dyno numbers

[AH64ID]

1 hour ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

I'll challenge that bet and say that Stock Air Box will be the same IAT as BHAF. Being that IAT temperature is based 90% on the Intercooler and not where the turbo is sucking from. Yes, I've still got my stock air box.

 

Very easily prove that myth...

 

 

Based on the poor location of the IAT sensor on the 2nd gen I am not sure how much  you'll see. It's too heavily influenced by coolant temp. IIRC you often see 140° IAT's in the manifold. The only times I ever see 140° IAT's is when it's above 95° outside and I'm pulling grades at 80% load or higher, otherwise I run intake manifold temps of 6-15° above ambient. 

 

I do know that I can see pre (right after the air filter) and post turbo (intake manifold) IAT temps on my 05 and I have a CAI and WAI inlet to my stock box and depending on how I am pulling air I can see a pre and post temperature change. 

 

The foam that seals my stock box to the fender broke away and I ran about a year without it, when I added some insulation back in there my pre/post IAT's dropped again, so I was even getting warm air from the gap between the box and the fender. 

 

Basically if the pre-turbo temp goes up so does the post turbo temp, unless it's well below freezing outside. The intercooler is very efficient, but the temp into the turbo has a very noticeable effect on the final temp. 

[cumminsVP2001]

so am i getting that the stock box is better at keeping IAT down? does this convert to cooler EGTs? cause i still have a problem with getting to hot

 

@KATOOM i just finished my installing my 3 piece and new turbo and have only done one drive since installation, but i saw about 50-100* difference at all time. But one is also a mechanical and one from the adrenaline. 

[Mopar1973Man]

2 hours ago, AH64ID said:

Basically if the pre-turbo temp goes up so does the post turbo temp,

 

Not much, if you average boost is 2 PSI. Way different if you running WOT and racing. Again we are talking daily driver. Not 1/4 mile track star. There is little to no effect. 

 

Not the same topic... But if you want to see some really wild IAT take a peek at my 1996 Dodge 1500 V8 5.9L it normal for about 150*F to 170*F gasoline engine no wonder I need 92 Octane with a Mopar Performance PCM. Cold air intake is in place but has much higher IAT... No intercooler... Funny though IAT can be traded they are the same sensor...

 

120 to 140*F on my diesel seems like child's play. 

 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2018 by Mopar1973Man

[cumminsVP2001]

im talking about a track star though......

[Mopar1973Man]

14 minutes ago, cumminsVP2001 said:

im talking about a track star though......

 

Then yes you are going to want to do a full cold air intake to keep the EGT's under control. I would put more effort into the intercooler though. Being that is the biggest factor in controlling IAT temps more so than cold air intake really. 

 

Here is that calculator for ya. Now you can see in theory how each affects the temperature at the intake.

http://www.stealth316.com/2-turbotemp.htm

 

 

[cumminsVP2001]

"CAI" as in use the stock box, or i was thinking for track use removing headlight and routing a pipe there. and on the calculator what is inlet and outlet pressure?

[AH64ID]

2 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Not much, if you average boost is 2 PSI. Way different if you running WOT and racing. Again we are talking daily driver. Not 1/4 mile track star. There is little to no effect. 

 

Can you see pre-turbo IAT’s on a 2nd gen?

 

Low boost or high boost the temp of the air going into the turbo has a direct and very visible effect on the temp in the manifold. 

 

I’m always watching both IAT temps, and have been for many years. 

[KATOOM]

7 hours ago, cumminsVP2001 said:

@KATOOM i just finished my installing my 3 piece and new turbo and have only done one drive since installation, but i saw about 50-100* difference at all time. But one is also a mechanical and one from the adrenaline. 

 

 

So you're thinking that one or the other isnt as accurate?  Have you tried swapping the connections and seeing if you get the same results?

[cumminsVP2001]

7 hours ago, KATOOM said:

 

So you're thinking that one or the other isnt as accurate?  Have you tried swapping the connections and seeing if you get the same results?

like i said i just put them on and have only driven it once so i havent had any time to play with them, but i would for sure believe that the back 3 is 50-100 degrees hotter than the front three. i was just mentioning one was electronic and one is mechanical.

 

on that same note. how many of you guys have noticed the adrenaline reads high on PEAK boost levels. i would always peak 60-63psi on my 62/68 but my mechanical gauge would peak about 55psi

[trreed]

I have a 50-100* difference between my adrenaline and my AutoMeter gauges. And my adrenaline always reads high for boost. Trust the analog gauges

Edited July 28, 2018 by trreed

[Mopar1973Man]

39 minutes ago, trreed said:

I have a 50-100* difference between my adrenaline and my AutoMeter gauges. And my adrenaline always reads high for boost. Trust the analog gauges

Same here boost pressure is skewed above 20 PSI. Then EGT is about 50F high on the Quadzilla compared to my ISSPro EV2.

