NV4500 finally died...

[IBMobile]

I'd pop the top of the case off and check it out.  If a bearing went out you'd think you would hear it grinding for a while before it took a dump.  Also if the input shaft (4th gear) bearing went bad and went to pieces it wouldn't mesh with the counter shaft properly and you'd lose 1ed and 2ed .  Could it be that the shift rail or sliding hub for 3/4 selection jammed up due to a broken synchro ring or dog? 

I've rebuilt a few 4 and 5 speed trans over the years and like the others have said it's not hard and it's not brain surgery.  If you take your time and pay attention to details with a few hand tools and a gear puller you'll be able to due it.   

[Haggar]

Michael,

 

I bought a brand new 4500 a couple years ago.  A company called High Gear LLC, bought all the left over GM NV4500s.  They put a dodge tail shaft on it, and boom new trans. (I had to use my shifter, as the new shifter was GM...) but has worked out well for me.  They were great to work with.   I don't see the new transmissions listed anymore.  Give them a call though.

 

I want to see pictures!!!!!  I was going to rebuild mine, but there were multiple teeth from third in the bottom of the case, so I bit the bullet.  

 

Hag

[Cowboy]

I'm with IBM, loosing 3rd and 4th screams shift rail issue.  If you're willing to pop the top and look, it may be something simple.

 

The fix to not wanting to drive your "first rebuild" is to do it on a friends truck...  

[Mopar1973Man]

5 minutes ago, Cowboy said:

The fix to not wanting to drive your "first rebuild" is to do it on a friends truck...  

 

That's funny... I was talking to @Taz he's coming Thursday for his ISSPro gauges I order him. He's made the comment "I better close my mouth now or we'll be doing 2 transmissions".

 

@IBMobile That makes sense being there is no grinding. Got all the other gears just 3rd and 4th are out.

 

Thanks guys you giving my the confidence to dive into this.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[Me78569]

Glad you are going to dive in.  I doubt there is anything in there you can't handle.

 

 

 

You know what caused this right?  

 

 

Your 2500 was jealous of the new dynamic trans in the 1500.  

[Mopar1973Man]

24 minutes ago, Me78569 said:

You know what caused this right?  

Your 2500 was jealous of the new dynamic trans in the 1500.  

 

At least I'll have fresh transmissions in both trucks now.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[Russ Roth]

Well that really stinks but I will agree with at least it was close to home.  I have had similar upsetting things happen and then I have thought about how much worse it could have been.  I would not be afraid to at least check out what may be wrong.  I have gone through a number of manual trannies over the years but not this new.  Mostly NP435's and at least one 540 along with a couple SM465's.  Those are fairly straight forward but not sure about these.  I have dealt numerous times with Six States PDX and they are really great here.  You KNOW you have spent too much money there when you walk in and they say hi using your first name.      That was a number of years ago when I was rebuilding my '67 W200 that Dad bought new.   

[KATOOM]

Sorry Mike.  I certainly hope its something simple and cheap.

[TFaoro]

6 hours ago, Mopar1973Man said:

 

That's funny... I was talking to @Taz he's coming Thursday for his ISSPro gauges I order him. He's made the comment "I better close my mouth now or we'll be doing 2 transmissions".

 

@IBMobile That makes sense being there is no grinding. Got all the other gears just 3rd and 4th are out.

 

Thanks guys you giving my the confidence to dive into this.

Knew I could get you to eventually!

 

On a side note, if you need any parts from my shifter, let me know.

[Mopar1973Man]

As for today I got the front and rear drive shafts out, the transfer case is out, slave cylinder is removed, and just got the 4 bolts holding the transmission in. My right knee is hurtin' so I quit early. I'm all setup for dropping the transmission. When the shift tower was removed I can see some in the inside I don't see any broken teeth on gears. The gear lube I drained out was darker than normal so there is sign of heat issues. No metal that I could see in the oil. I'll be ordering a transmission temp gauge for this one too.

 

 If my knee if feeling better in the morning I'll most likely get it dropped to the floor and popped open to see what happened. Other than that I'll wait till Friday and have @Taz drop it down with me.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[TFaoro]

Good to hear you didn't find any chunks. Out of curiosity, how many miles are on that oil change? It could be syncro material as well. Mine came out black when the syncros were dying, so we'll see when you get it apart  

[KATOOM]

No metal in the oil is a very good sign.

A temperature gauge is a great idea.  You can either use a 3/4" to 1/8" reducer at the fill plug or better yet get yourself some Fastcoolers when you put the new one in.  Good heat dissipation and they come with 1/8" ports.

[Mopar1973Man]

46 minutes ago, TFaoro said:

Out of curiosity, how many miles are on that oil change?

 

61k miles. So I'm going to say it could be syncro material darking up the oil but I'm thinking heat more so.

 

46 minutes ago, TFaoro said:

so we'll see when you get it apart  

 

That what I want to do is get it on the floor and opened up and inspect everything. Still got to see what happened with the 3rd / 4th gear issue I'm really curious if its a bearing or what.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Mopar1973Man

[dripley]

I put a temp gauge on my 5600 about a year ago. I have been meaning to find out what kind of temps are normal for a manual. Interesting to watch. I never knew how much heat you put in a tranny in overdrive.

 

Towng that is.

Edited April 20, 2016 by dripley

[TFaoro]

I don't know how the mainshaft would slide forward or backwards without causing every gear to misalign. Hopefully it's just in the top cover / shifter stuff

[Mopar1973Man]

2 minutes ago, dripley said:

I put a temp gauge on my 5600 about a year ago. I have been meaning to find out what kind of temps are normal for a manual. Interesting to watch. I never knew how much heat you put in a tranny in overdrive.

 

Yeah I've been learning about gear usage in the little 1996 Dodge Ram 1500. You find that the most efficient gear will produce way less heat in the transmission. 

 

Just now, TFaoro said:

I don't know how the mainshaft would slide forward or backwards without causing every gear to misalign. Hopefully it's just in the top cover / shifter stuff

 

Again I'm not sure what happen I'm just taking a educated guess at the failure and it behavior. I know there is Quad 4x4 for most of the parts on the NV4500. So that is one resource for parts.

[CSM]

My aluminum deep pan keeps temps pretty stable, I never see it move more than 20 degrees below coolant temp except in stop and go traffic.  I wonder what temps are "normal" in manuals and in our differentials. 

[KATOOM]

I installed a temp gauge on my 4500 (and differential) a few years ago.  Very interesting too.....

 

As for parts, wherever you look Mike just try to get whatever OEM parts you can.  I understand they're very hard to come by too but even Quad4x4 will tell you that most, if not all, parts they have for this transmission are made overseas.  And those parts are nowhere near as strong as the OEM parts.  Sad thats the only option.

Edited April 20, 2016 by KATOOM

[CSM]

7 minutes ago, KATOOM said:

I installed a temp gauge on my 4500 (and differential) a few years ago.  Very interesting too.....

 

What was the range of temps? 

[KATOOM]

Anywhere from 100* to 210* F depending on the the weather, terrain, speed, what gear I'm in, and what I'm towing.  But in all honesty I did blanket the 6 feet of exhaust which passes directly by the transmission and transfer case which offered even more reduction in transmission heat.

I've got it more detailed out if anyone cares.