Yeap... The old VP44 gave up. Timing is stuck in full advancement rattle very hard and very little power. P0216 code is present. I pulled the Quadzilla and still present so I know the problem it's not Quadzilla related. It hits a state of limp mode won't power more than 40 MPH. At times it will clear up and run well then the timing goes back to full advancement pull the power way down. I did make it home but very slow ride. 

 

I can say without a doubt the Quadzilla only reports commanded timing, not actual timing. 

 

Time to make some calls to DAP in the morning... 

Edited April 9, 20178 yr by Mopar1973Man

I would definitely change mine if I was in that far. Not that expensive and they sure can make a mess when they fail.

Death to all tuners! I love the correlations made when pumps die. rofl

There's some of this going on in this thread In regards to the quad relation to VP failure 

 

 

4 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

I just realized that I'm already for a tappet cover gasket install. I'll have the VP44 out and just got to pull the ECM and filter and install. I've already got the gasket laying on the workbench in the shop. I guess I better have my camera ready as well and refresh a VP44 install article and tappet gasket install.

 

I think a refresh on the vp44 install article and tapped gasket would be awesome!

Choot, I replaced a vp Sunday. Tried the no removal of lines from the head like a had a couple fb "buddies" say they could to. HA that was laughable.

My vp44 has 200,000 miles so I imagine I'll be replacing it as well one of these days.

8 hours ago, notlimah said:

 

I think a refresh on the vp44 install article and tapped gasket would be awesome!

 

 

Hopefully I start working on it tomorrow afternoon.

 

7 hours ago, jlbayes said:

Choot, I replaced a vp Sunday. Tried the no removal of lines from the head like a had a couple fb "buddies" say they could to. HA that was laughable.

 

 

My method is to pull the 1,2,4 lines and leave 3,5,6 on the head. Being I'm going to do the tappet gasket I'm going to pull both. 

 

8 minutes ago, Spike48 said:

My vp44 has 200,000 miles so I imagine I'll be replacing it as well one of these days.

 

Just maybe yours will outlast my pump. I'm hoping to see someone make the 300k mark. 

I am not a "blame" type of person, really only judge cause/effect.  I see three trucks running same programing based on a thread based on this form all failing in a small window.  I am not taking trash on any tuner but come on guys, its not hard to draw a line of connection.  

 

I do believe one of the failures, Tyler's was linked to the increased rpm allowed by the v2 programming. Added rpm on anything mechanical whether designed for it or not ads more rotational stress.

7 minutes ago, NightHawk said:

I am not a "blame" type of person, really only judge cause/effect.  I see three trucks running same programing based on a thread based on this form all failing in a small window.  I am not taking trash on any tuner but come on guys, its not hard to draw a line of connection.  

 

I do believe one of the failures, Tyler's was linked to the increased rpm allowed by the v2 programming. Added rpm on anything mechanical whether designed for it or not ads more rotational stress.

If you actually assess what failed on the pumps it's impossible to make a correlation to the tuner. FYI @Me78569 and I were running the same tuning longer than anyone in here. His pump has more miles than mine and has yet to skip a beat. 

THE TUNING HAS NOT CHANGED!!!!! Literally instead of the tuning picking from a pre-programmed number, it picks from a user defined number. 

 

As for my failure... again, no. Maybe if I ran it at 3700 every day 20 times per day it could have been an issue?? That wasn't the case though. It saw over 3500rpm 20 times or so in its life. 

There are 4K boxes out there that people have been running for years with no issue.

There are other programmers out there (redline for one) that let rpms go much higher than the standard adrenaline can. People have been using those for years as well without pump issues. 

 

To sum it up, NO. There is no way the quad caused all 3 failures.

The likely reasons were

Moparman - end of service life

Trevor - AC noise (pump might not have been bad after all too.....)

Me - bad rebuild

Well i am glad to hear all the information about what makes the vp44 communicated to the ecm and what the quad does.  I am a supportive member of the v2 and all of the great folks on this form who have done some many things to make it what it is today.

 

SO try to think of someone new to the game like i initially did when i read the post. When we run these electronic dinos hard things can happen, simple risk factors.  I would definitely buy a v2 for what it offers but seeing i wont wire tap...its alot of money for what i already have in hand.

 

Remember all, this form is great for discussions..we dont want to become like others. 