[dripley]

For my education, do yall have separate thermo couples for the quad and the gauge? Or do you share the same one?

[Silverdodge]

pertinent to the point they run with no air filter so the air filter does not collapse in on itself and destroy the turbo even with my little 62 sxe I can see a difference in running a restrictive air filter to an open air filter in the crushing sense like I've seen people pull in them cheap Spectras and Destroy turbos with them running a 62 to 64

[cumminsVP2001]

3 hours ago, Silverdodge said:

pertinent to the point they run with no air filter so the air filter does not collapse in on itself and destroy the turbo even with my little 62 sxe I can see a difference in running a restrictive air filter to an open air filter in the crushing sense like I've seen people pull in them cheap Spectras and Destroy turbos with them running a 62 to 64

Well that makes me a little nervous. 

Meant to add on..I don't see a bhaf being sucked in.

Edited July 28, 2018 by cumminsVP2001

[AH64ID]

3 hours ago, Silverdodge said:

pertinent to the point they run with no air filter so the air filter does not collapse in on itself and destroy the turbo even with my little 62 sxe I can see a difference in running a restrictive air filter to an open air filter in the crushing sense like I've seen people pull in them cheap Spectras and Destroy turbos with them running a 62 to 64

 

It's really not that hard to find a filter that will work with most applications. Consider that 15L motors have air filters too, and they move a LOT of air. 

 

Just like fuel filters, if you do your research and size it properly there will not be a measurable restriction. 

The 62 SXE is a 75-80 lb/min turbo right? So that's roughly 1050 CFM at peak airflow, there shouldn't be any reason you cannot find a filter without a restriction for 1050 CFM. Even if the filter is rated for high restriction at 1050 CFM most the time that is only 8" H20, or .29psi of restriction. 

 

 

[cumminsVP2001]

1 hour ago, AH64ID said:

 

It's really not that hard to find a filter that will work with most applications. Consider that 15L motors have air filters too, and they move a LOT of air. 

 

Just like fuel filters, if you do your research and size it properly there will not be a measurable restriction. 

The 62 SXE is a 75-80 lb/min turbo right? So that's roughly 1050 CFM at peak airflow, there shouldn't be any reason you cannot find a filter without a restriction for 1050 CFM. Even if the filter is rated for high restriction at 1050 CFM most the time that is only 8" H20, or .29psi of restriction. 

 

 

lets talk 66 sxe. would there be considerable restriction with this?

[AH64ID]

1 minute ago, cumminsVP2001 said:

lets talk 66 sxe. would there be considerable restriction with this?

 

If you are maxing that turbo out it's going to move around 1150 CFM. That's still a relatively small turbo as it's built on a 300 frame. 

 

At max airflow it's only a 56% efficient turbo, as compared to 77% in the middle of it's map. 

 

Look at it this way, my turbo is rated for up to approx 900 CFM and my air filter is rated at 675 CFM. I've never seen my filter minder move with my current intake setup, and it does work as I could move it with 100 less hp and a smaller OEM filter and a non-modified air box. My normal tune is 400 rwhp, but the tune I have in there now is likely in the 525 range. 

[trreed]

12 hours ago, dripley said:

For my education, do yall have separate thermo couples for the quad and the gauge? Or do you share the same one?

Separate probes.

[cumminsVP2001]

14 hours ago, AH64ID said:

 

If you are maxing that turbo out it's going to move around 1150 CFM. That's still a relatively small turbo as it's built on a 300 frame. 

 

At max airflow it's only a 56% efficient turbo, as compared to 77% in the middle of it's map. 

 

Look at it this way, my turbo is rated for up to approx 900 CFM and my air filter is rated at 675 CFM. I've never seen my filter minder move with my current intake setup, and it does work as I could move it with 100 less hp and a smaller OEM filter and a non-modified air box. My normal tune is 400 rwhp, but the tune I have in there now is likely in the 525 range. 

so what im getting from this is throw a BHAF on it and dont worry? even on the track? or remove for track use. i cant believe no one has dynoed with and without an air filter. ive searched for hours and cant find anything. 

[Dieselfuture]

37 minutes ago, cumminsVP2001 said:

so what im getting from this is throw a BHAF on it and dont worry? even on the track? or remove for track use. i cant believe no one has dynoed with and without an air filter. ive searched for hours and cant find anything. 

You can be first  

Not being a smart just maybe everyone thinks that that's how it's been done for ever and just take their k&n off and see an increase 

Makes you wonder why they still use k&n