastic and metal and some other processed food that don't go bad like McDonald's. Never understood why you got to change filters once a year if you only put few thousand miles on it. I think like you said if pressure gauge is OK and filter is not rusted out why not leave it alone. Maybe at least two or three years. Guy I know had an oil leak and all he did was add oil for like 5-6 years and never changed filter, not sure how he got away with that one, maybe sludge isn't a problem with fresh oil and not enough other debris to plug it. But a fuel filter with a guage a different story. 

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Depends on your fuel source. Some folks like using dirty ol' farm fuel (red dye) and wonder why filters don't last long. Maybe they are really cheap and buy the cheap corner store fuel and wonder why the filter is black in 15k miles. The reason I can get away with it is because of knowing my fuel source and what the fuel station has for filters. So I can extend my filter change out quite a long time. I still watch the fuel pressure and see if there is a serious drop in pressure. So far it not tripped my low pressure light even once yet. ISSPro EV2 is programmed for 13 PSI so when it drops to below 13 PSI it will trip.

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9 hours ago, AH64ID said:

Where did my post go? You delete it Mike? :-)

 

If anything CR will have a better burn of the 2 stroke due to the pilot and average injection pressure. 

 

Anyhow, I don't buy the 2 stroke hype. I did at one point and I got a sticky residue in my exhaust and a sticky butterfly valve on my exhaust brake (only noticeable with a backpressure gauge). 

When ULSD first came out it was new and steps were missed getting it from refinery fuel to market fuel and it was noticeable in the high rate of VP-44 failures. This is no longer an issue. Nearly all VP owners don't use 2 stroke or any additive and most of them have OEM lift pump and VP-44's aren't dropping like flies. 

 

This article seems like it was done better than the original HFRR article, just my 0.02. 

 

2 stroke was designed to lubricate in aresol form in a much higher percentage, I honestly don't see much good coming of it in low dosage in diesel fuel. 

 

I see the current 2-stroke in your fuel crowd as being the next ATF in your fuel crowd. :poke:

Maybe it  will, maybe it won't. I know mine idles quieter and gets better mileage with the 2-stroke in it. I'd love to see a disassembled pump at 150K with 2 stroke and without 2 stroke. Never will, but it would be interesting. :thumbup2: 

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I see the current 2-stroke in your fuel crowd as being the next ATF in your fuel crowd. 

Won't happen ATF is too high in ash content not to mention the other compound like anti-scorching and friction modifiers. At least 2 cycle oil is just oil without all the add junk you engine can't burn.

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3 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

Won't happen ATF is too high in ash content not to mention the other compound like anti-scorching and friction modifiers. At least 2 cycle oil is just oil without all the add junk you engine can't burn.

I think he means it'll phase out like ATF did back in the day. I personally don't see that happening though.

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Optilube is a good product. For most people its a mail only product. It does increase HFRR quite well. The only reason I still use 2 cycle oil is I got so much 2 cycle equipment. (Chainsaws, weed eaters, etc.)

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