 

Edited April 12, 20178 yr by NightHawk

7 hours ago, NightHawk said:

Well i am glad to hear all the information about what makes the vp44 communicated to the ecm and what the quad does.  I am a supportive member of the v2 and all of the great folks on this form who have done some many things to make it what it is today.

 

SO try to think of someone new to the game like i initially did when i read the post. When we run these electronic dinos hard things can happen, simple risk factors.  I would definitely buy a v2 for what it offers but seeing i wont wire tap...its alot of money for what i already have in hand.

 

Remember all, this form is great for discussions..we dont want to become like others. 

 

I'm in the same boat in that I do not want to mess with the electronics. I want to keep it simple, mostly original. And although half these guys would like to take my trucks away and put me back driving a buck board, I cannot help the way I think........I just don't trust electrical.

 

I know now I will be set up as a target from now on lol

@NightHawk

 

Don't take how I said it the wrong way, not blaming or yelling or whatever.  The only thing that I needed to make %100 clear is that the quadzilla it not doing anything new in terms of the roots of how our truck work.  I would never say that because it is flat out a lie.

 

The vp44 crowd has fallen victim to smoke and mirrors for way to long.  It is vastly important to me that people understand that nothing new is going on here from a communication standpoint, only the way the box gets its variables.  I don't want new guys to think that the quadzilla is somehow doing something new that no other box can do.  IE: the rumored 2nd injection event.   The only thing the quadzilla is doing is opening up the ability to choose the variables in the software.

 

There are absolutely risks in running something at and beyond the limits, but those risks are the same regardless of the tuner.

 

No voodoo magic going on here.

 

 

8 hours ago, TFaoro said:

Maybe if I ran it at 3700 every day 20 times per day it could have been an issue?? That wasn't the case though. It saw over 3500rpm 20 times or so in its life. 

 

 

 

RPM isn't an issue. Remember the VP44 turn at 1/2 the rate of the crank or the same speed as the cam. So 1600 RPM (3200 RPM stock) or 1850 RPM (3700 RPM high limit). Extra 250 RPM's to that pump is nothing. 

 

8 hours ago, TFaoro said:

FYI @Me78569 and I were running the same tuning longer than anyone in here.

Very true... Also keep in mind I ran the Edge Comp wire tapped for 11 years before hand. 

 

I will not and am not blaming Quadzilla for the failure of my VP44 and/or injectors. Period end of story.

Edited April 12, 20178 yr by Mopar1973Man

12 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

My method is to pull the 1,2,4 lines and leave 3,5,6 on the head. Being I'm going to do the tappet gasket I'm going to pull both. 

 

Similar to what I did but I removed from the head. Did not feel like fighting the line clamps.

@NightHawk the truck I replaced a vp on this past weekend was running an edge drag comp. Was on a reman pump. fwiw

37 minutes ago, jlbayes said:

Did not feel like fighting the line clamps.

 

Hua? I've never touched the line clamps once. Just loosen 1,2,4 and lift it off as a group. 3, 5, 6 comes off in a second group.

7 minutes ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

Hua? I've never touched the line clamps once. Just loosen 1,2,4 and lift it off as a group. 3, 5, 6 comes off in a second group.

That is how I did mine both times I took it off. Worked really well. 

It would not let me move them around. 

1,2,4 Injection lines

 

3,5,6 injection lines...

I know what ones you are talking about. Sounds like I may be doing another one here shortly.

I had the P0216 in my truck when I checked codes before purchased my 2000 Ram  in 2010. Mine was seized at minimum advance because of aluminum timing piston bore gauling which was apparently fixed in the new Bosch rebuilds. Caused a poor cold idle and lousy mileage. I am not sure how they fixed it but I they definitely identified the problem and improved things on the new one. Another big problem was the tiny circuit board in the pump. They used a soldering compound that broke down with engine heat and finally fixed that too in the new pumps. I have over 120Kmiles myself with no VP44 codes now.

Apparently Bosch was  using solder  + flux as a paste applied to bottom of cct board and melted the component leads to the board in a quick convection oven pass. This new procedure replaced wave soldering machines  but could not take continuous engine heat. I gather they have a better heat tolerant solder + flux compound that is more long term  heat tolerant that does not cause open circuits like the original stuff. This same problem could be in our ECM failures as the engine block gets quite hot? Wave soldering machines are now obsolete. The way TFaoro  remounted the ECM on the wheel well will make the ECM a lot cooler. Mighty impressive 64 page thread by Tfaoro on his rebuild - I learned a lot!

Edited April 13, 20178 yr by balsip